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heidi_storage
Guest
Incorrect. This grandparent sounds loving and giving. Your post lacks charity and discernment.
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heidi_storage
Guest
OP, I am sorry you had to see that very unjust and unkind post, but am glad you’re back. How has it been going?
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Viki63
Guest
Some good suggestions here. We’ve been doing well. His favorite activity right now is going to the spray parks. His dad has started an apprenticeship program which is great news, as he will be working soon.
Grandson is learning to play independently at times. He can do it for 5 minutes or so. And we have a young lady living with us who has a 2 year old so someone for him to get into mischief with.
It’s a work in progress. Thanks for the ideas. I will try the radio programs.
Grandson is learning to play independently at times. He can do it for 5 minutes or so. And we have a young lady living with us who has a 2 year old so someone for him to get into mischief with.
It’s a work in progress. Thanks for the ideas. I will try the radio programs.
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DisorientingSneeze
Guest
You have young kids that don’t follow you/talk to you under the bathroom door?
What’s your secret?
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Allegra
Guest
My kids sit outside the bathroom door and sing “Do You Wanna Build a Snowman?”
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DisorientingSneeze
Guest
Mine are usually pretending I’m in an elevator or a drive-through window. There is no love lost between me and whoever decided it should be a sliding/accordion door in the master bathroom.
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Xantippe
Guest
I think 4 can be a very demanding age.
When Baby Girl was 4 and wasn’t able to draw much yet, she’d do this:
“Draw a kitty”
“Draw a kitty”
“Draw a kitty”
“Draw a kitty”
“Draw a kitty”
"Draw a kitty’
etc.
On one occasion, I drew about 9 kitties for her.
Fortunately, she’s gotten more capable of drawing her own stuff and more capable of entertaining herself with crafts. The downside of that is that the mess and the negotiations about disposal of craft items are unbelievable. But we’re working on it.
When Baby Girl was 4 and wasn’t able to draw much yet, she’d do this:
“Draw a kitty”
“Draw a kitty”
“Draw a kitty”
“Draw a kitty”
“Draw a kitty”
"Draw a kitty’
etc.
On one occasion, I drew about 9 kitties for her.
Fortunately, she’s gotten more capable of drawing her own stuff and more capable of entertaining herself with crafts. The downside of that is that the mess and the negotiations about disposal of craft items are unbelievable. But we’re working on it.
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Xantippe
Guest
Some ideas:
–bath time!
–yard visit/trike or bike time (a 4-year-old can usually pedal a bike with training wheels)
–could he sweep the walk or patio with you?
–would he like to garden?
–walk around the block
–sandbox
–grocery shopping/errands
–pet store (I am the WORST freerider at Petco)
–dollar store (have kid choose one or two items)
–Swiffering (I have had to fight Baby Girl for the Swiffer when we were expecting company)
–Wii physical activities (especially when it’s cold outside)
–small indoor trampoline with handle (supervise)
–playdate
–more preschool (he’s 4–a kid that age can take a lot of preschool)
–join a mom-and-kid meetup to have a choice of group events (they won’t kick you out for being a grandma)
–dry erase workbooks (the preschool ones, not the more academic ones)
–Bob phonics books
–let him have your Amazon boxes, if any
–let him do stuff with your recycling cardboard and scissors
I have a MORE!-MORE!-MORE! kid, too and I understand your feelings. But between him getting older and you getting more help (like more preschool/school and entertainment from the 2-year-old), things should be more bearable within the year.
Edited to add:
–pool or water park (a season pass can be a good investment)
–bath time!
–yard visit/trike or bike time (a 4-year-old can usually pedal a bike with training wheels)
–could he sweep the walk or patio with you?
–would he like to garden?
–walk around the block
–sandbox
–grocery shopping/errands
–pet store (I am the WORST freerider at Petco)
–dollar store (have kid choose one or two items)
–Swiffering (I have had to fight Baby Girl for the Swiffer when we were expecting company)
–Wii physical activities (especially when it’s cold outside)
–small indoor trampoline with handle (supervise)
–playdate
–more preschool (he’s 4–a kid that age can take a lot of preschool)
–join a mom-and-kid meetup to have a choice of group events (they won’t kick you out for being a grandma)
–dry erase workbooks (the preschool ones, not the more academic ones)
–Bob phonics books
–let him have your Amazon boxes, if any
–let him do stuff with your recycling cardboard and scissors
I have a MORE!-MORE!-MORE! kid, too and I understand your feelings. But between him getting older and you getting more help (like more preschool/school and entertainment from the 2-year-old), things should be more bearable within the year.
