Phoenix Arizona Diocese Cathedral Won't Allow Girls Serve On Altar

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Brendan said:
Would you tell Bernadette that her image is wrong. Or perhaps the villagers in Knock, or the Vietnamese in La Vang?

And we also have ‘photographic’ proof of Our Lady’s appearance to St. Juan Diego.
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Brendan, I don’t know if you posted this later in the thread, but can I have a link to the photographic proof please?

Thanks.
 
louis91766 said:
How come there are so many abuses? Does this mean that Catholic priests don’t take the Church rules seriously?
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Humans are not created to obey rules; rules are made to serve human needs. Our parish priests (Dominicans) don’t regard the rule excluding young people from reading the gospel as edifying or useful to the life of the parish.

StAnastasia
 
StAnastasia said:
Humans are not created to obey rules; rules are made to serve human needs. Our parish priests (Dominicans) don’t regard the rule excluding young people from reading the gospel as edifying or useful to the life of the parish.

StAnastasia
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:eek:

Well, the cafeteria is open for business.
 
StAnastasia said:
Our parish priests (Dominicans) don’t regard the rule excluding young people from reading the gospel as edifying or useful to the life of the parish.
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It isn’t their call to make….and insubordination breeds more insubordination. Where’s your bishop?
Ishii, then in our parish it’s a joyful and edifying abuse.
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Thereby negating basic virtues like obedience and humility which helps one grow in true spirituality? Doesn’t make sense.
 
Tigg said:
It isn’t their call to make….and insubordination breeds more insubordination. Where’s your bishop?

In his episcopal residence.
Thereby negating basic virtues like obedience and humility which helps one grow in true spirituality? Doesn’t make sense.
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StAnastasia said:
Hmm – obedience and humility vs. inculcating in young people a sense that they too are an active and participatory part of the Church? Tough call.
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Not a tough call…a false choice. You can encourage active participation with obedience and humility.
 
DaddyGirl said:
Oops.
I guess the spiritual enrichment thing happens by accident.
But I guess…if it’s not the purpose of serving at the altar, then we can always try squash that, too.
We wouldn’t want anyone assisting the priest to actually enjoy it, or allow it to make them feel closer to God or their faith or anything terrible like that.
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You have misunderstood completely. Spriritual enrichment is a wonderful effect of serving at the altar but it isn’t the purpose of serving at the altar. The same can be said about so many things. Example - Bible study. Is the purpose of going to a Bible study group fellowship? No! The purpose is to be immersed in the Word of God. A wonderful effect of Bible Study is fellowship with fellow Catholics.

Is the purpose of altar serving the enrichment of the servers? No! Their enrichment - personal, spiritual, vocational - is a wonderful effect. The purpose of altar serving is to aid the priest in celebrating the Mass.
StAnastasia said:
It’s not an abuse in our parish.
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It would be an abuse in any Catholic parish.
razredge said:
I think this whole issue is farcical - and in today’s day & age too

Believing that having girls serving on the altar discourages boys from the priesthood is ludicrous -
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You are missing the point and taking the contrary position. If serving at the altar may encourage boys to consider a vocation, we should do everything we can to support that. If an all-male altar serving group is more effective in encouraging vocations, we should support it.

Maybe the girls’ precence discourages boys from serving. I don’t necessarily think that is the case. But it certainly makes altar serving a less effective environment to encourage boys to consider vocations.

There are many activities that a parish might chose to encourage priestly vocations. All of those activities are going to be male only since only males can have vocations to the priesthood. Rather than invent new activities, this parish decided to use an activity that is already part of the Church’s tradition. That’s hardly “farcical”.
 
Corki said:
Is the purpose of altar serving the enrichment of the servers? No! Their enrichment - personal, spiritual, vocational - is a wonderful effect. The purpose of altar serving is to aid the priest in celebrating the Mass.

So it the purpose of altar serving is aiding the priest in celebrating the Mass, then girls can assist as well as boys! Are you shifting premises in mid-argument?
It would be an abuse in any Catholic
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StAnastasia said:
So it the purpose of altar serving is aiding the priest in celebrating the Mass, then girls can assist as well as boys!
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Of course they can. There is no question that girls and boys *can *serve at Mass IF the Bishop and the priest chose to allow it. In this case, the permission is not being given.

As noted throughout this thread, there are many reasons a Bishop or priest might decide to use both girls and boys. There are also many reasons a Bishop or priest might decide to use only boys. The reasons to use only boys are just as valid as those to allow girls.
 
Corki said:
Of course they can. There is no question that girls and boys *can *serve at Mass IF the Bishop and the priest chose to allow it. In this case, the permission is not being given.

As noted throughout this thread, there are many reasons a Bishop or priest might decide to use both girls and boys. There are also many reasons a Bishop or priest might decide to use only boys. The reasons to use only boys are just as valid as those to allow girls.
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The reason to use only boys is more valid then to allow girls, as according to Canon Law, male Altar servers are the norm, female altar servers are allowed by indult, at the discretion of the Holy Father, the Bishops Conference, the individual Bishop and of course the celebrant, if anyone along the hierarchy decides they shall not have female servers in the church/province/diocese/parish, then that is there choice, they do not have to explain anything.
 
Skeptic92 said:
The reason to use only boys is more valid then to allow girls, as according to Canon Law, male Altar servers are the norm, female altar servers are allowed by indult, at the discretion of the Holy Father, the Bishops Conference, the individual Bishop and of course the celebrant, if anyone along the hierarchy decides they shall not have female servers in the church/province/diocese/parish, then that is there choice, they do not have to explain anything.
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That’s the point of the last 500+ posts.😃
 
Corki said:
That’s the point of the last 500+ posts.😃
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We shouldn’t question the authority of the Hierarchy of the Church when it legitimately exercises it’s ecclesiastical rights, the Bishop of Lincoln Nebraska flat out disallows use of Female Servers in his diocese, as is his right under canon law, do we go about questioning his motives (N), everyone should chill, and respect the authority of the Church Hierarchy here, and stop moaning :D:D (this wasn’t pointed at you Corki, or anyone in particular, but at everyone in this thread questioning the motives of a legitimate decision by the hierarchy)
 
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