Modesty in swimsuits

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St. Peter and the rest of the guys used to go fishing while naked. (“Lightly clad” is a euphemism.) Jewish modesty regulations forbade men to exercise naked like the pagans, but working naked as a fisherman was totally okay.

I am pretty sure that if you asked Padre Pio if it was okay to work naked, he would have said no. But if you had asked him about Peter, he would have said that of course it was fine.

Conditions change what is considered modest.

Btw, there were a fair number of hermits, male and female, who went naked in all weathers as a form of asceticism. Others went around in rags that covered less than a skimpy bikini. Some of them are known saints. So again, modesty changes according to conditions.
 
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MagdalenaRita said:
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Loud-living-dogma:
Driving while burka’d…how does she do it? 🤣
https://images.app.goo.gl/AumCfv4xDwNhgEgt7
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yes, and factory women working in dresses? hmm

Stitch in Time | Women Textile Workers in Central PA
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That is an exceptionally awful example to use to advocate working in a factory while wearing a dress. The injury rates were through the roof. Women frequently got skirts and sleeves caught in machinery and ended up maimed for life!
 
BartholomewB said:
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phil19034:
defining these terms for world wise usage, only within my argument.
  • Beautiful / handsome : attractive in a chaste way.
  • Sexy : attractive in an unchaste way.
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You’re starting off from a false premise. Those categories are not mutually exclusive. A woman can be:
• Beautiful but not sexy
• Sexy but not beautiful
• Both beautiful and sexy
• Neither beautiful nor sexy
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I said I was defining terms for my email in a way that was NOT universally accepted.

I was trying to make an abstract point, not declare an objective standard
 
phil19034 said:
However, if dressed in a sexy way, then she/he shares in the fault if another has sinful/lustful thoughts about her/him. I’m not going to say the fault is 50-50, but they do share in the fault if dressed in a sexy way
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She’s guilty of the sin of immodesty whether anyone lusts or not, though. She doesn’t take 20% of his sin or anything like that. Hence what we meant by the man taking full responsibility of his own sin.
MagdalenaRita said:
and to answer what about other clothing, yes, we should ask ourselves as women when we dress in the morning, will the way I dress cause another person to fall into sin.
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The problem with this is that this will always be a yes. There’s a porn category dedicated to women in hijabs. Foot fetishists. People who will go crazy anytime they see the female form.

A better question to ask would be ‘is what I’m wearing intended to seduce people’? What message are you trying to send off? A basic one piece swimsuit sends off a different message than a similar outfit at the mall.
 
While I think I can understand your general message, some women here has expressed that they used to get cat called whenever they dress nicely.

Point being that a woman can dress beautifully according to her standards and people will see this as her trying to seduce somebody as well. Hence why in certain Muslim counties, they’re not even allowed to wear colourful clothing!

Men can lust over someone simply because they’re attractive and not sexy.

Modesty shouldn’t only be based on lust, but the intentions of the person too
 
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Lea101 said:
She doesn’t take 20% of his sin or anything like that. Hence what we meant by the man taking full responsibility of his own sin.
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I know. I didn’t mean anything otherwise.

I was trying to address the heresy that claims that our actions are never responsible for another person’s sin
 
Lea101 said:
Point being that a woman can dress beautifully according to her standards and people will see this as her trying to seduce somebody as well.
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This is actually part of the issue. We no longer (at least in western society) have an objective view of what is beautiful but not sexy based on societal norms.

It seems like (in many places) women today only consider what other women think. I can personally think of multiple times when I (plus all the men and teen boys I was with) thought a particular outfit made a young lady look like a prostitute , while all the women strongly disagreed and thought the outfit was cute.

It often seems like in many situations, a lot of women do not value the opinion of men in this regard, even though men know how men think.

It’s something I fail to understand
 
Peace. By all means strive for mutual understanding with your mom.
Some suits are very immodest, like using translucent material.
Showing as little cleavage; and making sure the bottoms do not conform
to the ‘triangle’ anatomy approaching like they were ‘painted on,’ certainly
is a good idea.
Jason and Crystalina Evert give excellent talks on modest & chastity.
Once a young man posted here because he felt very uneasy around his girl friend because her swim suit was translucent and tight; and he struggled very much with impure thoughts with that much suggestive swim ware. We are all in this together; and need to help one another be true to our Beloved Redeemer and His Ways which bring true inner peace; to share with others.
Have a blessed evening.
 
