Obama nominates John Kerry for secretary of state

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meltzerboy said:
It may surprise you, Lisa, but I agree with you on this. I want the best candidate for such important positions, not one chosen merely on the basis of political correctness. I think a broad range of candidates of both genders and different ethnic backgrounds should be considered, and then the most qualified one chosen. Pundits have been saying that if Obama chooses Hagel for Secretary of Defense, he’ll be criticized for selecting two white men: Kerry and Hagel. To that I say so what, provided they are well suited for the positions. Sometimes, however, there are several equally qualified people for a job, and that’s often when the minority person, based on race and gender, is selected. It would be better if our society got passed any kind of favoritism, but we’re not quite there yet. Another factor in the selection process is choosing someone compatible with the President’s views, that is, someone Obama can relate to politically as well as personally. I know this may sound irrelevant, but it is a fact in the hiring process for a number of professions.
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Well be still my beating heart,🙂 we do agree and good point about the SoS having a politically and temperamentally compatibilty with the President. I suspect that was one of the main reasons Condi Rice was selected as she and former President Bush were of one mind and clearly trusted one another. John Kerry and Pres Obama are clearly in synch so it’s probably a good choice for his administration.

Also agree that I do not mind a tip of the hat to a minority IF there are multiple qualified candidates and they are otherwise equal.

Lisa
 
It’s a minority of Republicans and an dumb move which will not prevent Kerry from getting the needed votes.

Also, just because Hilary Clinton isn’t Secretary of State, doesn’t prevent her from having to testify before the congressional committee.

Jim
 
RACJ said:
Yet another horrendous Obama appointee. Frankly, I expected no better from Obama than his nominating someone who testified and lied before Congress about “atrocities” committed by his fellow soldiers, comparing them to those of “Jenjis Khan”. 🤷
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A curious business, to be sure.

After leaving Viet Nam, he condemned his fellow soldiers.

He is Catholic but supports abortion at every turn.

What I can’t figure out is why anyone would think a man who cares so little about his comrades in arms or the clear teachings of his religion, would care anything about their own welfare or that of the nation as a whole.

But for this administration, it must be acknowledged that he’s the kind of choice one would expect.
 
LisaA said:
I’m not the slightest bit worked up about this, I’m just amused with the idea that anyone considers these important positions an opportunity to pay favors to supporters or fill some sort of self imposed quota for color or sex or other physical characteristic that has nothing to do with their qualifications.

All of the reporting about this appointment focuses on Kerry’s “friendship” with Obama, how Obama launched his presidential career at the 2004 Democratic Convention, that he is sophisticated and a “man of the world.” Not a peep about his qualifications to represent America’s interests abroad and little mention of his rather treasonous statements during the Vietnam era.

It just seems to be about favor trading.
Lisa
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With a US president who has Kenya as his “home country”, nothing surprises me in American politics anymore.

Video clip of Michelle Obama admitting that Kenya is Barack’s “home country”
 
Ridgerunner said:
A curious business, to be sure.

After leaving Viet Nam, he condemned his fellow soldiers.

He is Catholic but supports abortion at every turn.

What I can’t figure out is why anyone would think a man who cares so little about his comrades in arms or the clear teachings of his religion, would care anything about their own welfare or that of the nation as a whole.

But for this administration, it must be acknowledged that he’s the kind of choice one would expect.
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I suspect you are right. It seems Obama simply wants someone with a similar political outlook rather than someone who could actually make a difference in foreign policy. I just wish there were more concern for those who were murdered in a horrible attack. No one seems to care anymore…move along…nothing to see here!

Lisa
 
JimR-OCDS said:
He condemned his fellow soldiers?

I thought Kerry was in the Navy? They have sailors. 😃

Jin
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Very funny Jim but “soldiers” is often used to speak of service members of all branches. Frankly few Americans know that it’s more correct to refer to individuals by the actual branch of the military…Sailors, Airmen, Marines…note these are capitalized but ‘soldiers’ is not.

At any rate I think Kerry condemned ALL branches in his post Viet Nam war tirades…didn’t limit to the Army did he? Again, Obama can nominate anyone he wants but for those of us who remember Kerry’s “Hanoi Jane” moments, it’s a bit hard to swallow him representing America and those heroes whose blood was spilled to allow him to spew this venom.

