Our Son refused by the priest.

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

We are not talking about the children’s qualifications, we are talking about denying them the grace in the sacrament of baptism through no fault of their own.

Please enlighten us how baptizing a child into the Catholic Faith when they will most likely not be raised in the Faith and surely be given a wholly unhealthy example of their parents living in sin.

To baptize such a child places a large burden upon that child that can not be met as he will not be taught the Faith.

To baptize such a child is a bad thing maybe even worse than not baptizing him.

Anyways, he is not being denied the sacrament. He can approach on his own when he is of age and if he meets the requirements he can be baptized.

 

[TEPO]

Really? To which group do you place my comments of what the guidelines are? What do you prescribe we do, not teach truth; just make people feel good in their current situations so they feel better? What did Jesus say to the woman caught in adultery, “Then Jesus said, “Neither do I condemn you. Go, [and] from now on do not sin any more.”

No one is being condemned here, only instructed in the faith. If that is what you call arrogant, then I guess I am guilty as charged.

PS. Did Jesus paint a ugly picture of the Church that day as well?

Yes, it is arrogant to assume the motives of others. I can go back through your posts and quote them for you if you like, if thats what it takes. you’ve done it several times now…

Other posters have progressed further in calling her a liar… Disgusting!

 

[TheRealJuliane]

Don’t give up and try another church. Where I live we have had our children in the family all baptized and not necessarily are both parents either biological or Catholics, and we have been able to get them baptized. This is a rediculous excuse from the church for not baptizing a child. I am sorry but this is not right. You have full custody of your child, and you should be able to raise him Catholic and get him baptized. God be w/ you and make this happen for you. Hang in there and don’t give up. This is what happens a lot in the Catholic church. A lot of times there are the priest and sometimes the people who make it so difficult and uncomfortable for ppl to want to become more involved in the church, but you have to move away those obstacles and find the priests and the ppl that are kind, respectful and helpful in the church. These are the ones that bring more to our church. Unfortunately you still run into the ones that make it so difficult but see it as a test from God and continue your faith regardless of how difficult they make it. God Bless.

What is “rediculous” is priests that DO baptize against the Church’s requirements. This does not “happen a lot” in the Catholic Church. It happens when people who are not Catholic do not understand our sacraments and treat them like a fast food drive-through - “Here, baptize my children, and can you super-size that please?”

 

[Lapey]

Yes, it is arrogant to assume the motives of others. I can go back through your posts and quote them for you if you like, if thats what it takes. you’ve done it several times now…

Other posters have progressed further in calling her a liar… Disgusting!

You do not have to go back and quote, which one do you want me to repeat, truth doesn’t change…it is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow.

Although, I do not remeber anyone calling the OP a liar…please show me that one.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

Yes, it is arrogant to assume the motives of others. I can go back through your posts and quote them for you if you like, if thats what it takes. you’ve done it several times now…

Other posters have progressed further in calling her a liar… Disgusting!

Out of charity should we not give the benefit of the doubt to the priest who is not present to defend himself?

I am not calling her a liar I am just suggesting that because she is not getting what she wants that she might be presenting what the priest said in a way that will illicit support for her side. She may not even be aware of this bias.

After all there are numerous cases where one may hear something that was not really said, it is part of our human nature. Especially when emotions are involved.

I for one chose to stand on the side of the priest. He is the one involved, it is his decision to make.

We do not have the whole story. We only have what the poster has chosen to tell us.

I think it is very wise for a priest to decide against baptizing a child when the mother, who is not Catholic, approaches to have him baptized. For one thing, neither parent is Catholic. For another, we do not know if the father would agree with this. Has the mother been awarded sole guardianship? Just one of many, many things we do not know about this incident.

 

[FAB]

All due respect Dcn. FAB, as you and I both are charged with this ministry if we were to agree to the baptism, with the information given, we would both be in error. There is no Catholic parent asking for baptism. Her partner is Catholic but has no ties, legally or sacramentally to the mother or the child therefore has no authority to request or approve the baptism. The priest is right in saying no.

If you disagree, what commitment has the partner, the only Catholic, made to show there is a reasonable expectation of a commitment to the relationship or the raising of this child in the faith?

Brother,
There is pastoral and the evangelistic aspect of this that is being overlooked. We also cannot tell from the post what the committment she has with her partner. We are first baptisming the child into the body of Christ, giving them that mark of the Holy Spirit to be able to stand up against evil in their life and to part of enternal salvation.
As I said before, being pastoral and baptisming the child may bring her into the Church and lead the way to sanctifiing the union she and her partner has. It is evangelizing by being and showing the love of Christ as his Church.
Christ said to let the little children come to Him. Perhaps we need to put our trust more in Him.

 

[Cristiano]

What amazes me here is to see how many Catholics take upon themselves the privilege of dispensing other people from the obligations of canon law. It amazes me that instead of helping a soul to get her things in order to come into the Church they prefer to suggest that she acts like the Church is the enemy and needs to be out-witted so that she and her partner can have their own way. Who are we kidding?

