Panetta to lift ban on women in combat

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fyi to the sarcastic people who are absolutely convinced in their own rightness: yes, i used the example of one woman. but this one woman changed lives. there are women out there who have done or are currently doing what this woman did, changing lives with their bravery. though i used an example, you are making assumptions too. you are assuming every woman who ever wants to join the army is a 90 lb. woman who can barely carry more than 10 lbs. that is simply not true. i’m not saying that every woman can be a Nancy Wake, but there is a chance that some could. not every man is fit for the military, but you don’t question the fallacy that any man is stronger than any woman. bottom line is that if a woman is strategic enough, brave enough, and strong both physically and mentally, there is no reason that she should not serve our country if that is what she wants to do.
The people you need to complain to about the assumption that women are physically weaker than men would be the doctors, scientists, and military officials that came to that conclusion after conducting actual research on the subject (yeah, the military does do actual research). Hence the gender based scoring system for the Army physical fitness test.
 
Women should not be exposed to captivity by the enemy.

Also, male captives who refuse to spill secrets will now have to face being forced to watch their female colleagues beaten and raped to make them talk.
 
Also, modern warfare is so different from war of the past. Physical fitness while important, is not as vital as it used to be.
:rotfl: Says someone that has never conducted fire team rushes with a gas mask on, or tumbled down a hill on patrol at zero dark thirty hours.
 
My husband hates the idea. He is active duty. But we knew this was coming a long time ago so it isn’t a surprise. Many female soldiers want this and a few men too. Personally I think it’s a bad precedent. That being said, when I was young before I had kids of my own I would have been for it. Now, especially having two daughters, I don’t like it. It’s bad enough with my husband and sons. Don’t want my girls too
Well… when one of your girls comes back missing her arm and getting overlooked and passed up by young men paying all their attention to those newly arrived Latinas her age, now walking on Miami beach with both their arms and sexy bodies, she can look at her medals. She can take peace and comfort in equality in war. As she sits alone. And that sitting alone turns into years. And those years into more wrinkles on her face.
 
Lots of machismo in this thread. Probably the same group of people that would see women uneducated, barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen once again.

Move on. It’s the 21st century. Grow up already.
 
It’s a wonderful story…I can see a made for TV movie coming out next year! OTOH this isn’t a very realistic scenario vis a vis women in combat today.

Again can anyone answer why? (other than the ideology of the Obama administration). I swear I might need a tinfoil hat soon. I keep seeing stark evidence that Obama wants to emasculate our military in every way possible. From the refusal to call the Ft Hood Shooter an Islamic terrorist to forcing chaplains to marry homosexuals and having openly homosexual troops to this latest counter productive move. It seems to be a well orchestrated plan with these stark changes simply sprung upon the unsuspecting public and the poor troops who have to adapt to his bizarre idea of what a military is supposed to do…you know kill bad guys and blow things up.

Lisa
The U.S. military has bases in 100+ countries still.

It could use A LOT MORE emasculation than Obama is giving it.

We are paying for drones to murder innocent children in the middle east while American children are still homeless and hungry.
 
Lots of machismo in this thread. Probably the same group of people that would see women uneducated, barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen once again.

Move on. It’s the 21st century. Grow up already.
Oh the irony…😃
 
Lots of machismo in this thread. Probably the same group of people that would see women uneducated, barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen once again.

Move on. It’s the 21st century. Grow up already.
I’d say that this thread is leaning more toward “I never served in the military and have no clue about it, but I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express” type comments than “women belong in the kitchen sans shoes” type comments. But, I guess I qualify as “one of those people” since my actual experience in the military and combat leads me to the conclusion that this is a bad idea.
 
The U.S. military has bases in 100+ countries still.

It could use A LOT MORE emasculation than Obama is giving it.

We are paying for drones to murder innocent children in the middle east while American children are still homeless and hungry.
It’s not a “either pay for this or pay for that” scenario. We can feed kids in the US and use our drones to, as you so inaccurately put it, “murder innocent children” elsewhere.
 
It’s not a “either pay for this or pay for that” scenario. We can feed kids in the US and use our drones to, as you so inaccurately put it, “murder innocent children” elsewhere.
I am just in favor of the not murdering children at all option!

