Non-Catholic religions and abortion

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iamrefreshed said:
Originally Posted by iamrefreshed forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_cad/viewpost.gif
Further, since you can define the human mind and allow abortion based on its formation please tell me the exact moment that this happens during gestation.

This should be VERY simple for you to prove since you base your allowance for abortion on it.
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I cannot tell you the exact moment, but for sure its beyond the first 90 days.

home.iprimus.com.au/rboon/StagesofBrainDevelopment.htm
 
AgnosTheist said:
I cannot tell you the exact moment, but for sure its beyond the first 90 days.

home.iprimus.com.au/rboon/StagesofBrainDevelopment.htm
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I didn’t ask you about brain development. I asked you about the human mind as defined by you earlier.

“The Human Mind collectively refers to the aspects of intellect and consciousness manifested as combinations of thought, perception, memory, emotion, will and imagination. It is the stream of consciousness.”

Please tell me the moment in the gestation period that the above happens. You should know since you would abort based on it.

And a citation would be great.
 
estesbob said:
In your opinion.
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check out the source that I gave, dude.

i am the only one providing objective proof here, the rest of you guys merely cling to religious justifications. so if theres anyone being subjective here, it certainly isnt me. look in the mirror.
estesbob said:
you have yet to give us a reason as to why ALL human life does not deserve protection.
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i gave 2.
 
iamrefreshed said:
I didn’t ask you about brain development. I asked you about the human mind as defined by you earlier.
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still the same answer. for how can there be a combination of thought, perception, memory, emotion, will and imagination, if there is no fully functional brain to begin with?
iamrefreshed said:
You should know since you would abort based on it.
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Like the genuine Roman Catholics, I would abort on or before the first 90 days because scientifically the brain had not yet functioned then.
 
AgnosTheist said:
check out the source that I gave, dude.
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I have looked at all the cites you have given. None of them explains why all human life should not be protected. For instance a wikiepeida article that explains when the mind develops is not proof that its ok to kill a child before this point is reached.
i am the only one providing objective proof here, the rest of you guys merely cling to religious justifications. so if theres anyone being subjective here, it certainly isnt me. look in the mirror.

i gave 2.
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Not true-allyou have done is post your opinion and claim it is objective truth.
 
AgnosTheist said:
still the same answer. for how can there be a combination of thought, perception, memory, emotion, will and imagination, if there is no fully functional brain to begin with?

Like the genuine Roman Catholics, I would abort on or before the first 90 days because scientifically the brain had not yet functioned then.
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I see. Since you paint yourself into a corner, it’s time for the insults. How sad.🤷

I have to wonder what test was used to find out what a 90 day old baby was imagining.:rolleyes:

Hopefully, your advice is disregarded by all those around you who may make a poor decision later in life because of your lack of respect for babies.
 
iamrefreshed said:
I see. Since you paint yourself into a corner, it’s time for the insults. How sad.🤷
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oh come on, wheres your sense of humor? lighten up a bit. 🙂
iamrefreshed said:
I have to wonder what test was used to find out what a 90 day old baby was imagining.:rolleyes:
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read the entire scientific article. without a functional brain, the embryo is incapable of imagination.
iamrefreshed said:
Hopefully, your advice is disregarded by all those around you who may make a poor decision later in life because of your lack of respect for babies.
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hey dont take this personally. and dont mind about me, just worry about the FACT that your pope is literally surrounded by Roman Catholic abortionists. What can you say about that?
 
estesbob said:
I have looked at all the cites you have given. None of them explains why all human life should not be protected.

Not true-allyou have done is post your opinion and claim it is objective truth.
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the science article merely explains brain development. i didnt mean that as an answer to your question.

generally i agree that all human life should be protected. but as with all rules, there are exceptions: heinous criminals should hang, and women should be allowed to abort if they see the embryo as a future threat.
 
AgnosTheist said:
the science article merely explains brain development. i didnt mean that as an answer to your question.

ok in summary the answer to your question would go something like this: all human life should not be protected because some human lives are a threat many other human lives (think about murderers) and some human lives are not even human beings (think embryos).
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Based on who’s definition of human beings? If we have seperate distinct human life from the moment of conception who are you to determine some arbitrary label before which it is ok to kill them?
 
