Oklahoma Catholics: Planned Protests for Black Mass?

[CatholicSooner]

I wasn’t implying that Satan could take Jesus’s place in the host.

If Satan flees from sacramentals like holy water, then why wouldn’t he also flee from something infinitely more sacred? If he does, then how are his worshipers honoring him in any way? Shouldn’t the OCC be among the last places to find Satan if a consecrated host was present?

You are equating Gods powers with Satans. God is everywhere, Satan not so much.

 

[QuestLove]

No need for sarcasm. Yes, I do read the news and am aware of what is going on in the world.

The fact that the barbarous evil is being committed in the middle-east does not detract from the evil of a black mass. A black mass is not a trivial matter, and is viewed significantly evil for two American bishops to call on all the Catholics to engage is a period of fast and dedicated prayer to try to counter this evil, and many Catholics across the world are also joining in with this.

As a Protestant, you may not believe in the real presence, so therefore do not have the same understanding and feelings about what is in effect an actual defilement of Our Lord and God. The first of Christ’s greatest commandments was to love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, and mind. The second commandment was to love your neighbour as you would love yourself. Love of neighbour does not take precedence over over love of God.

I see that you attend a Catholic school so you will therefore have an understanding of what exactly a consecrated host means to Catholics.

Seriously, no sarcasm was intended.
In addition I did not say it wasn’t a big deal to Catholics either. All I’m saying the church may be playing into the trolling of a very small group.

In none of my posts did I mention or trivialize the meaning of the consecrated host. If you care you can go back and read my posts, I may not believe what you believe but I never trivialized your beliefs.

 

[Brendan_64]

Seriously, no sarcasm was intended.
In addition I did not say it wasn’t a big deal to Catholics either. All I’m saying the church may be playing into the trolling of a very small group.

That is possible, but it is also very possible that they are using a consecrated host. Considering that satanists have arranged for a statue of satan with two children to be erected is Oklahoma later this year, it is reasonable to think that satanists are becoming very publicly active in Oklahoma. Bearing that in mind it would be very unwise to simply write off their black mass as an empty gesture and ignore it.

In none of my posts did I mention or trivialize the meaning of the consecrated host. If you care you can go back and read my posts, I may not believe what you believe but I never trivialized your beliefs.

Fair enough, I never meant to imply that, simply to suggest that as a Protestant you may not share our belief and therefore may not feel the same degree of care and concern for the Holy Eucharist.

 

[Thorns]

You are equating Gods powers with Satans. God is everywhere, Satan not so much.

I dont think youre understanding cornbread.

If satan is afraid of holy water and holy prayers, wouldn’t he be more afraid of Jesus Christ? So by brining Jesus to the black mass, wouldn’t that scare away all the invisible evil?

 

[oneofmany]

I dont think youre understanding cornbread.

If satan is afraid of holy water and holy prayers, wouldn’t he be more afraid of Jesus Christ? So by brining Jesus to the black mass, wouldn’t that scare away all the invisible evil?

That may be the case but the sacrilege is still there.

 

[oneofmany]

Fr. Paul Nicholson
2 hrs ·

Is this courage? I don’t think so. Courage is reclaiming the Oklahoma Civic Centre from this horrible outrage. Sending out a press release isn’t courage. Shame on the civil leaders of Oklahoma.

Let’s renew our mortification, our rosaries, and our visits to Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament to stop this “Black Mass” in which a consecrated Host will be spit on and subjected to every vile horror.

And short of these nitwits finding some liquid courage and banning this outrage, let us all try to plan to meet in Oklahoma on September 21st to stand with Our Blessed Lord, and try to console Our Lord’s most wounded Heart.

zenit.org/en/articles/oklahoma-governor-backs-archbishop-in-condemning-black-mass?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+zenit%2Fenglish+%28ZENIT+English%29

 

[byzantium]

If i lived in Oklahoma i would show up to their little ceremony and trash the place.

 

[PTL]

Harvard black Mass was cancelled in campus due to protest. Although later they found an ignorant Chinese restaurant to do it, they dropped using the consecrated host and used a regular wafer. Protest, especially large protest with many people, works.