But that’s about as likely as stopping abortion, right? :mad:
 
I think we all know not many are “stronger”. That’s why, for example, the training of male Marines is a lot more demanding than it is for female Marines.

Since the great majority of actual front line soldiers are, and have always been men, some consideration ought to be given to their safety and ability to perform. That, and not political correctness, should govern decisions like this.

The only modern state that used women in combat was Israel and it quit doing it.

But I think we all know political correctness trumps all nowadays.
Amen brother! 😦
 
Both my husband and I are in the military.

We are the same age but my PT requirements are far easier then his. Put it this way…meeting the bare minimum standards for men is considered “excellent” by female standards.

That alone tells me that females absolutely CANNOT be considered for infantry positions.

If they can be…then ALL females should meet the same requirements as men for PT. If we are considered equal.

Women are not GI Jane. We are not designed for combat.
Men aren’t psychologically able to handle a woman fighting alongside them on the battlefield. Men will do stupid and dangerous things and disobey orders when they see a female in trouble based on human nature and instinct.

Women face an even greater danger in POW camps then men and aren’t designed to handle being a POW.

If you place females in direct combat with men then feelings will arise and relationships will start and women will be in theatre, engaging the enemy, and will be pregnant (I say will because this is a problem that happens ALL THE TIME now) and suddenly an innocent life is in danger as well.

When my husband was deployed, three girls in his unit were sent home due to them finding out they were pregnant. And he was deployed with a services unit.
Really? This is what we want for our military?

It baffles my mind why people want women in the military so badly.
Personally, I think the military should be totally closed to all women.

Yes, I know that woman have played an critical role in every war. They were nurses, surgeons, pilots, drivers, mechanics, cooks, secretaries…you name it and they did it from all wars we have fought in this country. But the second you start making arguments that women should be able to fight in infantry units, or special forces (God forbid)…when they aren’t even expected to meet the standard PT requirements for every branch that the men are expected to meet…then you lose all of your credibility as a solid and feared military.

First things first. Expect all women…across the board…age bracket to age bracket…to meet the exact same PT standards as men.
It will never happen and a vast majority of the woman would not be able to stay in the military.
I would be one of them. Even when I was in the best shape of my life, I could barely meet the minimum standards the males were required of in PT and I was scoring a 96% on my PT tests.
Out of the 40 girls in my flight at basic training…I think only 3 could comfortably meet the male requirements…and more then 3/4s of us were scoring in the high 90%s for PT.

Women are more likely to be raped while in the military and those rapes are more likely to happen during a deployment and be swept under the rug.

Why in the world do we think it’s okay for women to serve in combat positions?

Pregnancy, rape, children being abandoned at home, divorces piling up…it’s not a good thing to deploy women and it’s an even worse thing to allow them to serve in infantry units.
 
We don’t murder kids with our drones.
Absolutely true.

This country goes to EXTREME lengths to prevent the killing of innocent women and children.

Even if it’s a hot target that we’ve been watching for months and months…we absolutely will not engage them when there are women and children in the picture.

I know this because it’s my husband’s job in the military to call out strikes for predator drone pilots.
He watches the feed and makes recommendations on when to strike or not.

Anyone who thinks otherwise is reading only myths and will need to prove that we regularly kill women and children with our drones.

It doesn’t happen.
 
Both my husband and I are in the military.

We are the same age but my PT requirements are far easier then his. Put it this way…meeting the bare minimum standards for men is considered “excellent” by female standards.

That alone tells me that females absolutely CANNOT be considered for infantry positions.

If they can be…then ALL females should meet the same requirements as men for PT. If we are considered equal.

Women are not GI Jane. We are not designed for combat.
Men aren’t psychologically able to handle a woman fighting alongside them on the battlefield. Men will do stupid and dangerous things and disobey orders when they see a female in trouble based on human nature and instinct.

Women face an even greater danger in POW camps then men and aren’t designed to handle being a POW.

If you place females in direct combat with men then feelings will arise and relationships will start and women will be in theatre, engaging the enemy, and will be pregnant (I say will because this is a problem that happens ALL THE TIME now) and suddenly an innocent life is in danger as well.

When my husband was deployed, three girls in his unit were sent home due to them finding out they were pregnant. And he was deployed with a services unit.
Really? This is what we want for our military?

