Our Son refused by the priest.

[Link0126]

What a fun game this has become…

I can’t even imagine what having a party has to do with the OP.

The point being that it’s all about the ceremony and she’s not aware of what the obligations are after the fact.

 

[TEPO]

So one is to act as a Catholic before one becomes Catholic.

I thought it was the other way around.

 

[Link0126]

The priest ** allegedly** made a harsh comment.

I actually don’t think the comment was that harsh. It rang true and the truth can be hard to hear sometimes for all of us. But it’s often necessary to bring us to that point where we realize change is necessary. In this case, she is with a Catholic man who believes that marriage is only a “piece of paper” but for some reason believes the children, one which isn’t his by adoption or marriage, should be baptized Catholic. I mean, you can’t have your cake and eat it too. If you don’t believe that marriage is more than a piece of paper you are not in communion with the Church and more closely resemble an Atheist. I mean, think about it.

The situation is a repeat of the last one, with a guy in a long term relationship without marriage. That is a problem and sometimes problems need to be pointed out.

 

[Link0126]

So one is to act as a Catholic before one becomes Catholic.

I thought it was the other way around.

regardless, it would be necessary to at least KNOW how to act. No one is saying the child can never be baptized but that in the current situation it clearly is not appropiate to do so. There is no one in the child’s life that understand and can pass on the faith that the child would then belong to.

I understand you are trying to being understanding and inclusive but at a certain point good intentions are not enough.

 

[TEPO]

I actually don’t think the comment was that harsh. It rang true and the truth can be hard to hear sometimes for all of us. But it’s often necessary to bring us to that point where we realize change is necessary. In this case, she is with a Catholic man who believes that marriage is only a “piece of paper” but for some reason believes the children, one which isn’t his by adoption or marriage, should be baptized Catholic. I mean, you can’t have your cake and eat it too. If you don’t believe that marriage is more than a piece of paper you are not in communion with the Church and more closely resemble an Atheist. I mean, think about it.

The situation is a repeat of the last one, with a guy in a long term relationship without marriage. That is a problem and sometimes problems need to be pointed out.

Well the woman wanted to baptize her kids Catholic. Had posters here just told her about RCIA and not so much about her sins -maybe the Holy Spirit would have been able to work things out for them. Maybe they would have gotten married and became a happy Catholic family.

Hopefully they don’t walk away from this believing that the Church hates them because of their sins… Which were all guilty of.

 

[TEPO]

regardless, it would be necessary to at least KNOW how to act. No one is saying the child can never be baptized but that in the current situation it clearly is not appropiate to do so. There is no one in the child’s life that understand and can pass on the faith that the child would then belong to.

I understand you are trying to being understanding and inclusive but at a certain point good intentions are not enough.

I just think if I were in her position, I would have felt frustrated and possibly resentful… I hope she doesn’t feel that way. That’s not how most Catholics treat people who are taking notice of our Sacraments.

 

[Link0126]

Well the woman wanted to baptize her kids Catholic. Had posters here just told her about RCIA and not so much about her sins -maybe the Holy Spirit would have been able to work things out for them. Maybe they would have gotten married and became a happy Catholic family.

Hopefully they don’t walk away from this believing that the Church hates them because of their sins… Which were all guilty of.

Umm… they did that I know for a fact. And most likely the priest explained his decision and what would be necessary to change it.

 

[SwizzleStick]

Last year we had a mother and father and their two babies all come into the church at the same time after the parents went through RCIA. It was beautiful.

If the OP could do that with her family and be married too, that would be wonderful! A day of Sacraments for the entire family would be such a joyous occasion!

 

[Link0126]

I just think if I were in her position, I would have felt frustrated and possibly resentful… I hope she doesn’t feel that way. That’s not how most Catholics treat people who are taking notice of our Sacraments.

