C
- Status
P
peary
Guest
*Jesus Christ founded the Universal Church two thousand years ago. The small c in catholic means universal. There are many miracles that occur in the Catholic Church as well. I recently went to a healing service and witnessed several. Just because people are very Christian in other churches does not mean there is a problem with the Catholic Church being the one true Church. God loves us all. However, Jesus Christ did found the Catholic Church.
If I looked solely at teachings and apologetics, I might as well be a Catholic, but when I look at these people, I can’t really believe that the Catholic Church is superior to other churches, as it claims. I can’t believe that these people are not the church.
If these miracles are not due to God, who then? I can’t believe it’s the devil.
If I looked solely at teachings and apologetics, I might as well be a Catholic, but when I look at these people, I can’t really believe that the Catholic Church is superior to other churches, as it claims. I can’t believe that these people are not the church.
If these miracles are not due to God, who then? I can’t believe it’s the devil.
- CB*
D
DebChris
Guest
There is a Christian song (I wake to the CD) with the words which asks “When I come into your presence will I sing ‘Alleluia’ or in awe of you be still.” The Mass is a Eucharistic celebration, a time of thanksgiving. A time of rejoicing. We are a Resurrection people. This is not a denial of the cross or the price that was paid for our salvation. It is a recognition of the precious gift that we have been given. Satan has been defeated and death has been overcome. I will sing praise to my God at Mass and elsewhere. I will also bow in reverance at the consecration and when I approach the altar to receive the awesome gift that is the Body and Blood of my Lord. I will be silent when I sit before the Blessed Sacrament even as my heart wants to shout within me.
S
scottm
Guest
Protestant pastors do that also.
Indeed – we need more instruction from the ambo/pulpit/whatever-whatever on the Bible and the creeds and the 1900-years of Christian writing. More. Would that the St Louis parish with a priest who preaches was the norm in Catholic churches. Would that it was. But it’s a rarity. But preaching is the norm in so many, many Protestant churches. Witness Calvary Chapel. There’s an example that puts the Catholic Church, as a body, to shame. :crying:
When a priest can’t talk about God past 10 minutes, it’s time to find a new priest or jump ship to a church where the leaders will talk about God. It’s sufficient reason to leave. Done deal.
But amigo, you present a false choice: it never has to be either/or. Somehow Protestants across the denominations raise up pastors who do both. There is one and only one reason Catholic priests, as a group, do not do both: they don’t want to.
One would think that the leader who eats the blood and body of Christ would be eager to speak in public about Christ. One would think. But in real life the people who want to speak in public about Christ are not Catholics – except in St Louis. You are extremely blessed. I really envy you for your priests.
You’ll never know how well he knows God until you attend his church services. It’s wrong to live in fear of Protestants. It’s also wrong to mischaracterize what they’re doing. You don’t like it when non-Catholics mischaracterize what Catholics as a group do in their masses.
R
Ronald_E
Guest
Dear ScottM, I am computer illiterate so I don’t know how to use quotes. I was away from Catholicism for 40 years and never intended to return. I hated Christianity because of hypocrasy. When I started reading scripture I realized I did not hate Christianity all those years. I had actually hated Christians who were practicing a shadow of Our Lord’s teaching. I have seen many wonderful Protestant ministers and attended many services with the people on fire with the Holy Spirit. Something was always missing though. The Holy Spirit and miracles brought me back to Christ but His work was not yet finished. I had to be humbled even more. I was led to the Church He established and had to humble myself to His Church through confessing my sins against Him and His Church. 40 years of confession. I have always confessed to others what I had done wrong and I thought this would be no big deal. However, when I began to confess the first sin I confessed was that I had received Our Lord in Communion at my Catholic wedding in a state of mortal sin. You see at that time I did not believe in His Real Presence. Upon confessing this sin I began to cry with such pain and shame I thought I would never stop. To make 40 years of confessing brief at this time I will jump to absolution. My priest gave me absolution in english and in the next breath he gave it to me in Latin. I began to again cry to a depth of joy I had never experienced before. I knew this was directly from Our Lord. You see I was a child in the Latin Rite of the church and this was God’s message to me that I was now Home. Shame that I thought was not there was revealed to me and forgiven. This was Easter of 2005. Easter Sunday of 05 I received Jesus in Communion and cried again out of pure joy. He is Real in His Sacrament! He does speak of the spirit and not the flesh when He makes this point. The priest brings Him to me in the Spirit and no words from the priest in his sermons can give what the Eucharist gives me. I could say so much more. I have been blessed beyond anything I deserve. I pray that everyone receives this same blessing.