 

[Cristiano]

Brother,
There is pastoral and the evangelistic aspect of this that is being overlooked. We also cannot tell from the post what the committment she has with her partner. We are first baptisming the child into the body of Christ, giving them that mark of the Holy Spirit to be able to stand up against evil in their life and to part of enternal salvation.
As I said before, being pastoral and baptisming the child may bring her into the Church and lead the way to sanctifiing the union she and her partner has. It is evangelizing by being and showing the love of Christ as his Church.
Christ said to let the little children come to Him. Perhaps we need to put our trust more in Him.

Deacon would you baptize the child of two unmarried protestants that do not show any practical intention of living according to the Catholic faith even if that is contrary to canon law?

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

What amazes me here is to see how many Catholics take upon themselves the privilege of dispensing other people from the obligations of canon law. It amazes me that instead of helping a soul to get her things in order to come into the Church they prefer to suggest that she acts like the Church is the enemy and needs to be out-witted so that she and her partner can have their own way. Who are we kidding?

It seems to be the problem of today.

As long as its warm fuzzy and makes me feel good, then it is okay.

When we must sacrifice and be obedient, then it is too much of a burden and needs to be dispensed from.

 

[TheRealJuliane]

What amazes me here is to see how many Catholics take upon themselves the privilege of dispensing other people from the obligations of canon law. It amazes me that instead of helping a soul to get her things in order to come into the Church they prefer to suggest that she acts like the Church is the enemy and needs to be out-witted so that she and her partner can have their own way. Who are we kidding?

There are a lot of wishy-washy or poorly catechized Catholics who love these kinds of posts. Even some people who fake being Catholic so they can chime in and pile onto the Church for being “cruel” and “mean” not to hand someone a sacrament like they are getting a Big Mac from McDonald’s.

Mike Huckabee was talking about the Catholic Church last night, of all people. He said he doesn’t understand why the Catholics who have such a problem with the teaching, such as the ones who support access to abortion, remain in the Church. Said that he, as an evangelical Christian, would leave any church if he didn’t believe what they teach. Some of our worst enemies are within.

But, there’s always hope of conversion.

 

[PJM]

=StressedMummy82;9402992]I am a protestant & my partner is a Catholic, he is step father to my son who is 4yrs old an has been since my son was 13months old! My son doesn’t see his Biological father, wouldn’t know him if he passed him in the street! We now have a daughter together & want them both christened, but the priest has refused to christen our son & only our daughter, he’s asked if me or bio dad was catholic, which we are not, and said no then… it’s not the catholic way and handed us a application form for our daughter! I’m really upset about it as its me & my partner who bring up our children not bio dad so does it matter who’s blood he has? Is it really acceptable to leave 1 child out? I thought we would have been welcomed, what has a child done to deserve to be left out. Thanx for reading, & sorry for the essay. X

Here’s WHY

God always and everyehere with compassion and consistancy has taught the singular truth:

Beleive in only One God [ME!]

Only accept, live and practive MY [and ONLY Mine] set of faith beliefs

and Only One Church today’s CC

So if parents desire to be a prat of that ONE CHURCH they MUST adhere to ALL of its Doctrines, Dogmas and Faith beliefs and practices. “ALL”] being critical

If your not married and have no Intention of raising your child in the Church; then why ought the priest agree to permit you to make a commitment that both you and he knows your not going to keep?

As a FYI: Any Christian Baptism is ACCEPTABLE to God and the CC; but the CC expects those Baptized as Catholics to be raised as Catholics Seems reasonable to me:shrug:

I think PERHAPS you have expetations that can’t be met?

PRAY about it.

God Bless you,
pat

 

[TEPO]

You do not have to go back and quote, which one do you want me to repeat, truth doesn’t change…it is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow.

Although, I do not remeber anyone calling the OP a liar…please show me that one.

This is arrogance:
"***why is it so important that your son should be baptized but nothing else in your life is of importance where God is concerned? "

You are living in a relationship which is against Jesus’ teachings"

you yourself are not willing to commit to Christ"

“your partner is evidently not fully committed to his own faith”***

You have no right to assume these things. There is no way you can know. Jesus did not talk like this. Yet you claim this as truth…

 

[TEPO]

Deacon would you baptize the child of two unmarried protestants that do not show any practical intention of living according to the Catholic faith even if that is contrary to canon law?

Why do they have to show it…? Is ones word not enough? So then also a Priest should refuse to forgive the sins of someone who has a track record of committing the same sin, even If he promises not to do it again…? Because he has “shown” that he will not.

 

[TEPO]

Since when did we start “assuming” so much?

 

[Link0126]

Because the important thing is pouring water on the child’s head and having a party afterwards, right?