Sign your petition here. The numbers of signature are growing, the more the better.
This is one way to stand up for your faith. And also pray Rosary to combat this evil.

tfpstudentaction.org/stop-black-mass-oklahoma-city.html

 

[SuS33]

Seems like truly all hell broke loose this Summer. I am literally disgusted with the amount of evil in the world today. From wars to black mass. But I wont give up hope.

Praying to end all this evil

 

[Brendan_64]

So by brining Jesus to the black mass, wouldn’t that scare away all the invisible evil?

By definition, a black mass is not a black mass without a consecrated host. It is an obscene, blasphemous, inversion of a Holy Mass and cannot happen without a consecrated host.

By your definition satan would not be present at all in the universe since God is omnipresent. But that simply is not the case, satan is indeed present in our world, we don’t have to look far to see evil in our world. Where evil is, there is satan.

 

[cornbread_r2]

By definition, a black mass is not a black mass without a consecrated host. It is an obscene, blasphemous, inversion of a Holy Mass and cannot happen without a consecrated host.

Are you getting that requirement from Satanists? If not, wouldn’t it be up to them to decide the requirements for black masses?

By your definition satan would not be present at all in the universe since God is omnipresent. But that simply is not the case, satan is indeed present in our world, we don’t have to look far to see evil in our world. Where evil is, there is satan.

Setting aside the fact that Satan wouldn’t be anywhere if God himself wasn’t sustaining his existence, as I understand it, Satan is not omnipresent so it would seem that he can’t be everywhere there’s evil.

 

[cornbread_r2]

By definition, a black mass is not a black mass without a consecrated host. It is an obscene, blasphemous, inversion of a Holy Mass and cannot happen without a consecrated host.

Are you getting that requirement from Satanists? If not, wouldn’t it be up to them to decide the requirements for black masses?

By your definition satan would not be present at all in the universe since God is omnipresent. But that simply is not the case, satan is indeed present in our world, we don’t have to look far to see evil in our world. Where evil is, there is satan.

Setting aside the fact that Satan wouldn’t be anywhere if God himself wasn’t sustaining his existence, as I understand it, Satan is not omnipresent so it would seem that he can’t be everywhere there’s evil.

More to the point though…

When some Catholics advise others to use blessed water, salt and oil against demons, just what are they hoping to accomplish if not for the demons to vacate the person, home, object, etc.? And again, if those things can be used successfully toward that end, then why wouldn’t a consecrated host be infinitely more effective in ridding the civic center and immediate environs of demons?

 

[Sparkythedog]

If i lived in Oklahoma i would show up to their little ceremony and trash the place.

That ought to show 'em.

 

[oneofmany]

Fr. Paul Nicholson
2 hrs ·

This is so unpleasant to watch, but it gives a pretty interesting picture of the disturbed individual behind the horrible outrage of the planned Black Mass in the Oklahoma Civic Center on September 21.

Please keep up your rosaries, mortifications and abstinence and lets besiege heaven against hell.

Joan Andrews Bell says we should go and be present outside the civic centre on the day of this blasphemy, like the holy women at the foot of the Cross. We should be present to accompany Our Lord, like we do at abortion chambers where the little babies are murdered.

I agree.

youtube.com/watch?v=LSZkL0bIeA0#t=417

 

[TypesAndShadows]

Are you getting that requirement from Satanists? If not, wouldn’t it be up to them to decide the requirements for black masses?

Setting aside the fact that Satan wouldn’t be anywhere if God himself wasn’t sustaining his existence, as I understand it, Satan is not omnipresent so it would seem that he can’t be everywhere there’s evil.

More to the point though…

When some Catholics advise others to use blessed water, salt and oil against demons, just what are they hoping to accomplish if not for the demons to vacate the person, home, object, etc.? And again, if those things can be used successfully toward that end, then why wouldn’t a consecrated host be infinitely more effective in ridding the civic center and immediate environs of demons?

Sacramentals do not have any power in and of themselves: the power they have is purely given by the Grace of God in response to our faith in Him and the Sacraments he has given us. A Sacramental is linked to a Sacrament, and as it recalls this Sacrament for us and we have faith in the Sacraments and in God, this faith and the Grace of God has power to protect us.

