Nicolas Coppola, gay catholic who married, is banned from church duties, was this right?

[stlcatholic86]

Homosexuality, in and of itself is disordered and sinful. One who practices this vice is in a state of mortal sin and commits sacrilage if receiving Holy Communion. Therefore, one in a state of mortal sin cannot speak for the Church as lector, CCD teacher or as one who takes the Body of Our Lord to the sick. To touch the Body of Our Lord with defiled hands is another sacrilage in itself. Any pastor who has knowlege of this situation and does not take action, is remiss in his duty. One has only to observe the destruction that homosexuality has done to the Church to see that tolerance of this sickness must not occur in any form and to curtail any practicing homosexual’s participation in the offices of the Church is merely wise practice.
The death penalty has no parellel or relationship to abortion or homosexuality. One is the murder of the innocent and the other is the protection of society against predators. Homosexuality is merely a disgusting perversion that is against the law of God. Neither abortion nor homosexuality should be advocated nor tolerated.

Actually no homosexuality according to the church is only “dis-ordered” not sinful. Only thing that is a sin is the sexual act, much like any outside of marriage. Thus one who is openly gay but celibate can receive the Eucharist and serve as a leader in the church as this would not preclude them as long as they were celibate. At least this is my understanding of the churches position on homosexuality.

 

[Lapey]

I disagree abortion and the death penalty are moral equivalents and to try to justify they aren’t makes zero sense.

Abortion = intrinsic evil, never acceptible

The death penaly is not on the same level, however, I do agree that in most lands and countries there are absolutly no occassions where the death penalty is needed. We have the means to safely keep dangerous people until natural death, saving money is no reason to take a life. Life is Life, we should protect all.

 

[Frank_Drebin]

In absence of repentence and rejection of same sex sexual activity and same sex “marriage”, which seems to be the case, absolutely he is to be removed from parish leadership and catechetical positions.

The disturbing part is that the pastor has apparently been looking the other way indefinitely and is trying to blame the bishop. The pastor was clearly not doing his job.

Priests and Bishops need to not look the other when someone is abusing a minor, and they should not look the other way when someone is abusing Christ and the Church.

 

[Frank_Drebin]

You have to love the convictions of a person who seems a letter complaining about gays to the Bishop annoynomously. It’s a shame he’s being kept out of leadership roles of the church.

You deem it intolerant. The Church does not.

Mind telling us which Church’s laws are not unjust, or are bendable? If it easier, just list the things you disagree with, and we’ll assume it is them.

You are welcome to your opinion, but not to alter reality. When you found a Church and become the Son of God made man, feel free to loosen whatever restrictions you want.

 

[Frank_Drebin]

I suppose I will put it simple the Catholic teaching on homosexuality is cruel. Those aren’t my words but rather a Priest in the church. I agree with that assessment.

Comparing this to abortion, or other church doctrines just doesn’t have the same equivelant. I also really hate that we relegate the issue to abortion, because its not about abortion it’s about life. Hence why as Catholics we should be just as morally opposed to abortion as we are the death penalty unfortunately we don’t remark as much on the subject of the death penalty as we do on abortion.

When the number of people killed by the death penalty is even within a million of the number killed by abortion, you’ll have a point.

 

[hosemonkey]

Actually no homosexuality according to the church is only “dis-ordered” not sinful. Only thing that is a sin is the sexual act, much like any outside of marriage. Thus one who is openly gay but celibate can receive the Eucharist and serve as a leader in the church as this would not preclude them as long as they were celibate. At least this is my understanding of the churches position on homosexuality.

Agreed, but two homosexuals who “marry” are a different kettle of fish. Do you honestly believe that those homosexuals who attempt marriage do not practice homosexual acts? As do most homosexuals who merely “hook up”? One would be naive to think so.

 

[anruari]

Right because to be a “true” Catholic is to obey and not question.

Oh. there’s plenty of scope to question. but there is a hierarchy of teachings.
Dogma cannot be questioned it deals with infallibly defined teachings.
Doctrine deals with broader areas of faith and morals. it represents the official teaching of the church on a range of matters. unless these have been elevated to Dogma they remain open to some level of debate.

The church does teach about the Primacy of Personal Conscience - but that is subordinated to the conscience being properly educated in the teachings of the Church.

Any area of faith or morals which is clearly set out in the Gospel is Revealed Truth and is morally binding.
Much of the Catholic teaching on Sexuality falls into this category. this includes the Prohibition on Fornication and Adultery, including a prohibition on acting on same sex attraction.
This includes the definition of marriage being between one man and one woman.

To deny these teachings is to deny the Infallibility of Scripture, and the authority of the Church to Bind and Loose.

All that said… the Church is a Hospital for Sinners, not a Hotel for Saints… She is not going to anathematize you just because you don’t understand or accept what she is trying to teach you. That is why we are here having this discussion.

Our church had been derelict in her duty to educate the faithful. We are all called to take part in correcting that and being part of the New Evangelisation.

 

[Lapey]

Actually no homosexuality according to the church is only “dis-ordered” not sinful. Only thing that is a sin is the sexual act, much like any outside of marriage. Thus one who is openly gay but celibate can receive the Eucharist and serve as a leader in the church as this would not preclude them as long as they were celibate. At least this is my understanding of the churches position on homosexuality.

This is correct, celibate and living by church guidelines. Publically proclaiming homosexuality will probably get a person in a position of not being used for ministry much less leadership. As a lay person they may have a chance at serving if there is no public scandal; priest or deacon who publically announces this? They will be stripped of their faculties by their bishop as soon as their mouth is closed; and rightfully so.

We had a priest here who decided to write a letter to his parishioners to tell them he was homosexual, celibate but homosexual. Bishop told him not to do it but he didn’t listen and sent it anyway. He was removed as soon as he sent it out and has been laicized and is now seeking ordination in the Episcopal Church.

Our actions have consequences, in this world and the next.

 

[Francoist]

We will never agree about the Catholic Church on the teaching of homosexuality. I’m sure people will suggest that I am not a true Catholic, but I disagree. Yes, I am openly gay man who accepts the Eucharist.

You said in another thread that you lead a homosexual life and want the right to marry another man. So when you receive the Eucharist you are committing the mortal sin of sacrilege and are offending and injuring Jesus Christ.

 

[Thinker55]

Hello all. New guy here. I will be posting an intro soon.

I just went through RCIA and was told that the Church is 100% against the death penalty. We were told it takes away the chance of the condemned to confess their sins. Is this the correct view from the Chruch?

 

[Em_in_FL]

Hello all. New guy here. I will be posting an intro soon.

I just went through RCIA and was told that the Church is 100% against the death penalty. We were told it takes away the chance of the condemned to confess their sins. Is this the correct view from the Chruch?

Catechism:

2267 Assuming that the guilty party’s identity and responsibility have been fully determined, the traditional teaching of the Church does not exclude recourse to the death penalty, if this is the only possible way of effectively defending human lives against the unjust aggressor. (2306)
If, however, non-lethal means are sufficient to defend and protect people’s safety from the aggressor, authority will limit itself to such means, as these are more in keeping with the concrete conditions of the common good and more in conformity with the dignity of the human person.
Today, in fact, as a consequence of the possibilities which the state has for effectively preventing crime, by rendering one who has committed an offense incapable of doing harm—without definitively taking away from him the possibility of redeeming himself—the cases in which the execution of the offender is an absolute necessity “are very rare, if not practically non-existent.”

 

[Hovannes]

If leading by example is whats needed in church leadership, Nicolas Coppola isn’t doing that. Therefore he should not be in a church leadership role since he rejects the Church’s teaching.

 

[estesbob]

Right because to be a “true” Catholic is to obey and not question. Ty.

No-its to obey and seek to understand.

 

[Frank_Drebin]

You said in another thread that you lead a homosexual life and want the right to marry another man. So when you receive the Eucharist you are committing the mortal sin of sacrilege and are offending and injuring Jesus Christ.

And by willfully and knowingly doing so, risking eternity in Hell. The Church is quite clear on the conditions of Hell, but will not obviously say who is there, This isn’t a case of being ignorant of the moral law in question, but ignoring it. The most dangerous thing a person can do on earth is to knowingly risk eternity in Hell.

 

[estesbob]

Hello all. New guy here. I will be posting an intro soon.

I just went through RCIA and was told that the Church is 100% against the death penalty. We were told it takes away the chance of the condemned to confess their sins. Is this the correct view from the Chruch?

That is not correct. For the Church to be 100% against the Death Penalty they would have to overturn 2,000 of teachings and tradition. The Church believes that in most countries it should be rare or not existent at all BUT it still allows for its use.

 

[Thinker55]

Catechism:

Right, so it’s against it in developed countries with an adequate prison system. Lock up for life.

 

[stlcatholic86]

This is correct, celibate and living by church guidelines. Publically proclaiming homosexuality will probably get a person in a position of not being used for ministry much less leadership. As a lay person they may have a chance at serving if there is no public scandal; priest or deacon who publically announces this? They will be stripped of their faculties by their bishop as soon as their mouth is closed; and rightfully so.

We had a priest here who decided to write a letter to his parishioners to tell them he was homosexual, celibate but homosexual. Bishop told him not to do it but he didn’t listen and sent it anyway. He was removed as soon as he sent it out and has been laicized and is now seeking ordination in the Episcopal Church.

Our actions have consequences, in this world and the next.

Wow I really feel sorry for that Priest he only sought to tell people the truth. He was doing nothing morally wrong in the Catholic Church. In fact, that Bishop was encouraging sin by basically telling that Preist to lie? No?

 

[estesbob]

Wow I really feel sorry for that Priest he only sought to tell people the truth. He was doing nothing morally wrong in the Catholic Church. In fact, that Bishop was encouraging sin by basically telling that Preist to lie? No?

So you believe Mr Coppola was getting married but was going to remain celibate?

 

[Frank_Drebin]

Wow I really feel sorry for that Priest he only sought to tell people the truth. He was doing nothing morally wrong in the Catholic Church. In fact, that Bishop was encouraging sin by basically telling that Preist to lie? No?

He did not tell him to lie. He told him to not publically announce his sexual orientation. What was the point, other than to say “look at me.” I have yet yo hear a Priest announce from the pulpit that he likes brunettes. It has no place on his wisdom from the Gospel.

One of the keys to being a faithful Catholic is the notion of obedience. A Priest who willfully disobeys their Bishop can and should be reprimanded or removed.

 

[stlcatholic86]

When the number of people killed by the death penalty is even within a million of the number killed by abortion, you’ll have a point.

Oh so it’s the amount of injustice that determines its morality?