AgnosTheist said:
oh come on, wheres your sense of humor? lighten up a bit. 🙂
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Sorry, I have trouble finding humor when discussing murder.
AgnosTheist said:
read the entire scientific article. without a functional brain, the embryo is incapable of imagination.
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I asked what test was used to prove a 90 day old baby could ‘imagine’ (one of your criteria)
AgnosTheist said:
hey dont take this personally. and dont mind about me, just worry about the FACT that your pope is literally surrounded by Roman Catholic abortionists. What can you say about that?
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I think it is very sad. It only makes me admire him more when he stands and condemns murder of innocent children, all the while surrounded by those murdering innocent children.
 
estesbob said:
Based on who’s definition of human beings? If we have seperate distinct human life from the moment of conception who are you to determine some arbitrary label before which it is ok to kill them?
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based on this?

home.iprimus.com.au/rboon/StagesofBrainDevelopment.htm

The first 8 weeks after implantation are termed the embryonic period. It is during this time that the organs, systems and tissues of the future being are induced, differentiated, and put into place
 
AgnosTheist said:
Yo, dude. My personal conditions on abortion is identical to Rome. See above. So stop complaining already. 😃

Abortion in Italy

*In 1978, a law was passed in Italy which set forth the regulations governing the procedures for obtaining an induced abortion. According to this law, all women are eligible to request an abortion during the first 90 days of gestation for health, economic, social, or familial reasons. *

ben.iss.it/precedenti/aprile/1apr_en.htm

BINGO!!
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???
**Are you implying that “Rome”, in this case, refers to the Church? **HOGWASH.
Abortion could be legal in every country and city in the world surrounding the Vatican, but that wouldn’t make it okay in the eyes of the Church.
**Face it, Agnos - you came here to antagonize (as usual) and your arguments have been defeated by just about everybody on this thread. **
"If it’s not a baby - you’re NOT pregnant!"

Game - Set - MATCH!!
 
AgnosTheist said:
based on this?

home.iprimus.com.au/rboon/StagesofBrainDevelopment.htm

*The first 8 weeks after implantation are termed the embryonic period. It is during this time that the organs, systems and tissues of the future being *are induced, differentiated, and put into place
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What do they base their opinion on?

Is it seperate distinct human life or not? if it is why does anyone have the right to determine what other criteria it must meet to be protected.
 
AgnosTheist said:
still the same answer. for how can there be a combination of thought, perception, memory, emotion, will and imagination, if there is no fully functional brain to begin with?
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I find your whole series of arguments absurd. The lengths you are going to to justify ending human life at one stage of developement over others, for human life it is at all stages to include the individual sperm and individual egg before forming the zygote- is ludacris.
Like the genuine Roman Catholics, I would abort on or before the first 90 days because scientifically the brain had not yet functioned then.
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As another pointed out, what is the difference from you going to hospitals and homes of those in a vegitative state and killing them in the same vein you would kill <90 days old fetuses in poor areas?

Your two major points; a function mind and a qualified view of what is a human being are inaccurate benchmarks but alos incorrect conclusions.

You speak as if the functioning mind must be fully formed, without defect or injury- or else it is subject to termination without regard to offense. You speak as if a human being is only viable at some point within the womb, definately not at conception though yet you cannot describe when, but as long as it does not conflict with the funtion mind portion of your theory.

Thankfully you are in the minority.
“The right of an innocent, unborn child to life is at the heart of the American ideals of liberty. My professional and legislative record demonstrates my strong commitment to this pro-life principle,” says Paul, an OB/GYN, who says he has delivered over 4,000 babies. In Congress, he says, he “authored legislation that seeks to define life as beginning at conception, HR 1094.” He has also been “the prime sponsor of HR 300, which would negate the effect of Roe v Wade by removing the ability of federal courts to interfere with state legislation to protect life.” He has supported legislation preventing federal funds for “population control.”
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elvisman said:
???
Are you implying that “Rome”, in this case, refers to the Church? HOGWASH.
Abortion could be legal in every country and city in the world surrounding the Vatican, but that wouldn’t make it okay in the eyes of the Church.
Face it, Agnos - you came here to antagonize (as usual) and your arguments have been defeated by just about everybody on this thread.
"If it’s not a baby - you’re NOT pregnant!"

Game - Set - MATCH!!
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It was a lame attempt at humor that he has repeated at least a half dozen times. Basically he has backed himslef into a corner and is desperatley trying to change the subject.
 
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