Noise before Mass

  • Thread starter Thread starter CrazyCat
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Ockham said:
Children eat too. Should they be allowed to bring lunch boxes into church? Adults eat too. Why not order pizza? “Hello, Dominos? Could I get a pair of meat lovers delivered to the fifth pew, Gospel side, of St. John Paul II?”

We are not a society of Pygmies running around the jungle half naked. Mom could very easily got up, walked to the family room and fed baby in privacy. Once again the convenience of the individual trumped the consideration of the group.

Of course someone will point out that breast feeding is perfectly natural and those that ask for the decency of restraint are infringing on “rights” or just mean. Farting is natural, why don’t we all do that in church?
Click to expand...
*It is quite obvious despite your arguements that you don’t understand infants nutritional needs at all. Children and adults can wait and can understand delaying a meal…or farting for that matter, infants cannot. Look, breasts are not there for your amusement… they were made for feeding babies. Most women who nurse their babies in Church understand that there is a modesty factor going on and do cover up as much as possible.

My question to you is:
Whose needs are more important? Your comfort level or the comfort and nutrition of an infant?

Get a grip… it isn’t all about you!*
 
Who is judging? I’m not saying she’s going to hell over it. I wonder what she was thinking though, as you. Was it an explicit act of defiance especially doing it in clear sight of the priest, being completely obtuse to any sense of proper etiquette in public or something else? Only the mother and those who have also breastfed at Mass can answer that. My point is that it is extremely unlikely to see such behaviour at a Tridentine Mass but actually didn’t surprise me at a NO Mass.
 
HolyInnocent said:
My question to you is:
Whose needs are more important? Your comfort level or the comfort and nutrition of an infant?

Get a grip… it isn’t all about you!
Click to expand...
  1. God’s
  2. The infant’s nutritional and comfort needs could have been met in the family room
  3. Agreed. It isn’t about me at all. I’m thinking of the priest and the congregation. It’s clear the mother was thinking only about herself
 
Ockham said:
At the NO I attended yesterday, I sat behind a young family. The couple who had a small baby, appeared to be late twenties, along with a young teenager and a girl around ten years of age. The teenager must be somewhat of a comedian as the two altar servers spotted him and were nearly unable to restrain themselves from laughing. The young comedian waved to them twice prior to the readings.

During the homily, the baby started to fuss a bit. Nothing big, not distracting, no crying. The mother took the child in her arms and started pulling on her sweater. Sure enough, with the priest standing in the pulpit looking down, she started breast feeding. The church has a small family room in the vestibule, but I suppose she either wasn’t aware or thought walking back to it too inconvenient.

Later at the Tridentine Mass I marvelled at another young family. Their five children attend Mass without making any noise and the older ones can even follow along quite nicely in their missals. I doubt their mother ever breast fed them at Mass and I doubt I’ll ever see them distracting the altar servers with waves and chuckles.
Click to expand...
This has nothing to do with the topic of this thread, which is NOISE BEFORE MASS. This topic has been hashed to death. A baby has the right to eat. There is nothing wrong with feeding a baby–whether by breast or by bottle. It is VERY POSSIBLE to nurse discreetly at Mass. I wonder how you saw anything sitting BEHIND the family. I think you WANTED to see something wrong/bad with the family, so instead of focusing on the HOLY SACRIFICE OF THE MASS, you chose to watch the family infront of you. Any sin involved in this situation is within yourself and not with a woman breastfeeding her baby. Having breastfed 6 children through the years, I know firsthand that it is possible to discreetly nurse during Mass and it is not sinful.

Now, get back to the topic of placing blame on everyone else that could possible make noise before Mass–that’s always a nice Christian discussion…:rolleyes:
 
Based on your signature it seems you like to boast about your breasts’ potential. Hopefully you aren’t insinuating I am some sort of pervert who was trying to catch a quick glimpse of a nipple. Do women who breast feed in public need some kind of personal vindication of their gender? Is it a political statement?

The thing about being in public is that you are often in the line of other people’s sight. It was practically impossible not to notice the breast feeding as many other people (including little old ladies) proved. Breastfeeding is a natural act and nourishing an infant is a wonderful thing. Mother could have shown her love in a much more public display by getting up and walking to the family room. I’m sure everyone in the church would have seen her and correctly identified with her purpose.

This thread is entitled “Noise before Mass” which is an act of inconsideration or disrespect. Both of which apply to breastfeeding in the pew making this incident relevant to the discussion.
 
Ockham said:
  1. God’s
  2. The infant’s nutritional and comfort needs could have been met in the family room
  3. Agreed. It isn’t about me at all. I’m thinking of the priest and the congregation. It’s clear the mother was thinking only about herself
Click to expand...
  1. The choices were you or an infant…
  2. Were you really? Why not let them decide if they are uncomfortable or not?
  3. The mother was thinking of her baby’s needs first… and probably your comfort too as a baby doesn’t cry during feedings… she wasn’t being selfish at all. It would have been more obtrusive to get up with a crying baby and walk back to the back to nurse… and what would she have encountered there? I have been in cry rooms that were literal pigstys!
 
