Nominees for worst hymn

[Wolseley]

Well, for those of you who have certain hymns stuck in your heads, a friend of mine suggested that to get them "un"stuck, you should try this…

Sing “Amazing Grace”… to the tune of the theme song from “Gilligan’s Island”.

Now try to get THAT out of your head!

Did you know that you can sing any Emily Dickenson poem to the tune of “The Yellow Rose of Texas”?

 

[mercygate]

Jim, you just have no sense of the sacred, Traditional and beautiful. By the way, I’ve never made the claims you listed.

It’s pretty hard for people to have a “sense of the sacred” in the sense that “sacredness” has been conveyed for the past 1200 years or so. Anybody who has been exposed to American suburban liturgy for the past 35 years or so has never seen it, heard it, heard OF it.

To people who have been thoroughly and systematically divorced from the well of European culture, this stuff might as well be the music of space aliens.

They weep for “Here I am, Lord” and “Taste and See” – If Catholic liturgical piety in the past was “too remote from the people” it has now become “too remote from the Divine.” Now, it is ALL about US.

 

[Sarabande]

There may not even be any preaching. Even if there was, I am solid enough in my faith to ignore it.

Exactly. None of us knows each other well enough on to assume that we would be so easily swayed just by attending another service once or twice to hear Catholic sacred music. My faith is also very steadfast and it would be unthinkable to ever leave my religion. I’ve lived amongst Protestants and Jews within my family and that has never persuaded me to leave my faith. I understand the concern to warn against attending, but it is actually kind of an insult to assume that of someone a person doesn’t even know. (I’m not, as I have a pretty thick skin, so I’m not upset over this in that way at all - actually I’m not even really upset. )

Also, I don’t know about others, but whenever I hear sacred music no matter where, it is always a prayerful, spiritual experience - not a concert. This past Sunday, I attended a sacred concert at an Episcopal church. A Catholic priest we knew was playing the organ (excellent organist) helping out a friend there. They did the Vierne’s “Messe Solemne” and Durufle’s “Requiem”. For the people who did attend, I saw many, if not most, of them praying, folding their hands and praying. They were not coming for a concert, but for spiritual and prayerful focus - and this was just a Sacred Concert - not even part of their service.

 

[mercygate]

I’m only up to page 15 in reading this thread, but so far (unless I missed it) nobody has mentioned that chestnut of the contemporary repertory: “Voices that Challenge”.

 

[mercygate]

The Episcopal Cathedral in my city does Choral Evensong on Wednesday evenings. I am thinking of going. What is the service like? How long is it? Is there anything else besides listening to the organist and choir?

Speaking of choral Evensong, I live near NYC, where St. Thomas Church, Fifth Avenue has one of the last 4 standing choir schools for boysin the world. They mount Solemn Evensong EVERY Sunday at 4:00 p.m. To DIE for!

 

[mercygate]

The Episcopal Cathedral in my city does Choral Evensong on Wednesday evenings. I am thinking of going. What is the service like? How long is it? Is there anything else besides listening to the organist and choir?

It’s evening prayer.

Intro, canticles (Magnificat & Nunc Dimittis), 2 readings from Scripture.Big anthem while the collection is taken. Sermon. A full-blown Solemn Evensong takes an hour. It’s GORGEOUS.

 

[peary]

It’s pretty hard for people to have a “sense of the sacred” in the sense that “sacredness” has been conveyed for the past 1200 years or so. Anybody who has been exposed to American suburban liturgy for the past 35 years or so has never seen it, heard it, heard OF it.

To people who have been thoroughly and systematically divorced from the well of European culture, this stuff might as well be the music of space aliens.

They weep for “Here I am, Lord” and “Taste and See” – If Catholic liturgical piety in the past was “too remote from the people” it has now become “too remote from the Divine.” Now, it is ALL about US.

AMEN to that!

 

[mercygate]

Evensong is my favorite service. After an organ prelude, it starts with a sung Introit (usually by choir). Then there are some short prayers with responses that may be sung or said. Then a hymn. Then a psalm, usually chanted. Then a scripture reading followed by a sung Magnificat. Then another reading followed by a sung Nunc Dimittis (Lord, now lettest Thou Thy servant depart in peace…) Then the Apostles’ Creed, the Lord’s Prayer and some other prayers, usually including the General Thanksgiving (I love this) and the prayer of St. John Chrysostom. Another hymn. An anthem (this is where we do the Requiem) by the choir and closing prayers. Then the Orison (don’t know what this word means or where it came from, but it’s a short evening - themed piece by choir), the blessing and the final hymn. There may be an organ postlude.