I probably would have too. But then again feelings are not objective, they are subjective. I feel frustrated at the slightest inconvenience so I know what it’s like. However, that’s my problem not anyone else’s.

and exactly our Sacraments, which is exactly why the Church is making a big deal of Baptism and not taking it lightly.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

Its threads like this as well as actual conversations like this in the “real” world that I believe are the greatest detriment to vocations today.

 

[TEPO]

My apologies to Lapey. I may have been a bit hard on him. I think some of my frustrations stem from my own inability to get my own youngest daughter Baptized… You see, the diocese seems to have a rule here that I must have been a parishioner for at least one year before I can get her Baptized… I know I’ll be moving again before then, so it’s going to be a long time waiting. I think they do it that way here because they “assume” that my family must not go to Church regularly.

That played a major role in why I was attacking assumptions so fiercely. Sorry for that.

In other words, I feel the OP’s pain.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

My apologies to Lapey. I may have been a bit hard on him. I think some of my frustrations stem from my own inability to get my own youngest daughter Baptized… You see, the diocese seems to have a rule here that I must have been a parishioner for at least one year before I can get her Baptized… I know I’ll be moving again before then, so it’s going to be a long time waiting. I think they do it that way here because they “assume” that my family must not go to Church regularly.

That played a major role in why I was attacking assumptions so fiercely. Sorry for that.

In other words, I feel the OP’s pain.

Your case is a wholly different one than the OP’s.

If I was the priest in your case and you spoke to me about your situation I believe that we would come to a totally different ending than what happened to you. I do feel, with the information that I have here, that you were wronged.

In the OP’s case I would have come to the same conclusion as has been reached.

Two totally different cases.

I will pray that this get resolved for the good. I will be praying about both of them.

 

[Robertanthony]

I think we’ve lost stressedmummy82. The best to you, OP (original poster). If a Catholic baptism for your son is what you absolutely want, RCIA (Rite of Christian Initiation of Adults–>necessary step/process to become Catholic) is the way to go for you. Otherwise as others have pointed out, a Christian baptism is also valid in God’s eyes. I’m sorry if you have felt offended by some of the posts here. Best of success, and God’s blessings.

 

[fred_conty]

My apologies to Lapey. I may have been a bit hard on him. I think some of my frustrations stem from my own inability to get my own youngest daughter Baptized… You see, the diocese seems to have a rule here that I must have been a parishioner for at least one year before I can get her Baptized… I know I’ll be moving again before then, so it’s going to be a long time waiting. I think they do it that way here because they “assume” that my family must not go to Church regularly.

That played a major role in why I was attacking assumptions so fiercely. Sorry for that.

In other words, I feel the OP’s pain.

I thought that the baby should be baptized as soon as possible after birth according to church law. Usually that means within a week if possible. And from this it would seem that all children under the age of reason should have this done.

Call the bishop’s office and have this checked out.
Usually they are online. Just send a message.

 

[Lapey]

My apologies to Lapey. I may have been a bit hard on him. I think some of my frustrations stem from my own inability to get my own youngest daughter Baptized… You see, the diocese seems to have a rule here that I must have been a parishioner for at least one year before I can get her Baptized… I know I’ll be moving again before then, so it’s going to be a long time waiting. I think they do it that way here because they “assume” that my family must not go to Church regularly.

That played a major role in why I was attacking assumptions so fiercely. Sorry for that.

In other words, I feel the OP’s pain.

No need tp appologize to me, I would rather you go back and read my first post in context of the OP’s first post. RCIA was mention at the very onset of this conversation. Also, those assumptions you accuse others of making are taken from the words of the OP about the situation, so my friend they are not assumptions, they are facts put forth by the OP.

I would hope that people could go back and learn what the Church truly teaches, then practice it, not come here or out in the world and profess what they believe to be truth. We preach the Gospel of Jesus, not of us.