today some misguided young lady showing a very suggestive photo of her top cleavage; I mean really suggestive; tried to ‘friend’ me on social media.
I replied:
“your offer of friendship is appreciated; but in the name of our Blessed Lord Jesus, I do not like suggestive photos. They effect many young and old alike who should not be tempted like that. Peace: inexpressible well being with God that surpasses all human understanding with growing inner harmony & joy overflowing from the heart;; with less and less inner restlessness, sometimes anesthetized by cares of this world or pleasure seeking or distractions that never fill the heart & mind — only become addictive, causing wants for prestige, or influence, or wealth or pleasure or celebrity or relationships that foster these things to over shadow our Benevolent Loving God who delivers from these things. Have a blessed evening.”
 
phil19034 said:
It seems like (in many places) women today only consider what other women think. I can personally think of multiple times when I (plus all the men and teen boys I was with) thought a particular outfit made a young lady look like a prostitute , while all the women strongly disagreed and thought the outfit was cute.
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While that’s true, the same can be said for the opposite. Didn’t someone said that she was solicited for sex because she was wearing business attire?

The beauty of the woman can be what “seduces” the man, and her outfit is mistakenly labelled as seductive. Hence why I said there are some women here who have been catcalled even when they dress modestly. Because they looked dressed up and pretty.
phil19034 said:
It often seems like in many situations, a lot of women do not value the opinion of men in this regard, even though men know how men think
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For me? Depends on who’s giving me these opinions. I actually trust a more liberal man in this matter because I find religious men in my life are always analysing women’s clothes and bodies.

I find that they always find something wrong with anything unless I dress like an old woman or if I wear something odd and frumpy, kind of like the swimsuits in the link someone else posted.
 
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Um, do any CAF members remember when female swimsuits had modesty panels? As recently as the early 1970s, American females who participated in competitive swimming wore one-piece bathing suits with modesty panels.
 
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Lea101 said:
Didn’t someone said that she was solicited for sex because she was wearing business attire?

The beauty of the woman can be what “seduces” the man, and her outfit is mistakenly labelled as seductive. Hence why I said there are some women here who have been catcalled even when they dress modestly. Because they looked dressed up and pretty.
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Honestly, knowing how men think, I don’t necessarily think that was due to her being beautiful.

While female business suits typically do not highlight sex appeal, a powerful female business suit can trigger some fetishes that a minority of men have.
Example:
  • a powerful women
  • legs
  • pencil skirts
  • low cut or open blouse
Some women have a similar fetish when they see a man in a power suit.

I can honestly say, I have NEVER heard a man say “wow, she’s so beautiful/pretty, I want to do ABC to her!”

It’s typically, “she so hot/sexy that I want to do ABC to her” or “wow look at those XYZ on her…”

I can also say that personally, I have never lusted after a woman strange woman I thought was beautiful or pretty. But I have (shamefully to admit) lusted after a strange woman who I thought was sexy and/hot.

Beautify & pretty women are the ones men want to introduce to their right away mother. Sexy & hot ones they typically do not.

And I can honestly say that the woman I married was one who I thought was beautiful & pretty the first time I met her and I didn’t lust after her after first laying eyes on her.
 
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phil19034 said:
I don’t necessarily think that was due to her being beautiful.
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I wouldn’t say it’s all due to her blessed genes. I look like God sneezed when he made me, yet I have received unpleasant attention when I was wearing a dress I wore to Christmas Mass!

I think it can be them thinking that the woman wants male attention if she is dressed up. A female poster here has shared her experiences in a winter coat!
phil19034 said:
a powerful female business suit can trigger some fetishes that a minority of men have.
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I do agree with this generally. But there’s nothing wrong with a woman wearing a business suit, obviously.
phil19034 said:
I can honestly say, I have NEVER heard a man say “wow, she’s so beautiful/pretty, I want to so XXX to her!”
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phil19034 said:
Beautify & pretty women are the ones men want to introduce to their right away mother. Sexy & hot ones they typically do not.
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It depends. Someone may be attracted to a beautiful woman, and then intentionally linger and dwell on thoughts which then leads to lust. One may be more inclined to lust over a model’s bare shoulders vs a conventionally unattractive woman’s shoulders. Because the beauty was what drew them in.

This is why sometimes I bring up the example of a bigger woman wearing a (one piece) swimsuit. Her body is usually not deemed as attractive to most men, and most men would not lust and think much of her. Insert Beyonce in the exact same suit and we have a riot.
 
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