The whole thing usually lasts about 45 minutes, unless there is a major work like a requiem being performed or someone decides to preach. I highly recommend it. Every Wednesday - you lucky thing, you! Absolutely go! Tell us how you like it.

Betsy

Louis Bouyer, Catholic liturgical scholar whose work has been fueling the reform of the reform, said that choral Evensong, as celebrated in the great cathedrals of England is among the most sublime expressions of liturgical prayer in the Church.

 

[roseofmary]

The choir sings “This little light of Mine” for an offertory hymn at my church. It’s pretty bad. Especially since it’s a choir for 18 years of age on up they make themselves** sound stupid. That song should be sang by little kids, and definitely not in church.

 

[Elzee]

The choir sings “This little light of Mine” for an offertory hymn at my church. It’s pretty bad. Especially since it’s a choir for 18 years of age on up they make themselves sound stupid. That song should be sang by little kids, and definitely not in church.

We sing it at Mass. Complete with hand motions. I just stand with my head down and my hands clasped. It’s just about more than I stand.

The only thing worse is our hip hop rendition of “Lamb of God”.

All sense of reverence and awe is lost.

 

[mercygate]

We sing it at Mass. Complete with hand motions. I just stand with my head down and my hands clasped. It’s just about more than I stand.

The only thing worse is our hip hop rendition of “Lamb of God”.

All sense of reverence and awe is lost.

What’s “Lamb of God?” – You must mean "Bread of Life, Prince of Peace, Lover of Souls . . . ???

 

[benedictgal]

As I’ve been reading the posts, some more musical disasters have come to mind:

Sendero de la Vida (Spanish)
Go Out to the World/Vayan al Mundo
I. Myself, Am the Bread of Life (loved it at first, but when I closely read the lyrics, there was some serious heresy in that song)
Lord, I Lift Your Name on High
Shine, Jesus, Shine
I Will Choose Christ
Sr. Bernadette’s mangled version of “Come, Holy Ghost” where she inserts a modern refrain that emphasizes “we are church”
Earthen Vessels
Sing to the Mountains, Sing to the Seas
Thank You, Lord, for Giving Me Life

I am wondering if any of these will show up during next April’s Papal Mass at Yankee Stadium or in D.C.

 

[daeve]

Gee, thanks. NOT!

Meanie…

I’ve been trying to sing Amazing Grace to the Gilligan tune, and I just can’t do it. I can’t remember the words that way!

 

[Cat]

OT.

Did you know that you can sing ANY song in the world to the tune of “Oh, Susanna!”?

It’s the Universal Melody.

I am not kidding. My husband and I did this once on a long car trip. We sang everything from Hallelujah Chorus to Yesterday to *Theme from Little Mermaid * to this tune, and we could make it work! It was a hoot! Great way to pass time in the car!

In fact, I just tried it with Ave Maria. It’s really kind of cool–slow it waaay down, and it sounds like a chant! I’ll bet if someone sang it in church, most people wouldn’t guess it.

Try it!

 

[JimR-OCDS]

Wolseley

Then there’s Bob Dufford’s “Sing to the Mountains, Sing to the Sea”, which I steadfastly refuse to have anything to do with, as it reminds me too much of a Wiccan paean to Pangea. I am a Christian, not a pagan. I do not sing to mountains and seas, I sing to the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost.

You must have a problem with reading Sacred Scripture, because the song “Sing To The Mountains, Sing To The Sea,” is based
on it, just as many of St. Louis Jesuit songs are.

Raise a glad cry, you heavens: the LORD has done this; shout, you depths of the earth. Break forth, you mountains, into song, you forest, with all your trees. For the LORD has redeemed Jacob, and shows his glory through Israel. Isaiah 44:23

Jim

 

[benedictgal]

Wolseley

You must have a problem with reading Sacred Scripture, because the song “Sing To The Mountains, Sing To The Sea,” is based
on it, just as many of St. Louis Jesuit songs are.

Jim

Just because the St. Louis Jesuits used Scripture doesn’t make their repertoire any good. Their melodies are a cross between Joan Baez and John Denver. I’m sorry, Jim, but they represent the worst in liturgical music.

Furthermore, there is criteria to be used in sacred music, which I don’t think the SLJ used at all. I invite you to read the BCL power point of the document the USCCB is currently deliberating.

usccb.org/liturgy/MUSIC%20FDLCnew.ppt

This should prove to be an eye-opener for you, if you are open to learning about why the issue of music is so important.

 

[mercygate]

Wolseley

You must have a problem with reading Sacred Scripture, because the song “Sing To The Mountains, Sing To The Sea,” is based
on it, just as many of St. Louis Jesuit songs are.

Jim

In the Psalm, it is the mountains and hlls that are singing. WE are not singing TO the mountains.

 

[daeve]

Yeah, I looked it up after I wrote this to see when it was written. Like I said, it sounded like a song from a 1970s or 1950s broadway show. I know it wasn’t from an actual broadway show, but that and many others do sound like it can be from some show or should be in a Broadway show. I was reading that article from NPM someone posted and the article mentioned that this Let There Be Peace on Earth and Lord of the Dance came from “outside the (liturgical music) culture”.

Lord of the Dance has got to be one of the worst things (won’t call it a song) ever. The original Simple Gifts and the Aaron Copeland version are so beautiful, that it makes this even worse. We used to sing a song back in the 50s and 60s to this tune, but not all speeded up like this. Here are the words I remember:

All our hope in salvation
All our trust in the Lord
Are the Holy Spirit
Evermore adored
Something something something
In His true light
Something else God’s own Son makes our right.

Anybody else ever sing this? The few people from grade school that I still see don’t remember it at all (and aren’t exactly Catholic anymore for that matter) and my sister was just too young when we moved to remember it.

There are a couple songs we sing, mercifully not often enough that I can think of them right now, that I call Mass…the Musical. One last Easter had an ooh-ooh part in it. When we sang it at practice I jumped up and did a little Esther Williams water ballet flourish. We sang it once or twice, but people were having a hard time keeping a straight face, so the director finally gave up on it. I make a fuss when Lord of the Dance comes up too, but I haven’t been able to get rid of it yet. When I cantor in the summer, we can’t use it, because I sound so awful trying to do it. Maybe it’s mental, but I really can’t sing it. Same for Eagle’s Wings. It can’t be used when I cantor because I just can’t sing it.

Gather Us In does sound like a sea chanty. Hosea sounds like a drinking song to me…should be in the Student Prince.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

benedictgal

Just because the St. Louis Jesuits used Scripture doesn’t make their repertoire any good.

Well thats your personal opinion and not necessarily shared by countless others.

Their melodies are a cross between Joan Baez and John Denver.

Well being very familiar with John Denver and Joan Baez, and having played St. Jesuits music at Mass, they’re styles aren’t close and the words and meanings are miles apart.

I do like Joan Baez and John Denver however.

I’m sorry, Jim, but they represent the worst in liturgical music.

Once again, your opinion, which is well, I won’t go further.

Furthermore, there is criteria to be used in sacred music, which I don’t think the SLJ used at all.

Actually they did, and if you read their song books, they tell how they arrived at certain songs, and they also specify which songs are appropriate for Mass at different times in the liturgical calender and for different occasions.

We always played St. Louis Jesuit songs at Confirmation. The Bishops, 4 different ones in that time period, never told us to stop playing those hymns. In fact, The Glory and Praise Hymnal, is approved by the Bishops. Heck, at one Confirmation, he request the choir sing “On Eagles Wings.”

I invite you to read the BCL power point of the document the USCCB is currently deliberating.

I don’t much will come of it, because the Bishops in general, know little about writing music. They’ll put out a document on their desire for composers to follow the spirit of the liturgy, which composers like the St. Louis Jesuits have, and we’ll see more good music by other modern composers.

How you handle it will be another issue entirely.

Jim

 

[JimR-OCDS]

In the Psalm, it is the mountains and hlls that are singing. WE are not singing TO the mountains.

Its the basis for the inspiration.

Also, the Psalms tell us to sing to the heavens, sing to the seas.

Heck, the Liturgy of the Hours, we pray;

Ice and snow, Praise the Lord

Sea and all living Creatures, Praise the Lord.

Etc.

Does the ice and snow literally hear us, or is this just the poetic expression of a soul, who is praising God?

Jim