S
scottm
Guest
Aye, that’s it right there. That’s the ticket.
Apostolic succession is missing. In other words, they do not have the historic connection back to the dudes in the Book of Acts. It’s tangible. BUT — a great many Protestants are clearly, plainly, unquestionably lit by the Holy Spirit, and that makes up for the lack of apostolic succession. No one can say both that they’ve got the Holy Spirit and that God isn’t pleased with them. No one can have it both ways.
Back to the opening question – a great many Catholics are not lit up with the Holy Spirit, and THAT will always be a reason to not convert, and it’s to those Catholics’ shame. When the neighborhood Baptist/Calvary Chapel/Hope Chapel/Lutheran/whatever-whatever church is preaching the word of God, and the RC church is not, THAT is a reason to not convert. It always will be and 100% of the blame falls on the dead local RC church.
The Eucharist by itself is not a reason to be RC. You need more. Come on, the child molestors of a few years ago were eating the Eucharist seven days a week. I’ll take a Spirit-filled Baptist pastor without the Eucharist over those specific priests with the Eucharist, thank you very much!
There would not be an Calvary Chapels anywhere in America if the RC churches in those neighborhoods were doing what Calvary Chapel pastors do. There would not be Southern Baptist mega-churches if the RC churches in those neighborhoods were doing what the Southern Baptists are doing. Etc etc right down the line. Protestant churches exist because people are hungry for oral instruction in the Word of God, and RC priests too often refuse to give it. Hey, last week I met for an hour with my local monsignor. He flat out told me that priests in the county of Los Angeles are not going to preach. They will not do it. **THAT IS WHY PROTESTANT CHURCHES EXIST, and that is a God-pleasing sufficient reason for them to exist. **One-hundred percent of the blame falls on the RC Church. If and when the local RC parish is dead and the leaders don’t care that it’s dead, but the local Protestant church is lit up with the Holy Spirit, it’s time to be a Protestant. You gotta follow the Holy Spirit!!! There’s no choice in the matter.
T
tonyczerkawski
Guest
You can’t get any closer than the Church directly founded by God : "And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. ( Matt 16 :18)
Pope Benedict is part of the direct continuation of Saint Peter.
Other churches are just heresies of the Catholic Church.
Examples of Protestant churches:
Lutheran- Martin Luther in 1521.
Mennonites- Menno Simons in 1525.
Anglicans- King Henry VIII in 1533.
Presbyterians- John Calvin in 1550.
Baptist- John Smyth in 1609.
Methodist-John and Charles Wesley in 1729.
Episcopalians- Samuel Seaburyin 1789.
Church of Christ- Thomas Campbell in 1807
Seventh Day Adventists- Ellen White in 1860.
Salvation Army- William Booth in 1865.
Christian Scientist- Mary Baker in 1879
Pentecostal- Charles Fox in 1901
Fundamentalism- The Milton brothers and Lyman Steward in 1915
C
Contarini
Guest
In 1525 Menno Simons was a Catholic priest. He didn’t declare himself as an Anabaptist until the 1530s.
This is just one tiny example of what utter rot this list and all lists like it are. What do you think you are proving, anyway?
Edwin
M
Mannyfit75
Guest
It was 1531 he declared himself an Anabaptist. My friend got his dates all wrong.
T
tonyczerkawski
Guest
Ok… i’m sorry i was a couple of years of for Menno Simons. It dosen’t make any difference.
