New Study: Undocumented Immigrants Not Linked to Urban Crime

[blackforest]

Drug crimes, assaults, and murder are a very important aspect of ‘Urban Crime’ that they intentionally excluded.

They did not exclude them. For the third time, I’ll post the link to the study. https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/0735648X.2020.1819375

I cannot speak to the press release from from their employer, but the researchers themselves are up front and transparent about how they’re studying both violent crime and property crime. Those are the most relevant in peoples’ minds, and certainly what I researched before buying my house.

This research was completely manipulative in it’s design, to get headlines.

Their design involved gleaning cross-sectional data from FBI crime reports and obviously passed peer review. What about this methodology is “completely manipulative?”

 

[otjm]

So just for the record, Bishops are part of that large network called the Magisterium. What they say is to be taken seriously, not treated with any degree of flippant, (“lalalalalalala”), Cafeteria Catholicism.

There id a vast difference between a bishop speaking in line with the long line of social justice teaching (which is often referenced with starting in 1891 with Rerum Novarum) and making statements which betray an ignorance of practical, real world possible solutions.

If we need to fix immigration laws, then we need to have a discussion about immigration laws which needs to be attached to reality. Given that we now have an average of somewhere between 900,000 and 1,000,000 people immigrating legally to the US each year, it is not as if we have no one coming in legally. I understand that there is a significant part of the world which is in abject poverty, some of which I have seen first-hand; tbuth the US can no more cure these issues than they can world peace. And when bishops speak openly of supporting violations of immigration laws, or speak as if open borders is perfectly fine, sorry -lalalalalal.

During part of his Delano Grape Strike I was in a union as I was working my way through college.

And Huerta and I disagree that Chavez was fine with illegal immigration.

My take on unions is that we have unions because we have stupid management. The most important asset a business has is its employees, and one only has to look at the history of unionization to see what drove it.

Since the establishment of unions, there has been in general a balancing between labor and management. In general, because there have been times where unions have “ruled the roost” and times where they have not. And while I cannot speak to unions nation-wide, it seems that at least three seem to be able to negotiate without having to strike - pluming, pipe fitters, and electricians, and all three have strong programs to train and upgrade workers’ skills.

 

[MarkoB0726]

You probably shouldn’t believe everything you read…especially in this day and age.

 

[blackforest]

And when bishops speak openly of supporting violations of immigration laws, or speak as if open borders is perfectly fine, sorry -lalalalalal.

The Bishops are building on a long line of Catholic teaching stemming from Scripture, reason, and tradition. I submit to their teachings, not those of random, online strangers with personal opinions. Finally, where do these Bishops say that “open borders are perfectly fine?”

 

[otjm]

The Bishops are building on a long line of Catholic teaching stemming from Scripture, reason, and tradition.

One of the matters of a

long line of Catholic teaching stemming from Scripture, reason, and tradition.

is that the laws of the country are to be obeyed; and the US has laws of how one may migrate legally to the US.

Perhaps you need to read more bishops and their statements. “Perfectly fine” is not the exact working of their statements but any number of bishops hve made it quite clear they support open borders, at least to the extent that it applies to those south of the border. And I do not have to go back as far as Cardinal Bernardin to find them.

 

[blackforest]

is that the laws of the country are to be obeyed; and the US has laws of how one may migrate legally to the US.

This explains why the Bishops are seeking to change the law in order to enable a swift, fair immigration process and uphold Catholic Social Teaching.

Perhaps you need to read more bishops and their statements.

Perhaps you need to be posting these statements to support your accusation.

 

[Odilon]

This explains why the Bishops are seeking to change the law in order to enable a swift, fair immigration process and uphold Catholic Social Teaching.

How many people do the Bishop’s want the government to let in yearly? How many people do you want to let in yearly? Please give me a number.

We already let more foreigners into the nation legally than any other place on this earth. We have an unheard of lottery system that allows people in regardless of their station in life and whether or not they will be an asset to the nation. Good heavens, we allow old people in who immediately get onto the Social Security and Medicare rolls who have never paid a dime into the system, plus we allow disabled people into the country who are immediately eligible for SSDI (Social Security Disability Insurance), once again without ever having paid into the system.

With our massive debt load we cannot continue to do those sort of things and give the people already here a decent life which they as tax paying citizens are entitled to.

 

[Joegrane]

" by and large, reputable newspapers only print as news that which is verifiable."

That’s worse than a pile of manure. The “news” is full of deceptive spin and propaganda.

There are many “studies” that were designed to deceive. A long-time editor of the NE Journal of Medicine warned about that many year ago. We have been seeing so much of that deception in COVID studies, especially the very deceptive and even fraudulent studies of hydroxycloroquine.

Better security at the border will make it more difficult for smugglers of drugs, weapons. sex trafficking,

 

[Theo520]

Why would one need to do a study using model projections when they could just rely on hard data from the FBI

Crimes by Illegal Immigrants Widespread Across U.S.—Sanctuaries Shouldn’t Shield Them | The Heritage Foundation

Non-citizens accounted for 24 percent of all federal drug arrests, 25 percent of all federal property arrests, and 28 percent of all federal fraud arrests.

 

[blackforest]

How many people do the Bishop’s want the government to let in yearly? How many people do you want to let in yearly? Please give me a number.

As many as are qualified. I don’t set a number on that any more than I do the number of children allowed to be born in this country.

Why do you ask? What’s your Magic Number?

We already let more foreigners into the nation legally than any other place on this earth.

Where did you find your data on this?

Why would one need to do a study using model projections when they could just rely on hard data from the FBI

This is an interesting response from somebody who first claimed that the crime-immigration link is “irrelevant” to the discussion on immigration. But since you’re willing to indulge this line of the topic, I would - yet again - encourage you to read the
actual study I’ve been referencing rather than just scramble to find links in hopes of contradicting its conclusions. (There’s a staggering amount of confirmation bias in this thread . . . ) You’ll be delightfully surprised to see that the study authors also compiled FBI data and cross referenced it with other primary sources.

 

[Theo520]

This is an interesting response from somebody who first claimed that the crime-immigration link is “irrelevant” to the discussion on immigration.

I clearly stated my main issue with illegal immigration is the economic impact. I’m against it even if they were all good actors expressly because they take jobs away from citizens who are less desirable to hire by low skill employers. This shouldn’t confuse you if you re read my posts.

Now regarding crime, soon I hope to go back and dig deep into the ‘research study’ you linked, but I find it dubious that it can credibly refute the hard facts of our crime statistics. I provided supported info that illegal immigrants are indeed Linked to Crime. When I have time, I’ll figure out how they adjusted their model assumptions to explain away what the actual facts show to be true.

 

[Odilon]

Why do you ask? What’s your Magic Number?

Half of what it is right now. Actually, I would like to see a moratorium on legal immigration for a while so we could reflect on how all this immigration is affecting the country and because so many people are entering our nation illegally.

Where did you find your data on this?

U.S. News and World Report reported on this on Dec. 18, 2019. We are listed as number one in the world for legal immigration with some 1,127, 200 persons allowed permanent residency in 2017. (I doubt things have changed much since then). Germany was 2nd in the world with 820,000.

 

[blackforest]

Now regarding crime, soon I hope to go back and dig deep into the ‘research study’ you linked,

On second thought, it may not be worth the trouble since you’ve already formed opinion before reading it.

Half of what it is right now. Actually, I would like to see a moratorium on legal immigration for a while so we could reflect on how all this immigration is affecting the country and because so many people are entering our nation illegally.

I’m relieved to know that my Church does not share your view on this.

U.S. News and World Report reported on this on Dec. 18, 2019. We are listed as number one in the world for legal immigration with some 1,127, 200 persons allowed permanent residency in 2017. (I doubt things have changed much since then). Germany was 2nd in the world with 820,000.

There may be a lot of immigrants getting in, but I’m not sure that anybody is “letting” them in, to use your words.

 

[Odilon]

There may be a lot of immigrants getting in, but I’m not sure that anybody is “letting” them in, to use your words.

Where did I say in the two paragraphs you quoted the words “letting them in?”

 

[OKComputer]

The right really beats this drum-that undocumented immigrants are a detriment to our society, but in reality, they do the jobs that Americans are usually too lazy to do. Or worse, many Americans think they are “too good” to work in the jobs that immigrants usually do. I’m glad our church understands the human need to provide for your family and make a better life. This is yet another reason why I’m a democrat.

 

[Odilon]

I’m relieved to know that my Church does not share your view on this.

So over one million people is not enough? What is your number? 3 million? 5 million? 10 million? How many people can the country absorb without affecting our quality of life in areas such as the schools, medical facilities, and the numerous government entitlements that people already here need?

 

[Odilon]

Easy for the church to say when they are not paying the bill. I will agree that many illegals are hard workers, but you just brush away all the problems that come with them. Overcrowded schools, overcrowded medical facilities, and overcrowded prisons to name a few things. Yeah, we know how Democrats operate - they come up with some idea and then want everyone else to pay for it. “We love illegal immigrants” they say, but never personally lift a hand to help them.

 

[OKComputer]

Easy for the church to say when they are not paying the bill.

That’s a good point, and I agree with you on that one. It’s also true that the majority of “undocumented” immigrants are Catholics, and the church wants to consolidate their support in Hispanic communities. So I agree with you on that one.

 

[blackforest]

Where did I say in the two paragraphs you quoted the words “letting them in?”

Here:

We already let more foreigners into the nation legally than any other place on this earth.

So over one million people is not enough? What is your number? 3 million? 5 million? 10 million? How many people can the country absorb without affecting our quality of life in areas such as the schools, medical facilities, and the numerous government entitlements that people already here need?

Pretend that in the above paragraph, you’re the Chinese government talking about new babies being born. Perhaps that will elucidate how I don’t share your utilitarian view of humanity.

Easy for the church to say when they are not paying the bill.

The Church does foot the bill. Catholic Charities alone assists thousands of immigrants yearly, both documented and undocumented. We Catholics also “foot the bill” for the poor, the homeless, the unborn and their mothers, refugees, the disabled, the elderly, etc. What you call “footing the bill” the Church would call living the Gospel.

 

[Odilon]

We already let more foreigners into the nation legally than any other place on this earth.

Okay there it is and I stand by that statement. “We already let more foreigners into…” “We”, meaning “our nation”, as the laws that are now on the books dictate. I see no contradiction or problem there.

Pretend that in the above paragraph, you’re the Chinese government talking about new babies being born. Perhaps that will elucidate how I don’t share your utilitarian view of humanity.

Somehow you don’t seem to mind when an innocent citizen or legal immigrant is murdered, raped, or otherwise assaulted by someone who should not be in the country. Those innocents are just collateral damage in the bigger scheme of things and need to be accepted by the public at large. It’s the greatest good for the greatest number overall (illegal entrants), right?

The Church does foot the bill. Catholic Charities alone assists thousands of immigrants yearly, both documented and undocumented. We Catholics also “foot the bill” for the poor, the homeless, the unborn and their mothers, refugees, the disabled, the elderly, etc. What you call “footing the bill” the Church would call living the Gospel.

While the Church does indeed contribute mightily to helping these people who are in desperate situations, it does not pay for everything. When people who are here illegally show up at the hospital for treatment all of society pays, and when they commit crimes and go to prison all of society pays - so don’t try to tell me the taxpayer is not ever dragged into this. . . .