 

[Lapey]

Brother,
There is pastoral and the evangelistic aspect of this that is being overlooked. We also cannot tell from the post what the committment she has with her partner. We are first baptisming the child into the body of Christ, giving them that mark of the Holy Spirit to be able to stand up against evil in their life and to part of enternal salvation.
As I said before, being pastoral and baptisming the child may bring her into the Church and lead the way to sanctifiing the union she and her partner has. It is evangelizing by being and showing the love of Christ as his Church.
Christ said to let the little children come to Him. Perhaps we need to put our trust more in Him.

Sorry brother, but there is no pastoral or evengelical portion of the law and guidlines to the sacrament of baptism itself, that comes into play when the people approach the priest or deacon for the initial conference and all contact after that leading up to the baptism. We as clergy do not have that right for any reason but danger of death to disreguard the guidlines. It’s that simple. You could decide to do the baptism, but it would be an ilicit action.

Please do not quoite scropture to contradict law, they work in harmony and are not opposed. Read that quote in context with the truth in mind, you will see this is not what it is saying.

The evengelical and pastoral part of this comes in the office, not in the baptistry.

 

[FAB]

Deacon would you baptize the child of two unmarried protestants that do not show any practical intention of living according to the Catholic faith even if that is contrary to canon law?

The issue of the origianl poster and your question are unrelated. The origanal poster may not be Catholic, but there seems to be a willingness to raise her Catholic. She is making thast commitment with her daughter form this relationship.

But to play along, to answer your specific question no, with one exception, if the child was in danger of death.

 

[FAB]

Sorry brother, but there is no pastoral or evengelical portion of the law and guidlines to the sacrament of baptism itself, that comes into play when the people approach the priest or deacon for the initial conference and all contact after that leading up to the baptism. We as clergy do not have that right for any reason but danger of death to disreguard the guidlines. It’s that simple. You could decide to do the baptism, but it would be an ilicit action.

Please do not quoite scropture to contradict law, they work in harmony and are not opposed. Read that quote in context with the truth in mind, you will see this is not what it is saying.

The evengelical and pastoral part of this comes in the office, not in the baptistry.

Brother, I have to disagree with you. The canon says resonable expectation that the child will be raised Catholic. Since the daughter is apparently being baptised and will be raise in the faith, there can be an expectation that the son would be as well. Both children are hers.

I will point out that any part of the canon can have a dispensation based on pastoral reasons. We need to look beyond the law and look at what message this action is sending to the boy, and how that could effect his future believe and faith. will he have questions that the Church accepted his his sister amd he was not good enough? Is he being marked with the sins of the mother? We have clergy cannot always just take the law and say that’s final. If we do we are not being pastoral, just rule follows and we see how well that has worked out in the past.

 

[Lapey]

Brother, I have to disagree with you. The canon says resonable expectation that the child will be raised Catholic. Since the daughter is apparently being baptised and will be raise in the faith, there can be an expectation that the son would be as well. Both children are hers.

I will point out that any part of the canon can have a dispensation based on pastoral reasons. We need to look beyond the law and look at what message this action is sending to the boy, and how that could effect his future believe and faith. will he have questions that the Church accepted his his sister amd he was not good enough? Is he being marked with the sins of the mother? We have clergy cannot always just take the law and say that’s final. If we do we are not being pastoral, just rule follows and we see how well that has worked out in the past.

Please let us take our side conversation to private messages.

 

[englishredrose]

In my opinion this thread was handled as awfully as possible… Did anyone mention why it’s important to become Catholic, or what it means to be part of the Church…? You know that by just browsing through this thread, everyone here with the exception of one maybe two come off as completely arrogant. We’ve really painted an ugly picture of the Church today. Its been a disappointment.

Actually, I did attempt to do just that when I explained the importance of joining in the Lords Family, The Church. Naturally I couldn’t expand because I don’t know what the Catholic Church precisely teaches. But the importance of becoming rather than just the label was my actual aim even if it was overlooked and I am sorry but I am hopeless at bringing in quotes to the post:blush: to back up what I mean so you’ll have to search them yourself and try re reading the one post where I say about joining the community.