Secondly, what i am trying to prove is that all those other protestant churches are not a continuation of THE CHURCH institutionalized by JESUS CHRIST himself. Period.
J
jmcrae
Guest
That there is no form of Protestantism that corresponds to the marks of the Church that Christ founded in 33 AD.
You quibble about the fact that it was 1530, not 1525. It hardly matters - the point is, that it was not 33 AD, and therefore cannot be Christ’s Church.
T
tonyczerkawski
Guest
Good Point:thumbsup:That there is no form of Protestantism that corresponds to the marks of the Church that Christ founded in 33 AD.
You quibble about the fact that it was 1530, not 1525. It hardly matters - the point is, that it was not 33 AD, and therefore cannot be Christ’s Church.
Q
qui_est_ce
Guest
surely we are not that unique.
You know what, we support our priests. We hold them up, we cook dinners fon Wednesdays on a rotating basis for them. We had a rectory “shower” for them for much needed towels, sheets. etc. It was a lot of fun. You could see them, when they came in, all stiff, as they opened their “presents,” you could see their faces softening, to the point they were on the verge of tears.
Everytime they do something great (a lot) we thank them, either in person or by email.
There are many Catholics who speak out, Scott Hahn, Archbishop Burke. Look how they get treated by the media, but they don’t care, they just keep on.
St. Francis of Assissi said, “Preach often, use words when necessary.” Tele Evangelists should do this
Well, I’m pretty sure he wasn’t talking about the Real Presence, the need to go to Confession, or talking about the need to apply the latest Papal Encyclical to our lives. I am not in fear of Protestants, I was referring to a post that claimed Protestant preacher spend more time on sermons than Catholic priests do in a typical service.
Q
qui_est_ce
Guest
Isn’t confession great? I absolutely walk on air when I come out. I also think of the times I unworthily received the Eucharist in my youth, although I never doubted the RP. But, that’s been forgiven.
I LOVE testimonies. Thanks for sharing.
T
Teflon93
Guest
As an historian, Edwin, dates do matter, don’t they?
Isn’t the fundamentalist “Baptism of Blood” style claim to be the persecuted original Church just a complete and utter travesty?
We also keep asking for the precise date and name of the founder of the Catholic Church if it isn’t Jesus Christ in 33 A.D. or Peter shortly thereafter.
Thus far, no Pope has stepped forth to claim the credit. An odd occurrence, to be sure, given we know precisely when and by whom the various Protestant sects were founded.
P
peary
Guest
**Methinks the woman protests too much…Aye, that’s it right there. That’s the ticket.
Apostolic succession is missing. In other words, they do not have the historic connection back to the dudes in the Book of Acts. It’s tangible. BUT — a great many Protestants are clearly, plainly, unquestionably lit by the Holy Spirit, and that makes up for the lack of apostolic succession. No one can say both that they’ve got the Holy Spirit and that God isn’t pleased with them. No one can have it both ways.
Back to the opening question – a great many Catholics are not lit up with the Holy Spirit, and THAT will always be a reason to not convert, and it’s to those Catholics’ shame. When the neighborhood Baptist/Calvary Chapel/Hope Chapel/Lutheran/whatever-whatever church is preaching the word of God, and the RC church is not, THAT is a reason to not convert. It always will be and 100% of the blame falls on the dead local RC church.
The Eucharist by itself is not a reason to be RC. You need more. Come on, the child molestors of a few years ago were eating the Eucharist seven days a week. I’ll take a Spirit-filled Baptist pastor without the Eucharist over those specific priests with the Eucharist, thank you very much!
There would not be an Calvary Chapels anywhere in America if the RC churches in those neighborhoods were doing what Calvary Chapel pastors do. There would not be Southern Baptist mega-churches if the RC churches in those neighborhoods were doing what the Southern Baptists are doing. Etc etc right down the line. Protestant churches exist because people are hungry for oral instruction in the Word of God, and RC priests too often refuse to give it. Hey, last week I met for an hour with my local monsignor. He flat out told me that priests in the county of Los Angeles are not going to preach. They will not do it. **THAT IS WHY PROTESTANT CHURCHES EXIST, and that is a God-pleasing sufficient reason for them to exist. **One-hundred percent of the blame falls on the RC Church. If and when the local RC parish is dead and the leaders don’t care that it’s dead, but the local Protestant church is lit up with the Holy Spirit, it’s time to be a Protestant. You gotta follow the Holy Spirit!!! There’s no choice in the matter.