Edited to add:
–pool or water park (a season pass can be a good investment)
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Xantippe
Guest
What is his preschool/school situation for the fall?
He sounds like a kid who could do a lot of preschool and enjoy it. Baby Girl did three full days of pre-k a week at that age this past year and enjoyed every minute of it.
He sounds like a kid who could do a lot of preschool and enjoy it. Baby Girl did three full days of pre-k a week at that age this past year and enjoyed every minute of it.
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Viki63
Guest
He’s going to be in preschool 4 days a week (3 hours each) this fall. Looking forward to it. It’s a co-op preschool so I will accompany him one day a week-- entertaining if exhausting.
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Xantippe
Guest
That sounds good.
My oldest did a co-op preschool, and it was a wonderful way to meet other parents/caregivers. We also had a playground right outside (it met at a public park/community center), and a lot of parents and kids would stay and play afterward.
Once you settle in, another activity might be good if you have the funds and if he still needs something else.
My oldest did a co-op preschool, and it was a wonderful way to meet other parents/caregivers. We also had a playground right outside (it met at a public park/community center), and a lot of parents and kids would stay and play afterward.
Once you settle in, another activity might be good if you have the funds and if he still needs something else.
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alphawoman
Guest
No. It needed to be said. The OP either parented a child who abandoned her grandson, or one who is too depressed and unsafe, in her estimation, to be a primary caregiver without her intervention. (My money is on the father being the biological parent given the less judgmental language she uses around his parenting challenges.)
She’s taken on the responsibility that is rightly hers, and is expressing frustration at an abandoned child’s real needs for attachment and love. Her posts read as a laundry list of ways to divest herself of the child. She’s soliciting ideas of how to engage him solo so she doesn’t have to spend more than 30 minutes a day interacting directly with him. In many families, that may be all that’s achieved out of necessity, but such families don’t solicit (name removed by moderator)ut online because they’re bored interacting with their child or grand child, If you think that’s loving, you have a distorted view of love.
Yes, caregiver fatigue is real. A seeming lack of understanding of the child’s needs, including empathy for the emotional disruption to the boy of losing a parent to abandonment, should not be conflated with fatigue. Love means giving for the best of the other. Curtailing emotional support—of which interaction is a critical component—and enforcing independence when a child has experienced trauma is NOT loving behaviour.
Allegra made some very reasonable points upthread about ways to balance independence with shared social time, from the lens of an educator. Her answer was, IMO, more fitting and understanding of the little boy’s needs than his own grandmother’s. Allegra and I have never met the boy, yet we seem to have a better understanding—from our suggestions—about what a 4 year old experiencing family disruption needs to be well adjusted emotionally and socially.
Kindly do not chastise me again or apologize on my behalf for standing up for the rights of a child to receive loving care, not simply be made part of the furniture—to be taken out and interacted with only on his grandmother’s schedule and whims. He is a human child, NOT A PET TO BE IGNORED.
Here’s a helpful article by a clinical psychologist on emotional neglect in children, to explain patterns that are likely being repeated inter-generationally:
She’s taken on the responsibility that is rightly hers, and is expressing frustration at an abandoned child’s real needs for attachment and love. Her posts read as a laundry list of ways to divest herself of the child. She’s soliciting ideas of how to engage him solo so she doesn’t have to spend more than 30 minutes a day interacting directly with him. In many families, that may be all that’s achieved out of necessity, but such families don’t solicit (name removed by moderator)ut online because they’re bored interacting with their child or grand child, If you think that’s loving, you have a distorted view of love.
Yes, caregiver fatigue is real. A seeming lack of understanding of the child’s needs, including empathy for the emotional disruption to the boy of losing a parent to abandonment, should not be conflated with fatigue. Love means giving for the best of the other. Curtailing emotional support—of which interaction is a critical component—and enforcing independence when a child has experienced trauma is NOT loving behaviour.
Allegra made some very reasonable points upthread about ways to balance independence with shared social time, from the lens of an educator. Her answer was, IMO, more fitting and understanding of the little boy’s needs than his own grandmother’s. Allegra and I have never met the boy, yet we seem to have a better understanding—from our suggestions—about what a 4 year old experiencing family disruption needs to be well adjusted emotionally and socially.
Kindly do not chastise me again or apologize on my behalf for standing up for the rights of a child to receive loving care, not simply be made part of the furniture—to be taken out and interacted with only on his grandmother’s schedule and whims. He is a human child, NOT A PET TO BE IGNORED.
