New York dead last in ‘economic outlook,’ citizens fleeing

[Theo520]

In fact, by objective standards of economic growth, New York ranks right in the middle at #25:

Economic Outlook is not a simple measure of GDP, it is trying to be predictive. I will agree there is ample room to criticize such models. It’s not easy to account for migration of citizens nor the impact of high taxes, but it is relevant data to study.

The empirical evidence and analysis in this edition of Rich States, Poor States illustrate which policies encourage greater economic opportunity and which are obstacles to growth.

 

[LeafByNiggle]

LeafByNiggle:

In fact, by objective standards of economic growth, New York ranks right in the middle at #25:

Economic Outlook is not a simple measure of GDP, it is trying to be predictive. I will agree there is ample room to criticize such models. It’s not easy to account for migration of citizens nor the impact of high taxes, but it is relevant data to study.

Yes, it is relevant to study it. But we should look at who is studying it and what their agenda is and how they express that agenda in their analysis.

 

[Theo520]

Yes, it is relevant to study it. But we should look at who is studying it and what their agenda is and how they express that agenda in their analysis.

Of course, this is a conservative group using data to justify lower taxes. Though they have a bias, it doesn’t mean their data and analysis is fudged or without merit.

 

[vz71]

So are all the people leaving California and new York taking their liberal values with them?

I can see a scenario where liberal causes wreak havoc on the economy, the people flee and start over again with the same policies elsewhere.

 

[Cathoholic]

LeafByNiggle changing my premise again . . .

Homelessness is not a simple consequence of economic outlook either. So many you are changing the premise.???

I never said it was a “consequence”.

I was implying the reality of what we can all see, corresponds with the economic outlook.

Not with USA Today’s “growth” figure which is a function of Massive corporations.

And I stand by that.

 

[Cathoholic]

vz71 . . .

I can see a scenario where liberal causes wreak havoc on the economy, the people flee and start over again with the same policies elsewhere.

Great point.

That’s already happenning unfortunately.

New Hampshire is getting politically destroyed by Boston people fleeing to there (and taking their leftist politics with them). Texas the same from California (Oregon has already been destroyed). Florida likewise from New York.

Not always (I know someone who fled New York to Idaho who is now a Trump supporter). But all too frequently.

 

[LeafByNiggle]

LeafByNiggle:

Yes, it is relevant to study it. But we should look at who is studying it and what their agenda is and how they express that agenda in their analysis.

Of course, this is a conservative group using data to justify lower taxes. Though they have a bias, it doesn’t mean their data and analysis is fudged or without merit.

Good point. So I actually downloaded the 57-page report in question and looked at that analysis. I see now how it was done. They took each state and rated it based on 15 different categories. They points given in each category were based on how well that state did in that category. And what are those categories? The read like a textbook of conservative values: Top marginal income tax rate, Top marginal corporate tax rate, property tax burden, sales tax burden, Public employees per 10,000 population, State minimum wage, Right to work state, Number of tax expenditure limits. But they never even attempted to justify why those categories are the ones that best describe economic outlook. It is just taken as an ideological assumption that they are. So it looks like what is really true is that New York ranks dead last in conforming to a conservative’s idea of what a good state should be. Well, that’s no surprise. We always knew New York was liberal. So tell us something new!

I want to thank you for encouraging me to look beyond the mere fact that this was being reported by a biased organization and examine the analysis behind their report. Otherwise I never would have realized how paper thin their claims are.

 

[Theo520]

I want to thank you for encouraging me to look beyond the mere fact that this was being reported by a biased organization and examine the analysis behind their report. Otherwise I never would realized how paper thin their claims are.

Yes, just like the climate models, the devil is in the assumption

 

[Ridgerunner]

How disastrous would it be if New York was “dead last” (what a tone deaf headline too). They are the second highest payer of federal tax after California.

They’ll still have to pay federal income tax in Florida.

 

[RidgeSprinter]

So are all the people leaving California and new York taking their liberal values with them?

And turning Red States into Blue States? How Frightening.

 

[vz71]

And turning Red States into Blue States? How Frightening.

I don’t much care what color they are, I am more concerned with propagating bad policies.

They need to remember that there is a good reason they left and not bring it about in another state.

 

[Maxirad]

Check out this upsetting commentary from a NYC comedy club owner:

New York City is dead forever

People say, “NYC has been through worse” or “NYC has always come back.” This time it’s different.

nypost.com

Also check out some interesting stuff that Joel Kotkin says in this video:

 

[Peeps]

And Republicans say nothing.

They’re afraid they will be labelled “racist.”

That can destroy your political career, and possibly any other career that you might try, as well as put you “out” in various social organizations, community groups, and even some churches.

The only thing worse is being labelled “sex offender.” You may as well just dig a hole and wait to die if you get that one stamped on you.

 

[Peeps]

The ultimate collapse of Rome took place not because of the Goth invasions, it took place because of the implosion in tax revenues that occurred when enough land holders walked away in lieu of paying ruinous tax rates. Today, people are already selling out of IL at a loss in order to get out of that state. Probably happening in NJ and starting to happen in NY. What happens when that trend accelerates? The progressives have only one answer: tax more!

Rome’s fall was due to malaria more than anything. See The Mosquito: A Human History of Our Deadliest Predator by Timothy C. Winegard. It will make you itch!

But I agree with you about the high taxes in Illinois (where I live) and New York (where my daughter lived for 7 years and just moved out three weeks ago).

In Illinois this November, we will vote for or against a “wealth tax” which will only affect those who make $250,000.00 or more. (Most doctors make more than that–really good idea, taxing doctors right now as they battle the COVID virus! ). That’s really not that much of a salary, especially when you owe hundreds of thousands of dollars in student loans.

The problem is, Illinois Democrats want to raise the taxes without cutting expenses! To me, that’s like a family with two or more good wage-earners that is in trouble financially–and they deal with it by all finding second and third jobs instead of cutting the “fat” in their family budget!

When will they ever learn? (In Illinois, hopefully we will learn when Speaker of the House Michael Madigan is gone–he’s been in office for almost 40 years, he’s in his seventies–that means about 40 years to go, although I fully expect him to live to be at least 120.

 

[ProVobis]

Illinois Democrats want to raise the taxes

Yet it was the Republican Ogilvie who started the income tax and the Republican Thompson who raised taxes to keep the White Sox from moving to Florida.

 

[JonNC]

They’re afraid they will be labelled “racist.”

They have to get over that. We see the real racism in the local governments that allow police incidents too often, allow black and brown neighborhoods to be burned and looted, and allow gangs victimize these neighborhoods over and over again.

That can destroy your political career, and possibly any other career that you might try, as well as put you “out” in various social organizations, community groups, and even some churches.

That has been going on for decades. They did it to Reagan (one poster here still does ), they did it to Dole, both Bush’s, McCain and Romney. They did it to Nixon, who MLK himself praised for his civil rights efforts.
It’s time to fight back and stop letting them get away with it.

 

[Peeps]

That has been going on for decades. They did it to Reagan (one poster here still does ), they did it to Dole, both Bush’s, McCain and Romney. They did it to Nixon, who MLK himself praised for his civil rights efforts.
It’s time to fight back and stop letting them get away with it.

You know, it’s hard to do that. Most workplaces forbid political discussions and no one wants to get fired. It’s just plain dangerous for people who disagree to talk politics in a public setting (restaurant/park), as things can escalate to violence. Schools–that’s a good one! Most schools forbid any disagreement with their very liberal agenda. Churches–well, most people want to keep church for peaceful worship only, and anyone who brings up politics is promptly shushed, often by the clergy.

You can write letters to the editor, but no one reads the paper anymore.

You can get involved in various public rallies and demos–but in all likelihood, everyone at your rally already agrees with you. And if you attend a rally of those who disagree with you, you’re literally taking a chance with your safety and possibly life.

Besides, some rallies are just plain stupid–a small group (from a theologically-liberal Protestant church) in a small town near us (population around 2000) held an anti-racism rally this weekend to protest the injustice done in Minneapolis against George Floyd–I know, it’s been how many weeks, and this small town is just now doing something! Anyway, the organizer said that they were trying to decide what action they should take–and…it’s just too funny…they decided to ring the town bell (looks kind of like a mini-liberty bell) for 8 minutes 40 seconds. Yeah, that really stopped racism!

Funny–I would have contacted the half dozen or so African Americans who live in that town, invited them to a dinner meeting, apologize to them for not being more friendly in the past, and asked them to please share (with no interruptions from the listeners) their experiences with racism in the town, and what they would like to see happen to stop racism and make the town more welcoming and inclusive.

But I guess ringing a bell is more effective than discussion and inclusive activities and actions.

 

[Peeps]

What fat do you recommend cutting exactly?

Just one example cited below–there are many more if you check out the various Republican state representative and state senator sites.

And of course, the mastodon in the room (or state) is the desperate need to amend the Illinois State Constitution to fix the pension system (for state workers)–this is the source of much of the financial disaster for many of the cities and towns in Illinois. There are cities in which every penny of the property taxes is sent to Springfield to fund pensions for state workers, so the city’s needs (police, fire, etc.) have to be privately contracted–or, as happens in many cities and towns, nothing or little gets done to make needed reforms.

Until this happens, Illinois is currently in very bad financial trouble, and my husband and I, along with all the other stubborn Illinoisians, are obviously demented to remain in the Prairie State when right next door to us are several states in good shape financially.

https://johncabello.org/2020/07/16/state-rep-cabello-attends-white-house-event-on-regulatory-reform/

 

[Peeps]

Until this happens, Illinois is currently in very bad financial trouble, and my husband and I, along with all the other stubborn Illinoisians, are obviously demented to remain in the Prairie State when right next door to us are several states in good shape financially.

And just in case you missed it–my daughter had the good sense to move OUT of New York City to a state that is ranked 18th on that list. I guess even though her parents are addled, she is in her right mind.

 

[Zzyzx_Road]

The short, short version: because many people are unable to have any kind of discussion with the progressives running their cities/states without fearing for their livelihoods, they’re going to vote with their feet. As they have been doing in IL, NY, NJ and CA, among others.