Lisa
 
JimR-OCDS said:
He condemned his fellow soldiers?

I thought Kerry was in the Navy? They have sailors. 😃

Jin
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By golly, you’re right. “Sailors” it is.

Of possible interest, my initial statement that since Kerry thought nothing of his fellow (he probably said “comrades” or something) or his religion, was expressed to me by a former swift boat veteran who isn’t even Catholic. But he knew a betrayer when he saw one, even so.
 
LisaA said:
Very funny Jim but “soldiers” is often used to speak of service members of all branches. Frankly few Americans know that it’s more correct to refer to individuals by the actual branch of the military…Sailors, Airmen, Marines…note these are capitalized but ‘soldiers’ is not.

At any rate I think Kerry condemned ALL branches in his post Viet Nam war tirades…didn’t limit to the Army did he? Again, Obama can nominate anyone he wants but for those of us who remember Kerry’s “Hanoi Jane” moments, it’s a bit hard to swallow him representing America and those heroes whose blood was spilled to allow him to spew this venom.

Lisa
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Kerry spoke about what he saw US Servicemen doing in Vietnam, which wasn’t a lie, for I heard similar stories from the Marines I served with.

He spoke against US Policy of having us involved with that war, which I ended up agreeing with him on. The Vietnam War was a giant mistake.

Anyway, different issue, but I respect him for speaking out against the Vietnam War, after he served.

Jim
 
JimR-OCDS said:
Kerry spoke about what he saw US Servicemen doing in Vietnam, which wasn’t a lie, for I heard similar stories from the Marines I served with.

He spoke against US Policy of having us involved with that war, which I ended up agreeing with him on. The Vietnam War was a giant mistake.

Anyway, different issue, but I respect him for speaking out against the Vietnam War, after he served.

Jim
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On that we must agree to disagree. I find the man and his words disgusting and disgraceful. His throwing “his” medals away, his lack of candor and refusal to release certain records all demonstrate someone who is putting on an act for his own benefit and self promotion rather than to right a wrong.

There were a lot of such folks back then and the scars left by their self indulgent pontificating are still with us. I know a lot of Vietnam vets through work and through a troop support charity that also serves veterans. They don’t forget what Kerry and Hanoi Jane and the rest of that ilk said and did even though it was decades ago.

But hey elections have consequences as we are learning day by day.

Lisa
 
LisaA said:
On that we must agree to disagree. I find the man and his words disgusting and disgraceful. His throwing “his” medals away, his lack of candor and refusal to release certain records all demonstrate someone who is putting on an act for his own benefit and self promotion rather than to right a wrong.

There were a lot of such folks back then and the scars left by their self indulgent pontificating are still with us. I know a lot of Vietnam vets through work and through a troop support charity that also serves veterans. They don’t forget what Kerry and Hanoi Jane and the rest of that ilk said and did even though it was decades ago.

But hey elections have consequences as we are learning day by day.

Lisa
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Kerry didn’t throw his medals away, that was a myth perpetrated by his opponents.

The medals he threw onto the White House Lawn were those given to him by veterans whom he visited at VA hospitals. They gave him their medals and told him to shove them up the commander and chiefs place where the sun doesn’t shine.

Anyway, on foreign relations, he has good experience.

Also, he did a great job investigating the MIA’s in Vietnam and provided solid evidence that there were no POW’s being held by the Vietnamese government.

Jim
 
JimR-OCDS said:
The medals he threw onto the White House Lawn were those given to him by veterans whom he visited at VA hospitals. They gave him their medals and told him to shove them up the commander and chiefs place where the sun doesn’t shine.
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Odd that he didn’t say that, or bring out those veterans to tell it while he was running for President.

But if it was true, and it seems doubtful, throwing medals onto the White House lawn was a contemptible act. There were men who “bought” such medals with their wounds and their lives. It was because it demonstrated contempt for that of which others were deservedly proud because of their sacrifices, that Kerry was not well thought of by others who served in Viet Nam, and particularly not swift boat veterans.

But again, as a betrayer of his comrades and his religion, Kerry is exactly the sort of person this administration would want to represent this country.
 