Children are baptized on account of their parents faith, if that faith doesn’t exist or is so poorly displayed as to cast doubt on the child’s living conditions than no amount of water on the head is going to help.

The Catholic Church is the only church left with any integrity, if you believe the child needs to be “christened” to go to heaven take him to a Protestant church and get him christened. Why defer to his non-biological father who you are currently with? Can I dare ask what would happen if you broke up and got involved with a protestant, say from the Church of Christ. Maybe a rechristening after the age of 7?

 

[LilyM]

We are not talking about the children’s qualifications, we are talking about denying them the grace in the sacrament of baptism through no fault of their own.

The grace of baptism is many things other than a freebie gift - it is also has power and responsibility attached. On the part of the parents as well as the child. And the priest needs at least a real hope that the child will be taught about that power and responsibility so that the grace will not go to waste.

So in a sense yes, the parents have to be ‘qualified’ - that is, they have to understand and commit to keeping their promises. Just like two people who are getting married. Just like a priest who receives Holy Orders. If they don’t understand and are not committed then the sacrament doesn’t help.

So “would be Catholics” are bad? I’m a would be Catholic some days, let me tell you. I’m FAR from perfect so maybe I should give back my paper. God forbid we have 500 baptized children “loose in the world”…maybe they would come back???

People who seek any sacrament (for themselves or on behalf of their children) with no real understanding of the obligations the sacraments iimpose are not ‘bad’ in the sense of being morally wrong, unlike you when you sin. A minister who treats the sacraments so lightly that he does not abide by his duty to at least postpone in case of real doubt and no emergency … well, he may have to answer for how well he performed that duty.

HUH??? If I didn’t know I had the obligations how could I be angry? And what’s that? Catholicism is about choosing to follow God and the Church’s teachings, if it’s merely an obligation, you might want to go somewhere else? And if the did, would that be so bad? So he’s a Methodist Christian or a Lutheran Christian? At least he has faith in Christ. I have never met someone who said, “I am so ticked off my mom had me baptized Catholic.” Never once. They either embrace it or walk away and most that I personally know that walk away, were in very strong Catholic homes and felt oppressed by it. Not siding with them, just saying what at least 5 people I know have said to me. GOOD STRONG Catholic homes.

It happens in threads here all the time. People who were baptised Catholic as children but are not practicing, come onto CAF wanting to know how to ‘leave the Church’ (either because they want to marry in a manner that Canon Law does not permit or for other reasons). When told the truth - that there is no such thing as formally leaving, or at least that since 2009 their situation in practice is unchanged by doing so, they get most upset indeed.

So yes, it happens. Not infrequently, either. Somewhat suprising that they care when they no longer consider themselves Catholic, but boy they sure seem to.

Had they lived? That was said so cold I’m stunned, I have absolutely no response for that. How cruel. My comments stand in light of that brutal remark.

My sincere apologies for how that came across. :grouphug: Put it down to coming from a family of doctors who deal with such things pretty frequently, as well as a bit of late night tiredness and thoughtlessness (different time zone). :flowers:

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

Since when did we start “assuming” so much?

Seems like your assuming much about the priest and his decision.

We know for a fact that this child’s mother is not a Catholic.
I believe she said that the child’s father is not a Catholic.

We know the child’s mother is living in a situation that the Church views as immoral.

From the mother’s post it appears that she does not wish to remedy this nor does she wish to become Catholic.

Since when do non-catholic’s “living in sin” approach the Church to have their child who has no Catholic parents baptized?

 

[TEPO]

Because the important thing is pouring water on the child’s head and having a party afterwards, right?

What a fun game this has become…

I can’t even imagine what having a party has to do with the OP.

 

[Pinoycat]

I am a protestant & my partner is a Catholic, he is step father to my son who is 4yrs old an has been since my son was 13months old! My son doesn’t see his Biological father, wouldn’t know him if he passed him in the street! We now have a daughter together & want them both christened, but the priest has refused to christen our son & only our daughter, he’s asked if me or bio dad was catholic, which we are not, and said no then… it’s not the catholic way and handed us a application form for our daughter! I’m really upset about it as its me & my partner who bring up our children not bio dad so does it matter who’s blood he has? Is it really acceptable to leave 1 child out? I thought we would have been welcomed, what has a child done to deserve to be left out. Thanx for reading, & sorry for the essay. X

That is great! You want your sin to be baptize in the Catholic Church even you are a protestant. Well, as long as you promise to raised your son the catholic faith there is nothing wrong,

 

[Pinoycat]

Seems like your assuming much about the priest and his decision.

We know for a fact that this child’s mother is not a Catholic.
I believe she said that the child’s father is not a Catholic.

We know the child’s mother is living in a situation that the Church views as immoral.

From the mother’s post it appears that she does not wish to remedy this nor does she wish to become Catholic.

Since when do non-catholic’s “living in sin” approach the Church to have their child who has no Catholic parents baptized?

I think the mother is starting to accept the Catholic Faith.