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iamrefreshed
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No, I don’t see the absurdity. The majority of Palistinians (I hate that word) want Israel to disappear from the face of the earth (along with the Jews).
So, was it the same church?
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So, was it the same church?
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Raskolnikov
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Can you prove that? Also, whjat percentage of Israelis would like the Palestinians to disappear off the face of the planet. Many are intent carting them “back” to Jordan. Other Israeli officials prefer to encourage abortion among Palestinians in order to reduce the population. So far, I would note, Israelis have been far more effective at killing Palestinians (and I mean Palestinian civilians) that Palestinians have been at killing Israelis. Many times more successful, in fact.No, I don’t see the absurdity. The majority of Palistinians (I hate that word) want Israel to disappear from the face of the earth (along with the Jews).
So, was it the same church?
And why do you hate using the word? Do you think that Palestinians don’t exist? They are just 4 million ‘unpersons’ or something? Perhaps if Canada invaded Ohio, I imagine you would agree with the Canadians that there is no such thing as Ohio, and would ask be to go “bakc” to Pennsylvania?
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O_Duirnin
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A fair proportion of the Israeli people (including some in the Government) would quite like every last non-Jewish person wiped off the face of historical Palestine (by that I mean present-day Israel, the West Bank and Gaza) too. Both of these positions are a barrier to peace.No, I don’t see the absurdity. The majority of Palistinians (I hate that word) want Israel to disappear from the face of the earth (along with the Jews).
So, was it the same church?
I’m not too familiar with the event (I’ve only become a follower of the Palestinian question) more recently, but a brief perusal of the Internet has led me to discover that Latin Patriarch of Jerusalem in fact allowed the Palestinian militants to claim the ancient right of sanctuary in the Church, and I’ve also come across a quotation from the Franciscan Custodian of the Holy Land referring to Israeli actions at the time as an ‘indescribable act of barbarity’, and condemnation of Israel’s actions from various Governments, including Britain’s. The hostage taking you refer to simply didn’t happen, it was the Israelis who prevented clergy from moving freely in and out of the building.
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iamrefreshed
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A simple web search will prove the hatred of Israelis by most “Palistinians”. I don’t need to prove the earth flat.
I hate the word because there is no, nor was their ever, a Palestine. So, no, Palistinians don’t exist.
No one was invaded so your analogy is silly.
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estesbob
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Actually Israel was invaded!A simple web search will prove the hatred of Israelis by most “Palistinians”. I don’t need to prove the earth flat.
I hate the word because there is no, nor was their ever, a Palestine. So, no, Palistinians don’t exist.
No one was invaded so your analogy is silly.
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O_Duirnin
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My Great-Uncle must have been fantasising about his time spent in the ‘Palestine Police Force’ then, as well as the entity universally known as the ‘British Mandate of Palestine’ he served in?A simple web search will prove the hatred of Israelis by most “Palistinians”. I don’t need to prove the earth flat.
I hate the word because there is no, nor was their ever, a Palestine. So, no, Palistinians don’t exist.
No one was invaded so your analogy is silly.
I should add that your position goes far beyond anything even the more hawkish elements of the Israeli establishment have said in public in recent years.
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Raskolnikov
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My analogy was quite accurate in fact. Jewish settlers invaded the British Mandate of Palestine. They used acts of violence against the British to drive them out. I don’t say that anything should be done about it. What’s done is done. Most countries, including are own, were only founded upon the blood of those who came before us. No point in squabbling over ancient history. It is simply inane to try to disestablish Israel. However, the situation of the Palesitinians is not ancient history. The Arabs living their were largely displaced by the Israeli settlement, and those who remain there are occupied by the Israeli state.A simple web search will prove the hatred of Israelis by most “Palistinians”. I don’t need to prove the earth flat.
I hate the word because there is no, nor was their ever, a Palestine. So, no, Palistinians don’t exist.
No one was invaded so your analogy is silly.
Now, what examctly do you call the Palestinians? Because if there never was a Palestine, you know the implication of that is, right? That would make them Israelis Arabs, no? So what we have, then, is an Israeli state that systematically denies rights and citizenship to a segment of the population. They were born there, and by ius solis rights they should have citizenship and all the rights of an Israelis citizen, equal under the law? Or not?
Really, your situation is nonsense. They don’t exist, ergo we can do whatever we want wit hthem. Do yous ee how Orwellian you sound? Let me ask you this, do you think the Israeli government has a right to claim all land between the Mediterranean and the Jordan River? Do you think it has a right to expel all Palestinian Arabs from their homeland?
And you refer me to an ambiguous web search? That’s your evidence. I’ll try hat from now on. I’ll use that as a cite in one of may papers: ‘footnote 5: just google it, it’s there.’
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Raskolnikov
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So, do you just pretend that history started in 1948 or something? Settlers arrived and settled the region of the British Mandate of Palestine, without permission. They were illegal immigrants. They then started an insurgency with the intention of setting up a state. That’s a matter of history, I don’t see how you can’t get this.
Perhaps American history teachers should start saying that in fact there was no American Revolution. The United States always existed. Or perhaps is just sprung out of the ground.
