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AgnosTheist
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None of them applies to a young embryo, because young embryos dont have a brain. That is an objective fact.
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estesbob
Guest
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AgnosTheist
Guest
there are tons of reasons. i myself would rather abort early pregnancies in impoverished areas (if they would have it) than see children starve to death.
and of course, most people would refuse to recognize serial killers as human. so off with their head. a couple of hundred years ago, the catholic church refused to see witches and heretics as humans so they burned them on the stake like dangerous animals.
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AgnosTheist
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so, no brain → no mind. no mind → not a person. not a person → not a human being. not a human being → ok to abort.
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ncgolf
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You keep going back … first it was a mind … now its a brain … why not feet or eyes or a sense of humor. You cannot see just how arbitrary your standards are … might as well be hair color. Your arguments for hair color should not vary from those of the mind. It uses the same logic though the tone of that argument is a bit more heinous.
You do nothing to earn personhood or being human … this from the Declaration of Independence
“We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.”
People are endowed by their Creator … things are passed from the Creator to the created. People are created by the sperm and egg and by the Providenece of God and when that happens at least the Declaration of Independence says it should be self-evident that the pursit of life should be a right and one not taken away.
Endowed means given …
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ncgolf
Guest
Well I guess Jefferson and gang were not so enlightened as you and if they thougt an arugument like yours was to see the light of day I am sure the Dec. of Independence would have been a little different. They held a standard to people that certain things are self evident … they are true without having to go into detail … that they dont need explaining but too bad they couldnt see forward 250 years.
“We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, regardless if they have a brain or not.”
“We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, regardless if they have a brain or not.”
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AgnosTheist
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I thought it was pretty obvious to you guys that young embryos dont have a brain.
then why is abortion legal in many U.S. states? their qualifications for abortion is more brutal than mine.
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AgnosTheist
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baltimorechronicle.com/abortion_policies_europe.html
ITALY: Abortion on demand through 12th week since legalized in 1978. 1981 referendum backed law. Population 99% Roman Catholic.
WOW! ROMAN POLICIES REALLY AINT THAT DIFFERENT FROM MY PERSONAL PREFERENCES!
So what are you guys complaining about? Listen to Rome, dudes. Abortion on demand up to 3 months.
ITALY: Abortion on demand through 12th week since legalized in 1978. 1981 referendum backed law. Population 99% Roman Catholic.
WOW! ROMAN POLICIES REALLY AINT THAT DIFFERENT FROM MY PERSONAL PREFERENCES!
So what are you guys complaining about? Listen to Rome, dudes. Abortion on demand up to 3 months.
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elvisman
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BINGO!!
You have proven once again that you are a moral relativist.
YOUR conditions on abortion? As if YOUR reasons for killing a defenseless human are better than anyone else’s.
That’s like saying, MY conditions for shooting an abortionist doctor are okay but YOURS aren’t. Absolutely ludicrous!! It’s wrong, no matter WHAT your reason.
**Your response to my comparison about the changes and unborn child experiences and the changes you yourself have experienced is to simply say, *“That’s an improper analogy”. ***
Your arguments are transparently relativist and therefore, heavily flawed.
Nice try, but no cigar . . .
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AgnosTheist
Guest
Yo, dude. My personal conditions on abortion is identical to Rome. See above. So stop complaining already.
*Abortion in Italy
In 1978, a law was passed in Italy which set forth the regulations governing the procedures for obtaining an induced abortion. According to this law, all women are eligible to request an abortion during the first 90 days of gestation for health, economic, social, or familial reasons. *
ben.iss.it/precedenti/aprile/1apr_en.htm
BINGO!!
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iamrefreshed
Guest
Agnos thesist.
I now am forced to conclude that you are intentionally ducking my question.
I’ve rasied an absolutely valid question and you refuse to attempt to answer.
Is this because by answering it you will invalidate your argument?
If not, why are you avoiding answering?
Anyone else like to hear a response to my question?
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ncgolf
Guest
You miss my point … I thought you would … embryos also dont have hair color or a sense of humor. This is the point where your relativism shows through.
Your position does not allow for argument against someone else’s arbitrary reasons for aborting embryos. They could be just as right as you in their analysis of what makes a person. This is the slippery slope.
The others on this thread could argue with me if I changed tunes and said hair color is the criteria for abortions but you can’t. You already believe such criteria exist and somehow you have the correct one. NO way. You may think yourself more logical and enlightned but we would both believe that embryos are not protected based on some sort of criteria.
Would I be wrong to base my abortion criteria on hair color? You tell me. Be careful on how you answer this because you will begin to refute your own position.
See if you can do it.
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iamrefreshed
Guest
This is NOT Roman policy as you imply.baltimorechronicle.com/abortion_policies_europe.html
ITALY: Abortion on demand through 12th week since legalized in 1978. 1981 referendum backed law. Population 99% Roman Catholic.
WOW! ROMAN POLICIES REALLY AINT THAT DIFFERENT FROM MY PERSONAL PREFERENCES!
So what are you guys complaining about? Listen to Rome, dudes. Abortion on demand up to 3 months.
That is just disingenuous and insulting. I thought you might be above that. Sadly, I’m wrong
When will you answer my question?
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estesbob
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Ah-the old “better dead than underfed” rationalization for killing children. Also known as eugenics.
Lame attempt to change the subject.
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AgnosTheist
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Im sorry but what was the question again? Ive been entertaining so many people that some things could slip unnoticed.
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estesbob
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So?Yo, dude. My personal conditions on abortion is identical to Rome. See above. So stop complaining already.
Abortion in Italy
*In 1978, a law was passed in Italy which set forth the regulations governing the procedures for obtaining an induced abortion. According to this law, all women are eligible to request an abortion during the first 90 days of gestation for health, economic, social, or familial reasons. *
ben.iss.it/precedenti/aprile/1apr_en.htm
BINGO!!
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AgnosTheist
Guest
Im sorry but what was the question again? Ive been entertaining so many people that some things could slip unnoticed.
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estesbob
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Another attempt to make an argument based solely on your personal definitions. Why shouldnt all human life be protected?
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AgnosTheist
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Ah nothing, Im just glad that the genuine “Roman” Catholics actually share my point of view.
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iamrefreshed
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Here is what I posed to you 4 times now…Im sorry but what was the question again? Ive been entertaining so many people that some things could slip unnoticed.
Originally Posted by iamrefreshed forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_cad/viewpost.gif
Further, since you can define the human mind and allow abortion based on its formation please tell me the exact moment that this happens during gestation.
This should be VERY simple for you to prove since you base your allowance for abortion on it.
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