Here’s a helpful article by a clinical psychologist on emotional neglect in children, to explain patterns that are likely being repeated inter-generationally:
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DisorientingSneeze
Guest
Alphawoman, I’m not getting the same vibe you are from the OP. You seem like you know alot about childhood neglect and abuse. If any of that is from lived experience I am deeply sorry you have experienced or witnessed such things.
If the OP really was doing something objectionable(I am not saying she was), what would a negligent person do if confronted in the manner you have confronted our OP?
If the OP really was doing something objectionable(I am not saying she was), what would a negligent person do if confronted in the manner you have confronted our OP?
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alphawoman
Guest
Thanks Disorienting sneeze.
I have experience with inter generational childhood abuse and neglect, as well as childhood trauma related to parental abandonment, and am not a proponent of enabling callous or emotionally insensitive behaviour in caregivers.
I assume almost all caregivers receiving my messaging would take umbrage, for different reasons. Nobody likes to think they aren’t parenting well, because it’s supposed to be a universal skill.
I’m willing to risk that offence if it means my comments are provocative enough to elicit honest self-reflection and more adequate parenting behaviours. I’m an adult; I can take it. A child being emotionally neglected can’t. Being constantly invalidated by a primary attachment figure (especially following trauma) is—unsurprisingly—strongly comorbid with adult depression, anxiety, and personality disorders.
Lasting damage to children doesn’t have to come from big-T trauma, like an abandonment or experiencing violent abuse. Instead, it can be complex trauma that arises from an overarching sense of being unloved or unlovable. An extended series of invalidation, subtle ignoring, or denial of affection/attention, as the OP is describing, is a recipe for complex trauma in a child who has lost his primary attachment figure. I say this with no irony— we are likely seeing a window into why her child is struggling with problems in adulthood if this is her way of interacting.
I have experience with inter generational childhood abuse and neglect, as well as childhood trauma related to parental abandonment, and am not a proponent of enabling callous or emotionally insensitive behaviour in caregivers.
I assume almost all caregivers receiving my messaging would take umbrage, for different reasons. Nobody likes to think they aren’t parenting well, because it’s supposed to be a universal skill.
I’m willing to risk that offence if it means my comments are provocative enough to elicit honest self-reflection and more adequate parenting behaviours. I’m an adult; I can take it. A child being emotionally neglected can’t. Being constantly invalidated by a primary attachment figure (especially following trauma) is—unsurprisingly—strongly comorbid with adult depression, anxiety, and personality disorders.
Lasting damage to children doesn’t have to come from big-T trauma, like an abandonment or experiencing violent abuse. Instead, it can be complex trauma that arises from an overarching sense of being unloved or unlovable. An extended series of invalidation, subtle ignoring, or denial of affection/attention, as the OP is describing, is a recipe for complex trauma in a child who has lost his primary attachment figure. I say this with no irony— we are likely seeing a window into why her child is struggling with problems in adulthood if this is her way of interacting.
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Viki63
Guest
Thanks for your comments. I appreciate your concerns. i don’t think that I am responsible for my son’s depression, as he is adopted and we were his 5th set of caretakers by the age of 28 months. We were told he likely wouldn’t be able to live in a family, but we proved his doctor wrong. He has problems but is taking on his responsibilities.
I’d like to relieve your mind; I am not neglecting my grandson. I take him to the park, the library, swimming lessons, preschool during the year. My only question was that he has trouble with independent play and I have gotten some good suggestions on how to encourage that.
It’s easy to jump to conclusions when all we have are brief posts. Perhaps you could try to be a little less judgmental, remembering that you don’t know us or the other circumstances we’re dealing with. Also keep in mind that I’m pushing 75 and wasn’t expecting to take on a 4 year old at this time of life, but am doing the best I can.
He’s getting baptized this month and will have some lovely godparents. So that will help him also.
I’d like to relieve your mind; I am not neglecting my grandson. I take him to the park, the library, swimming lessons, preschool during the year. My only question was that he has trouble with independent play and I have gotten some good suggestions on how to encourage that.
It’s easy to jump to conclusions when all we have are brief posts. Perhaps you could try to be a little less judgmental, remembering that you don’t know us or the other circumstances we’re dealing with. Also keep in mind that I’m pushing 75 and wasn’t expecting to take on a 4 year old at this time of life, but am doing the best I can.
He’s getting baptized this month and will have some lovely godparents. So that will help him also.
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Sonic
Guest
Unfortunately, this is a sad circumstance in society now. Many people have given up actual conversation in favor of anonymous textual commentary. What often occurs (and I see it in discussions here on CAF and elsewhere) is that people, lacking a real conversation partner, use their imagination to create one. The result is that they project their own feelings and experiences into the other person’s written words. Having no actual person, they fill in what’s missing through their own mind. