Open Thread on Zimmerman Verdict

[LisaA]

I am grateful when they care enough to CALL and not STALK.

You just cannot handle the truth can you? What makes you claim GZ stalked Martin and that was the cause of the confrontation? How many times does it have to be repeated that GZ was not the instigator of the confrontation.

Lisa

 

[coachkfan1]

As the member of a family with a number of police, because THE POLICE CANNOT BE EVERYWHERE. Police appreciate concerned and observant citizens. The phrase, if you see something, say something applies here.

And no I am NOT talking about vigilante justice, I am talking about GZ’s actual actions of REPORTING the suspicious behavior. If GZ were prone to stalk, confront or shoot suspicious characters, why did it only happen when Martin apparently confronted him?

Again, the testimony and the timeline indicate that GZ had broken off sight contact with Martin (corroborated by Janteal) when he was reporting him. If Martin wanted to escape from the “creepy a** crackah” he should have headed home, rather than confronting him.

Lisa

Right. SAY something not SHOOT something.

 

[LisaA]

But what suspicion did Z have of wrongdoing if it wasn’t race based? I will shut up if someone will answer that for me. I promise.

People have answered you REPEATEDLY. He was “profiled” if you must use that word by his BEHAVIOR. He was behaving suspiciously in a neighborhood that had had a rash of breakins.

Why can’t you accept that had he BEHAVED differently he would still be alive today?
Lisa

 

[LisaA]

Right. SAY something not SHOOT something.

Please lose the bumper stickers and take a moment to consider facts instead of feelings. Use logic instead of just speculation.

You have a very vivid imagination but it does not change the facts.

Lisa

 

[coachkfan1]

You just cannot handle the truth can you? What makes you claim GZ stalked Martin and that was the cause of the confrontation? How many times does it have to be repeated that GZ was not the instigator of the confrontation.

Lisa

Why did he leave his car? Was it because “these a-holes” always get away? I’m going to guess who “these a-holes” are.

 

[coachkfan1]

People have answered you REPEATEDLY. He was “profiled” if you must use that word by his BEHAVIOR. He was behaving suspiciously in a neighborhood that had had a rash of breakins.

Why can’t you accept that had he BEHAVED differently he would still be alive today?
Lisa

I hope the results are not the same when your behavior is deemed suspicious.

 

[LisaA]

But 911 operator said stay in the car.

You keep repeating falsehoods. It was NOT a 911, it was a non emergency line. She said that GZ didn’t need to follow Martin. I don’t believe she demanded he sit in car nor did she have any authority to do so. PLEASE LOOK AT SOME FACTS.

It is so frustrating to respond because you keep making things up

Lisa

 

[Tucker_R]

HA… we do agree on something

Now this I can agree with!

 

[St_Francis]

But what suspicion did Z have of wrongdoing if it wasn’t race based? I will shut up if someone will answer that for me. I promise.

Walking very slowly in the rain looking at the apartments, going on the lawns and looking at the windows, standing still always in the darker area between the street lights…

This was a mixed-race neighborhood. Zimmerman was probably accustomed o see teens of all races walking around, yet he noticed Martin, not because of his race, which was difficult to tell immediately in the dusk and with his hood up over his head.

But his odd behavior seemed suspicious.

 

[coachkfan1]

HA… we do agree on something

When it comes to the Church we probably agree on more than you think. I’m sorry but I just have a problem with the police or anyone stopping and frisking or tailing or anything else based on the wide phrase of “suspicious behavior”.

 

[Jeanne_S]

Yes GZ did have a gun; that most certainly is undisputed.

I know thatYou missed my point.Since the gun seems to be what distresses so many here,to the extent that many think GZ went after TM,because he was feeling emboldened by this.So,my question is all things re this incident including actions leading up to it,remain the same,and TM still pummels GZ, EXCEPT for GZdoesn’t have a gun,how would that impact your view of this incident.

 

[coachkfan1]

Walking very slowly in the rain looking at the apartments, going on the lawns and looking at the windows, standing still always in the darker area between the street lights…

This was a mixed-race neighborhood. Zimmerman was probably accustomed o see teens of all races walking around, yet he noticed Martin, not because of his race, which was difficult to tell immediately in the dusk and with his hood up over his head.

But his odd behavior seemed suspicious.

Ok I can respect what you are saying if that’s what it was. I had not heard that. But was worth getting out with a gun?

 

[MaryT777]

As the member of a family with a number of police, because THE POLICE CANNOT BE EVERYWHERE. Police appreciate concerned and observant citizens. The phrase, if you see something, say something applies here.

And no I am NOT talking about vigilante justice, I am talking about GZ’s actual actions of REPORTING the suspicious behavior. If GZ were prone to stalk, confront or shoot suspicious characters, why did it only happen when Martin apparently confronted him?

Again, the testimony and the timeline indicate that GZ had broken off sight contact with Martin (corroborated by Janteal) when he was reporting him. If Martin wanted to escape from the “creepy a** crackah” he should have headed home, rather than confronting him.

Lisa

I agree the police cannot be everywhere We don’t need citizens acting as police officers; They are not trained to confront or detain suspects. Would your police officer family/friends
tell a citizen to follow some guy that’s suspicious and “suspect” and looks like they are on drugs? That’s dangerous to begin with isn’t it?