A bottle of holy water, nabbed from a piety stall by a satanist and used to wash their face for instance, will not by itself do anything.

 

[Catholic_farmer]

I was thinking about how protective we feel about consecrated hosts and our mere human strengths versus God’s strength. We enjoy His presence and, rightly so, wish to ensure that presence is treated with the reverence it deserves. So, then I was wondering what would happen in the case of a host falling into hostile hands. I suppose there are only a two options. 1). The host remains the Body of Christ or 2) The host ceases to be the Body of Christ. Since we don’t have any way to accomplish the second option, we trust the God will do what God wishes with the host. His ways are unknown to us. So, then, I wondered, would He somehow remove His presence? Well, God can do anything He wants, but I was thinking that, no, He wouldn’t. He cannot be hurt by what His mere creatures do to His presence on earth. We are puny and small. However, what if, by His own ways, the host, which we mourn the loss of, can still change hearts? It’s like bullies in grade school. They harrass and pick on someone and, at the time, it makes them feel bigger. But later? They feel bad, deep down. What effect will it have on the souls of those who would desecrate the host? Will they someday reflect back with regret and shame? If just one person does, is that not worth it to God? His ways are not our ways. We should do all we can, and pray for those who do wrong, but in the end, recognize that God’s will is what will be done and trust Him.

I guess I’m tying to say to protect the host, as much as you can, but don’t let your disgust prevent you from praying for those who mean to desecrate it. A demonstration of what the host means to us Catholics is good. The image of being there, as the woman was at the foot of the cross, is very powerful. But beyond that, pray that God’s will be done and be at peace. Trust Him.

I hope this makes sense. Am I way off here?

 

[cornbread_r2]

Sacramentals do not have any power in and of themselves: the power they have is purely given by the Grace of God in response to our faith in Him and the Sacraments he has given us. A Sacramental is linked to a Sacrament, and as it recalls this Sacrament for us and we have faith in the Sacraments and in God, this faith and the Grace of God has power to protect us.

A bottle of holy water, nabbed from a piety stall by a satanist and used to wash their face for instance, will not by itself do anything.

I’ve been referring to the effect sacramentals have been said to have on Satan and other demons, not Satanists.

 

[TypesAndShadows]

I’ve been referring to the effect sacramentals have been said to have on Satan and other demons, not Satanists.

Yes, and that is what I was directly addressing.

If a satanist, who does not have faith in God and the Sacraments, even bathes in holy water, it makes no difference compared to if it were ordinary water. It does nothing on its own, it has no effect on its own.

Anything else is in the realm of burying statues in the back garden.

 

[cornbread_r2]

Yes, and that is what I was directly addressing.

If a satanist, who does not have faith in God and the Sacraments, even bathes in holy water, it makes no difference compared to if it were ordinary water. It does nothing on its own, it has no effect on its own.

Anything else is in the realm of burying statues in the back garden.

I can’t agree. You’re still referring to how sacramentals might effect Satanists and not the effect that they might have on Satan and other demons. I’ve frequently read on these forums that Satan and other demons flee from the use of sacramentals. Is that not correct?

 

[TypesAndShadows]

I can’t agree. You’re still referring to how sacramentals might effect Satanists and not the effect that they might have on Satan and other demons. I’ve frequently read on these forums that Satan and other demons flee from the use of sacramentals. Is that not correct?

The use of sacramentals by whom?

The sacramentals do not produce sanctifying grace ex opere operato, by virtue of the rite or substance employed, and this constitutes their essential difference from the sacraments. The Church is unable to increase or reduce the number of sacraments as they were instituted by Christ, but the sacramentals do not possess this dignity and privilege. Theologians do not agree as to whether the sacramentals may confer any other grace ex opere operantis through the action of the one who uses them, but the negative opinion is more generally followed, for as the Church cannot confer sanctifying grace nor institute signs thereof, neither can she institute efficacious signs of the other graces which God alone can give. Moreover, as experience teaches, the sacramentals do not infallibly produce their effect. Finally in the euchologic formulas of the sacramentals the Church makes use, not of affirmative, but of deprecatory expressions, which shows that she looks directly to Divine mercy for the effect.

newadvent.org/cathen/13292d.htm