Ridgerunner
Odd that he didn’t say that, or bring out those veterans to tell it while he was running for President.
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Actually he did in an interview when asked about the medals. It’s how I learned that they weren’t his, he said so.
But if it was true, and it seems doubtful, throwing medals onto the White House lawn was a contemptible act.
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No, the government continuing the war was the contemptible act. Throwing medals on the WH lawn didn’t harm anyone. Sending US men off to war killed 50,000 plus and hundreds of thousands of Vietnamese.
There were men who “bought” such medals with their wounds and their lives.
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Right, and those men gave the medals to Kerry to throw back in the face of the president who was responsible for continuing the war, which cost men their lives, limbs and often, their sanity.

Kerry had every right to protest the war. After all, he served in the war and saw first hand what was going on. Did you?

Jim
 
JimR-OCDS said:
Kerry didn’t throw his medals away, that was a myth perpetrated by his opponents.

The medals he threw onto the White House Lawn were those given to him by veterans whom he visited at VA hospitals. They gave him their medals and told him to shove them up the commander and chiefs place where the sun doesn’t shine.

Anyway, on foreign relations, he has good experience.

Also, he did a great job investigating the MIA’s in Vietnam and provided solid evidence that there were no POW’s being held by the Vietnamese government.

Jim
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Jim you should have noted “his” in quotes. I knew they were not his medals but at the time he hurled them, it was not widely known. In fact I think his admission they were not his was to save face when confronted with a really offensive act. Had he burned the flag and stomped on it instead, it would have sent the same message.

We can look back with 20 20 hindsight and understand that the Vietnam War was based on false information and a flawed strategy. That doesn’t excuse the acts of the anti-war protestors, the way Vietnam vets were treated, and the betrayal of the South Vietnamese who were abandoned for political reasons.

John Kerry, Jane Fonda, and many other faces of the anti-war movemennt may have had valid points but their actions resulted in horrible consequences that we live with decades later. Had Kerry ever apologized, attempted to make up for his cowardice by helping those vets he condemned, I would have a different opinion of the man. As George Bush famously said, when I was young and stupid, I was young and stupid. I grew up with very anti-war Democrat parents and at the time agreed with Kerry. I regret my stupidity and subsequently have volunteered extensively for a troop support group. Although I never did anything to the Vietnam vets (I was in grade school during the war) I know the attitude of my parents and those like them was very destructive.

Again, I think Kerry is of the same mind as Obama and that is as Meltzerboy noted, very important in such appointments. I have zero respect for the man regardless of his title.

Lisa
 
LisaA
Jim you should have noted “his” in quotes. I knew they were not his medals but at the time he hurled them, it was not widely known. In fact I think his admission they were not his was to save face when confronted with a really offensive act. Had he burned the flag and stomped on it instead, it would have sent the same message.
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He was never given the format in which he could say that they were his medals or not.

People assumed they were his, just as they assumed he was Irish, which he is not.

That doesn’t make it his fault.

I don’t recall ever seeing John Kerry burning the American flag. Not saying he didn’t, but don’t recall him doing such a thing.
We can look back with 20 20 hindsight and understand that the Vietnam War was based on false information and a flawed strategy. That doesn’t excuse the acts of the anti-war protestors, the way Vietnam vets were treated, and the betrayal of the South Vietnamese who were abandoned for political reasons.
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Well I was a Vietnam Era Vet, and I don’t begrudge protest against the war. I don’t support those who attacked returning Veterans, as they did in LA Airport where my Drill Instructor’s friend was stabbed by a protester, after he returned from his 3rd term in Vietnam.

However, Vietnam was an unjust, immoral war. As a veteran, I have no qualms about saying this. The service men, most who were drafted, did their duty and sought to get back home alive, first and foremost.
John Kerry, Jane Fonda, and many other faces of the anti-war movemennt may have had valid points but their actions resulted in horrible consequences that we live with decades later.
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Please, don’t put John Kerry a veteran, on the same plane with Jane Fonda who went to the communist and sat on guns that were used to kill Americans.

Even Joan Bias disagreed with Jane Fonda, which is why she was shunned by the communist where Jane was given the red carpet when she visited Moscow.
Had Kerry ever apologized, attempted to make up for his cowardice by helping those vets he condemned,
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John Kerry is a decorated combat veteran. Calling him a coward because he came home and protested the war is really shameful. Who are you to call him a coward?