**
M
mgrfin
Guest
Yes, and there are many protestants, (baptists, anglicans, methodists, pentecostals, etc.) who are not also lit up with the Holy Spirit.Back to the opening question – a great many Catholics are not lit up with the Holy Spirit, and THAT will always be a reason to not convert, and it’s to those Catholics’ shame. When the neighborhood Baptist/Calvary Chapel/Hope Chapel/Lutheran/whatever-whatever church is preaching the word of God, and the RC church is not, THAT is a reason to not convert. It always will be and 100% of the blame falls on the dead local RC church.
The Eucharist by itself is not a reason to be RC. You need more. Come on, the child molestors of a few years ago were eating the Eucharist seven days a week. I’ll take a Spirit-filled Baptist pastor without the Eucharist over those specific priests with the Eucharist, thank you very much!
.
And, in OT times, there were many, many Israelites who did not keep the Law of God, and stoned the prophets who told them so.
Yes, there are priest abusers who communicate every day. That’s their duty still, and maybe they are struggling terribly. We hope we are always praying, but to say that we deserve the Eucharist is not fair, nor that we have it, given human nature, that we are sainted because of it.
You have to understand how grace works, in this fragile vessel we call our human nature.
So what is your point? We are human, we all don’t cooperate with the graces sent us?
To say you prefer being a good baptist without the Eucharist? Why fly into the face of God? The Eucharist was given to us for our salvation, for the salvation of the Church, and the salvation of the world. It not ours because we are already saved; we have lots of saving to do.
It’s a lot bigger than any of us. It is a difficult thing to get really appreciate what has been been given to us. Why beat up ourselves because of it, except to pray that we more fully understand it, and value it.
We have saints in our church who were so, and who are because of the Eucharist. We try to imitate them in their struggles to get to heaven.
peace
T
tundramom
Guest
R
Ronald_E
Guest
I hope you can see that it is the Spirit that led me to the Catholic church. What a Protestant may see is the physical expression of a person influenced by the Spirit and think that this is where the truth is. However, when Our Lord was speaking of himself as the bread of life He was speaking of the Spirit and not the flesh. Protestants seem to look for expressions of the Spirit through the flesh and unknowingly are attaching themselves to a human being who is on fire. After the resurrection Our Lord was glorified and He was walking with His apostles on the road to Emmaeus and they only recognized that He was on fire with the word but did not recognize Him to be Jesus. They only recognized Him as Jesus when He blessed the bread at the meal. Now before He ascended He breathed on His Apostles and gave them a new life with His breath. It is extremely important to realize that in that breath He passed Himself to them and gave them powers that they never had before. If you can go deeper into the Spirit you will see that every time they ordain another priest it is through touch and Christ is then passed to this priest through the power that Christ gave the apostles. This power to bring Christ into the Eucharist is stronger than any horrible sin a priest may commity because Our Lord will not let a person’s sin prevent us from receiving him in communion. There is so much more. What I noticed is that Scottm stated that communion is not enough. That tells me that you not yet ready to loosen up enough to begin to have the faith of a mustard seed. I now understand that what prevented me from opening enough was my hatred of authority. It seems in your words there is some hostility with authority. Sometimes we seek someone who will welcome us with passion and find a human being that fulfills that desire that was never met before in life. I found that passionate love in all the sacraments that Our Lord gave us. I love His priests for their devotion to our well-being and their sacrifice. I love them even if they do not look loving.
R
Ronald_E
Guest
I forgot to mention when I returned after 40 years away it was in the midst of child abuse revelations. That has nothing to do with our faith except that it can support existing hatred for our faith through the influence of evil.
- Status