It baffles my mind why people want women in the military so badly.
Personally, I think the military should be totally closed to all women.

Yes, I know that woman have played an critical role in every war. They were nurses, surgeons, pilots, drivers, mechanics, cooks, secretaries…you name it and they did it from all wars we have fought in this country. But the second you start making arguments that women should be able to fight in infantry units, or special forces (God forbid)…when they aren’t even expected to meet the standard PT requirements for every branch that the men are expected to meet…then you lose all of your credibility as a solid and feared military.

First things first. Expect all women…across the board…age bracket to age bracket…to meet the exact same PT standards as men.
It will never happen and a vast majority of the woman would not be able to stay in the military.
I would be one of them. Even when I was in the best shape of my life, I could barely meet the minimum standards the males were required of in PT and I was scoring a 96% on my PT tests.
Out of the 40 girls in my flight at basic training…I think only 3 could comfortably meet the male requirements…and more then 3/4s of us were scoring in the high 90%s for PT.

Women are more likely to be raped while in the military and those rapes are more likely to happen during a deployment and be swept under the rug.

Why in the world do we think it’s okay for women to serve in combat positions?

Pregnancy, rape, children being abandoned at home, divorces piling up…it’s not a good thing to deploy women and it’s an even worse thing to allow them to serve in infantry units.
The only combat MOSs I see as being viable for women would be the aviation ones.
 
90 pound woman carrying 100 pounds of gear on a 5 mile movement to contact.

Let me know if you need another…
It reminds me of a segment John Stossel did for 20/20 many years ago about women becoming firefighters. In it, they had film of women trying to do some of the labor that comes with the job wearing the heavy gear firemen wear and failing at it. One woman was trying to position a rather large ladder that she couldn’t handle. The ladder was too much for her and she struggled tremendously and if I remember correctly, the ladder started falling to the ground pulling her with it. :o And then afterwards, NOW got real, real upset at ABC for airing this segment and demanded Stossel to be reprimanded . If I’m not mistaken they wanted him fired! :rolleyes: The thing is, my father who was a Baltimore City Firefighter confirmed much of what Stossel was showing.
 
It reminds me of a segment John Stossel did for 20/20 many years ago about women becoming firefighters. In it, they had film of women trying to do some of the labor that comes with the job wearing the heavy gear firemen wear and failing at it. One woman was trying to position a rather large ladder that she couldn’t handle. The ladder was too much for her and she struggled tremendously and if I remember correctly, the ladder started falling to the ground pulling her with it. :o And then afterwards, NOW got real, real upset at ABC for airing this segment and demanded Stossel to be reprimanded . If I’m not mistaken they wanted him fired! :rolleyes: The thing is, my father who was a Baltimore City Firefighter confirmed much of what Stossel was showing.
Right, women can fullfill being brave but upper body strength or strength in general is a different matter. How about West Point requirements for pushups, pullups, run a mile? Distinctly different for a woman.
 
Right, women can fullfill being brave but upper body strength or strength in general is a different matter. How about West Point requirements for pushups, pullups, run a mile? Distinctly different for a woman.
Absolutely! I’m a Baltimore Ravens fan. Can you imagine a woman getting clocked full bore by a young Ray Lewis? :signofcross: I mean, they’d be writing her obituary afterwards. 😉
 
Men aren’t psychologically able to handle a woman fighting alongside them on the battlefield. Men will do stupid and dangerous things and disobey orders when they see a female in trouble based on human nature and instinct.
Some say that but I have my doubts that this is some universal truth.
Women face an even greater danger in POW camps then men and aren’t designed to handle being a POW.
To be fair… neither are men. Actually, given some of the POW-like domestic violence environments women are in I might be more inclined to think women have more experience with being a POW than men. And they don’t have to leave outside country to experience it.

That said… overall I agree with you that women in general do not do well with the physical requirements of infantry life. Which is much more demanding that PT or PT tests in the military.
 
The U.S. military has bases in 100+ countries still.

It could use A LOT MORE emasculation than Obama is giving it.

We are paying for drones to murder innocent children in the middle east while American children are still homeless and hungry.
A specious and meritless argument.
Lisa
 
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