Many vets came home and protested the war, because they saw what was happening over there. Are they all cowards? If anything, their more brave than those who came home and kept their mouths shut, despite seeing what they saw.

OK, you don’t kike John Kerry, I get that.

But he will be the next Secretary of State, because Obama was re-elected by the people, and that’s his right to appoint the heads of his cabinet.

Jim
 
JimR-OCDS said:
LisaA

He was never given the format in which he could say that they were his medals or not.

People assumed they were his, just as they assumed he was Irish, which he is not.

That doesn’t make it his fault.

I don’t recall ever seeing John Kerry burning the American flag. Not saying he didn’t, but don’t recall him doing such a thing.

Well I was a Vietnam Era Vet, and I don’t begrudge protest against the war. I don’t support those who attacked returning Veterans, as they did in LA Airport where my Drill Instructor’s friend was stabbed by a protester, after he returned from his 3rd term in Vietnam.

However, Vietnam was an unjust, immoral war. As a veteran, I have no qualms about saying this. The service men, most who were drafted, did their duty and sought to get back home alive, first and foremost.

Please, don’t put John Kerry a veteran, on the same plane with Jane Fonda who went to the communist and sat on guns that were used to kill Americans.

Even Joan Bias disagreed with Jane Fonda, which is why she was shunned by the communist where Jane was given the red carpet when she visited Moscow.

John Kerry is a decorated combat veteran. Calling him a coward because he came home and protested the war is really shameful. Who are you to call him a coward?

Many vets came home and protested the war, because they saw what was happening over there. Are they all cowards? If anything, their more brave than those who came home and kept their mouths shut, despite seeing what they saw.

OK, you don’t kike John Kerry, I get that.

But he will be the next Secretary of State, because Obama was re-elected by the people, and that’s his right to appoint the heads of his cabinet.

Jim
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Jim you didn’t read my post again…I said HAD Kerry burned the flag it would have sent the same message as tossing the medals. I think there are some things you don’t do, no matter how upset you are about politics. Flag burning, tossing medals, ginning up a controversy that tends to denegrate your fellow troops are all disgraceful IMO.

I thought that his failure to differentiate between the troops and the war was further evidence of his desire for self aggrandizement and self promotion. I think his claims about atrocities were not because they were a common occurrance or a frequent act by servicemembers but in a desire to serve himself. I think his tour in Vietnam was also orchestrated for maximum self promotion.

I don’t dislike the man, I detest him and have zero respect for him. I am sorry that this is what is chosen to represent our country, bought by the blood and treasure of others.

Elections have consequences…I get that too.

Lisa
 
JimR-OCDS said:
But he will be the next Secretary of State, because Obama was re-elected by the people, and that’s his right to appoint the heads of his cabinet.

Jim
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The operative statement.

John Kerry will undoubtedly be appointed and confirmed, despite the fact that he betrayed his comrades and his religion, because Obama was re-elected, because Obama gets to choose, and because John Kerry is the kind of man Obama would want in that high position.
 
LisaA said:
Jim you didn’t read my post again…I said HAD Kerry burned the flag it would have sent the same message as tossing the medals. I think there are some things you don’t do, no matter how upset you are about politics. Flag burning, tossing medals, ginning up a controversy that tends to denegrate your fellow troops are all disgraceful IMO.

I thought that his failure to differentiate between the troops and the war was further evidence of his desire for self aggrandizement and self promotion. I think his claims about atrocities were not because they were a common occurrance or a frequent act by servicemembers but in a desire to serve himself. I think his tour in Vietnam was also orchestrated for maximum self promotion.

I don’t dislike the man, I detest him and have zero respect for him. I am sorry that this is what is chosen to represent our country, bought by the blood and treasure of others.

Elections have consequences…I get that too.

Lisa
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Kerry had every right to protest against the war he no longer believed in and against the atrocities which he himself saw. Heck, I’ve yet to meet a Vietnam Vet who didn’t see some horrible things carried out by US servicemen. Remember, we had a draft and many of those draftees, came right out of prison.

Blind patriotism in the sight of immorality is more dangerous than a soldier exposing the evils of an unjust war.

Jim
 
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