I have no problem with GZ reporting suspicious behavior either. I haven’t read one post where anyone had an issue with that.

I wouldn’t go home so some guy following me now knows where I live now. That said if thought the person who was following me was telling the police these ******** always get away and I was a suspect he was following I would be terrified and don’t know what I’d do.

There is no law that says you have to go right home if you are followed. I personally think that would be creepy. I thank God I’ve never been walking through a neighborhood in the rain unarmed and followed by someone you don’t know if they are armed or not.
How terrifying.

 

[april32010]

Blacks that are racist are known to be up random whites? Do you have a verifiable link to stats on how often this happens? Blacks just beating up random whites? Good grief

urbangrounds.com/2011/08/philadelphia-hate-crime/ blogs.citypages.com/blotter/2011/08/black_teenagers_mob_race_riot_wisonsin_state_fair.php frontpagemag.com/2012/frontpagemag-com/7-blacks-beat-up-1-white-youth-in-racial-attack/ theamericanconservative.com/dreher/baton-rouge-family-white-beaten-black-wrong-neighborhood/ http://www.truecrimereport.com/2011/11/kwame_thomas_knockout_game.php http://blogs.chicagotribune.com/news_columnists_ezorn/2010/01/king.html news-gazette.com/news/courts-police-and-fire/2010-09-28/attacks-rise-similar-beatings-reported-2008.html?nomobile=false abclocal.go.com/wpvi/storysection=news/local&id=6043617 hubpages.com/forum/topic/88483 and i could post numerous other incidents,and if you know police officers that don’t spew the politically correct line they will verify this and this has been going on for years

 

[St_Francis]

Information about the stolen jewelry found in Martin’s backpack.

Why was Martin in Sanford? Because he had been suspended from school, officially for writing graffiti. However, a search of his backpack uncovered 12 pieces of stolen jewelry as well as a screwdriver deemed to be a burglary tool.

Why was Martin not charged with possession of stolen goods, and why was this not brought to the attention of the police? Because the chief of the school system police force had decided to reduce crime among the students by not reporting it (!).

So, now we have a young man who had been in possession of stolen jewelry who was wandering around looking in the windows of the apartments. Yes, I know Zimmerman didn’t onow about the stolen jewelry, but it is independent evidence that Martin’s behavior might well have been suspicious.

This is completely aside from the information from Martin’s cellphone and online accounts.

While it is true that Martin was “just a kid,” it is actually not unknown that these “kids” commit crimes completely independently.

 

[april32010]

I agree the police cannot be everywhere We don’t need citizens acting as police officers; They are not trained to confront or detain suspects. Would your police officer family/friends
tell a citizen to follow some guy that’s suspicious and “suspect” and looks like they are on drugs? That’s dangerous to begin with isn’t it?

I have no problem with GZ reporting suspicious behavior either. I haven’t read one post where anyone had an issue with that.

I wouldn’t go home so some guy following me now knows where I live now. That said if thought the person who was following me was telling the police these ******** always get away and I was a suspect he was following I would be terrified and don’t know what I’d do.

There is no law that says you have to go right home if you are followed. I personally think that would be creepy. I thank God I’ve never been walking through a neighborhood in the rain unarmed and followed by someone you don’t know if they are armed or not.
How terrifying.

zimmerman didn’t say ******

 

[coachkfan1]

zimmerman didn’t say ******

What?

 

[Faith1960]

This is pretty much my conclusion as well. Like many things while it’s not justified, it’s understandable. I understand why Zimmerman got out of his car–whether to find a street sign or just to see if Martin were still in view so when the police arrived he could give them the information. With hindsight I think everyone wishes that Zimmerman had not gotten out of the car because the chain of events that resulted in Martin’s death would not have been set in motion. That being said, nothing he did was illegal and while I think it’s plausible he would be looking for a street sign, it’s just as plausable he was looking to see which direction Martin had gone. I do not think he was following Martin at the time of the confronation. I think he’d lost sight of him when he returned to the car.

It’s also understandable why Martin initiated the confrontation. He was probably angry at the “crackah” because HE knew he wasn’t looking for a house to rob and thanks to all of the race baiting and divisiveness in society, thought it was a racially instigated move.

Again, given hindsight poor judgment was shown by both of them. But it does not seem based on the evidence, that Zimmerman should have even been charged.

Lisa

Why do people think its offensive at best, racist at it’s worst to use the “n” word but the black community can say “cracker” till the cows come home and nobody calls them on it?

 

[St_Francis]

Ok I can respect what you are saying if that’s what it was. I had not heard that. But was worth getting out with a gun?

He got out of his car to get information for the police–there is no evidence he stalked or pursued Martin. And the gun was holstered–he already had it on him. He had a concealed-carry license allowing him to do this.

Quite frankly, I am sure that in hindsight Zimmerman thinks he should have stayed in the car. But the problem is that *at the time *getting out of the car to get more information from the police did not seem like a bad idea, precisely because Zimmerman did not think to himself that he was dealing with someone who would hide or double back and attack him.

Because Martin had way more than enough time to get back to where he was staying, and even told Rachel Jeantel that he was close to home.

The biggest mistake made here was Martin’s when he committed a crime by straddling Zimmerman and bashing his head against the sidewalk. No one talks about that mistake.

 

[MaryT777]

zimmerman didn’t say ******

What did he say?