The proper and considerate thing to do is get up and go to the family room. Socially established norms of etiquette are not set by one person. To suggest I’m the one being selfish is a distorted view. If breastfeeding is nothing unordinary then why cover your breasts at all?
 
Perhaps you are speaking of something that is particular to your Parish? I’ve never heard of a “family room” in a Church.

Some modern parish buildings have adopted the idea of a Protestant “cry room” - we don’t have a modern building and do not have a “cry room”.
 
Ockham said:
My point is that it is extremely unlikely to see such behaviour at a Tridentine Mass but actually didn’t surprise me at a NO Mass.
Click to expand...
Whether or not it is proper etiquette or wrong for a mother to do this during mass, I can tell you that I have actually seen a couple mothers at EF masses breastfeed their babies during mass at two different parishes. It was discreetly done. They were also families who were known to the parish and were there every Sunday. The baby began to cry and the mother, I guess, realized it was time to eat. These parishes also did not have “family rooms” as they were old buildings. I’ve never heard of them, actually, except for cry rooms which many of the parishes in my area also do not have.

I’m not a mother, but I do know that for those friends and family of mine who have babies, standing up to breastfeed isn’t something one does. It’s much easier to do it while sitting. And if the only place to sit is in the church and if the baby is hungry and will stop a crying baby from disrupting the rest of mass, it should be done. Of course, if this mom just pulled out her breast without any cover, that is a poor etiquette, so perhaps that should be politely pointed out to her about the necessity of carrying a nursing blanket for such emergencies.

Point is, although it is true that EF masses tend to be more quiet and reverent than some OF masses (I’m very fortunate to have a few parishes in my area which do beautiful, reverent OF masses), that really isn’t the same for breastfeeding mothers. It can happen anywhere.
 
Ockham said:
Based on your signature it seems you like to boast about your breasts’ potential. Hopefully you aren’t insinuating I am some sort of pervert who was trying to catch a quick glimpse of a nipple. Do women who breast feed in public need some kind of personal vindication of their gender? Is it a political statement?

The thing about being in public is that you are often in the line of other people’s sight. It was practically impossible not to notice the breast feeding as many other people (including little old ladies) proved. Breastfeeding is a natural act and nourishing an infant is a wonderful thing. Mother could have shown her love in a much more public display by getting up and walking to the family room. I’m sure everyone in the church would have seen her and correctly identified with her purpose.

This thread is entitled “Noise before Mass” which is an act of inconsideration or disrespect. Both of which apply to breastfeeding in the pew making this incident relevant to the discussion.
Click to expand...
Ooooo, you are a piece of work, aren’t you? I’m very proud of the fact that I am the mother of 6 children AND that GOD gave me the ability to give them nourishment. I find it simply AMAZING to be able to give birth and to feed my children at my breast. It’s simply a miracle each and every time. I don’t have anything to prove nor any agenda other than feeding and calming a baby, however, GOD did give me these children to care for and the means to do it. Jesus didn’t say “Let the little children come to me, except for those annoying, breastfed babies, keep them at home or for MY FATHER’S sake in the CRY ROOM!” No, he didn’t say that, and for that I’m entirely grateful. You try managing 6 children in a pew and needing to breastfeed–leave the six darlings alone for most of mass to breastfeed out in the cold vestibule? NO WAY. I put baby in a sling and feed the baby. No crying, no noise, no children alone in the pew, no distraction of me leaving and coming back. Everyone (but you, apparently) is happy. You won’t even know it happened, though, which is the amazing part. Now, I’m sorry if this mother was less than discreet. It does happen, and usually has nothing to do with proving a point. It just happens, or you think you are covered enough and you aren’t. The POLITE thing to do? Is for you to LOOK AWAY. Something about custody of the eyes, right? Our job at Mass is to focus on the sacrifice and not those around us. If we are distracted, it is our problem–no matter the rudeness or perceived rudenss of those around us. You are responsible for you. Pray for the mother, pray for the baby and then get your attention back to Jesus.
 
Jennifer,

All I can add is, well said!

Brenda V.
Jennifer_J said:
Ooooo, you are a piece of work, aren’t you? I’m very proud of the fact that I am the mother of 6 children AND that GOD gave me the ability to give them nourishment. I find it simply AMAZING to be able to give birth and to feed my children at my breast. It’s simply a miracle each and every time. I don’t have anything to prove nor any agenda other than feeding and calming a baby, however, GOD did give me these children to care for and the means to do it. Jesus didn’t say “Let the little children come to me, except for those annoying, breastfed babies, keep them at home or for MY FATHER’S sake in the CRY ROOM!” No, he didn’t say that, and for that I’m entirely grateful. You try managing 6 children in a pew and needing to breastfeed–leave the six darlings alone for most of mass to breastfeed out in the cold vestibule? NO WAY. I put baby in a sling and feed the baby. No crying, no noise, no children alone in the pew, no distraction of me leaving and coming back. Everyone (but you, apparently) is happy. You won’t even know it happened, though, which is the amazing part. Now, I’m sorry if this mother was less than discreet. It does happen, and usually has nothing to do with proving a point. It just happens, or you think you are covered enough and you aren’t. The POLITE thing to do? Is for you to LOOK AWAY. Something about custody of the eyes, right? Our job at Mass is to focus on the sacrifice and not those around us. If we are distracted, it is our problem–no matter the rudeness or perceived rudenss of those around us. You are responsible for you. Pray for the mother, pray for the baby and then get your attention back to Jesus.
Click to expand...
 