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iamrefreshed
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How do settlers invade?
What army uniform did these Jews wear?Who says Jus Solis is right?
Who said “they can do what they want with them”?
They can go back to Jordan. We really wouldn’t have this mess if the Jews just did what the Arab nations wanted and died.
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iamrefreshed
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So you want all American illegal immigrants deported immediately?So, do you just pretend that history started in 1948 or something? Settlers arrived and settled the region of the British Mandate of Palestine, without permission. They were illegal immigrants. They then started an insurgency with the intention of setting up a state. That’s a matter of history, I don’t see how you can’t get this.
Perhaps American history teachers should start saying that in fact there was no American Revolution. The United States always existed. Or perhaps is just sprung out of the ground.
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EmperorNapoleon
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A more apt term would be illegal immigrants and, in the case of Palestine, it is tantamount to invasion since the Israeli government has historically annexed Palestinian territory under the guise of national security once the illegal immigrants, aka settlers, gain a strong enough foothold in any given area.How do settlers invade?
None of the Jewish terrorist groups had military uniforms, however, the Israeli government issued the Lehi Ribbon in 1980 to surviving members of one of these groups for what it described as “military service.” Of course, that “military service” included collaboration with Nazi Germany, sabotaging allied railroads, assassination, and massacring Palestinian civilians.
1961 Convention on the Reduction of Statelessness of which Israel happens to be a signatory.
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iamrefreshed
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Arabs who refused citizenship don’t get a do over.
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EmperorNapoleon
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I don’t recall Israel offering citizenship to Palestinian Arabs between shellings. What I do recall is that Israel forced hundreds of thousands of Palestinian Arabs out and left them to rot in refugee camps.
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Raskolnikov
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I suppose you think that about the Palestinians. They should just die, right? And you missed the point about Jordan. They were never in Jordan, hence why “back” was in quotes. Why should they be forced to leave their homeland.How do settlers invade?
Who says Jus Solis is right?
Who said “they can do what they want with them”?
They can go back to Jordan. We really wouldn’t have this mess if the Jews just did what the Arab nations wanted and died.
You also refuse to read what does not fit into whatever ludicrous straw man you have in your head. I explicitly said that I oppose any plan to end the existence of the Israeli state.
And the tactic of equating the Israeli government with the jews (in spite of the obvious fact that most Jews are not Israelis) is a common anti-Semitic ploy used to blame Jews for the actions of the Palestinian state, and I warn you to reject it. Netanyahu does not speak for Jews. He can only speak as the head of state of the Israelis state. And The policies of the Israelis state are not the policies of “Jewry.” You shouls abondon that opinion.
No. Neither did the British try to deport all of the Jewish settlers. It was only when they started trying to overthrow the British sovereignty over the region that they put up mild opposition but eventually gave way.
I suppose if a bunch of Mexican immigrants began moving to Texas en masse and bombing military bases and killing American troops in order to set up their own state (they did, after all, have Texas a mere 170 years ago), would you oppose such an action?
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Raskolnikov
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So because an Arab baby is born an Arab baby, he doesn’t get citizenship because of the “original sin” of his father or grandfther? Or, better yet, no matter what his father or grandfather did, he gets no cirizenship because he is an Arab, and because the Arabs collectively rejected Israelis citizenship?
I presume then you don’t believe in individual rights or individual responsibility, cinceyour view of the Arabs is so disgustingly collectivist.
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iamrefreshed
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Which shellings? The ones Arabs did after they told Arabs to flee Israel and come back after we’ve killed all the Jews?
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O_Duirnin
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So it’s perfectly fair that a person with one Jewish grandparent, living in North America or Europe, with no connection whatsoever to Israel, can turn up at Tel Aviv Airport and pick up an Israeli passport, whereas a Palestinian Arab, born and raised on what is now Israeli territory, can’t?
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iamrefreshed
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Yes. Their country, their rules.
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Raskolnikov
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No, the ones the Israelis have been almost perpetually carrying out against the Palestinians for seventy years. The degree of your naivete is startling. Are you aware that the number of Palestinians killed by Israelis since 2000 is over four times the number of Israelis killed by Palestinians? It seems the Israelis are (and always have been) doing the vast majority oif the shelling.Which shellings? The ones Arabs did after they told Arabs to flee Israel and come back after we’ve killed all the Jews?
unispal.un.org/UNISPAL.NSF/0/BE07C80CDA4579468525734800500272
And even the strongest apologist sof Israel’s actions, such as Joan Peters, concede that Arabs remained in what would become Israel in large numbers. West bank and Gaza, for example, were always predominantly Arab. Galilee was as well before 1948, and contrary to the immigration theory proposed by her, in fact the immigrants were largely expelled by force or moved under duress. You ma yas well at least read her book. The read her sources. Her accounting of demographic changes as recorded by the Hope-Simpson report (a British report on immigration in Palestine) do not add up.
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Raskolnikov
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So you wouldn’tve minded when the German government started shipping Jews and Gypsies off to the camps? “Their countr, their rules”? What about the Chinese governments oppresssion of Christian Churches? Still “their country, their rules?”
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