Maybe I am totally obtuse (a distinct possibility) but I have never noticed women breastfeeding.

I have a friend who was breastfeeding right in front of me while we were having a conversation, and I didn’t even know she had her baby under there until she brought him out, when he was finished.

I think you would actually have to know what to look for, and be looking for it, in order to notice it.

I also don’t mind the ordinary noises that kids make. For me, they are the normal background noise of Mass. Something would “feel wrong” if there were total silence, with no soft chirping of little children asking endless questions, throughout, and the occasional bumps and thumps when they squirm around. I think Jesus likes them, too. 🙂
 
pnewton said:
If most of the people around one are offended or consider a behavior to be rude, is it the Christian thing to ignore their feelings and selfishly exercise what you preceive to be your rights? We are called to value each other more than ourselves. A woman who would nurse in Mass might do so because she does not understand this basic Christian principle or appreciate the level of discomfort it gives to others. Therefore we should not judge such a one as they may be doing the best they can. However, if a woman does understand her duty to put others first, it is best to step out, find an unoccupied corner or coordinate feeding times and Mass times better.
Click to expand...
Unfortunately I think some people do understand how rude it is - but don’t care. They will say things like - “Get over it - it’s not all about you” and be completely oblivious to the irony of the statement.

Breastfeeding during Mass?
 
jmcrae said:
Maybe I am totally obtuse (a distinct possibility) but I have never noticed women breastfeeding.

I have a friend who was breastfeeding right in front of me while we were having a conversation, and I didn’t even know she had her baby under there until she brought him out, when he was finished.

I think you would actually have to know what to look for, and be looking for it, in order to notice it.

I also don’t mind the ordinary noises that kids make. For me, they are the normal background noise of Mass. Something would “feel wrong” if there were total silence, with no soft chirping of little children asking endless questions, throughout, and the occasional bumps and thumps when they squirm around. I think Jesus likes them, too. 🙂
Click to expand...
I think if you do not know what to look for - it wouldn’t bother you. Also - in our parish - the back pews are reserved with parents with small children, and we have a cry room. I have to say I have never personally seen breastfeeding during Mass - but I do not sit in the back (or go to the cry room).

Unfortunatly for me I do know wha breastfeeding looks like - our parish having many young mothers with lots of kids. On rare occasions the mother will breastdeed in the parish hall. They usually go to a corner and be discreet as possible.
 
I can’t stand the noise DURING Mass. Not the Mass itself, mind you, but the sound of kneelers being put back up. You don’t have to slam the kneelers back into place, it is possible to gently put them back without being noisy. I swear, it’s like I’m at a bowling alley or something.
 
Adonis33 said:
Unfortunatly for me I do know wha breastfeeding looks like - our parish having many young mothers with lots of kids. On rare occasions the mother will breastdeed in the parish hall. They usually go to a corner and be discreet as possible.
Click to expand...
For the sake of your own comfort, do not look at paintings, mosaics, frescoes, statues etc of the blessed mother nursing Jesus, because to you, it would be very offensive.
 
celticsfan1983 said:
I can’t stand the noise DURING Mass. Not the Mass itself, mind you, but the sound of kneelers being put back up. You don’t have to slam the kneelers back into place, it is possible to gently put them back without being noisy. I swear, it’s like I’m at a bowling alley or something.
Click to expand...
My goodness, you all are running out of things to complain about.
 
StratusRose said:
For the sake of your own comfort, do not look at paintings, mosaics, frescoes, statues etc of the blessed mother nursing Jesus, because to you, it would be very offensive.
Click to expand...
Apparently the Pope doesn’t find them offensive, though. The Vatican seems to want a return to the traditional paintings of Mary. After seeing some of the very famous paintings of Mary, it would never have occurred to me that Catholics would have a problem with public breastfeeding.

Besides, why should anyone see anything? The paintings of Mary nursing Jesus are far, far more indiscreet than anything I’ve ever done, and I’ve nursed three babies - in front of my father-in-law, while walking around shopping, on buses, at church. (Not that nursing like in the paintings bothers me personally - I’ve been around far too many women from third-world nations to be shocked by it. They think we’re odd for covering up. But I can see why a fully exposed breast might upset some people.)
 
Ockham said:
Who is judging? I’m not saying she’s going to hell over it. I wonder what she was thinking though, as you. Was it an explicit act of defiance especially doing it in clear sight of the priest, being completely obtuse to any sense of proper etiquette in public or something else? Only the mother and those who have also breastfed at Mass can answer that. My point is that it is extremely unlikely to see such behaviour at a Tridentine Mass but actually didn’t surprise me at a NO Mass.
Click to expand...
Considering I go to a TLM, an Anglican-Use, and a Latin NO, full of kids and young families, I have seen more breastfeeding mothers than I see outside Church. And it’s beautiful!
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top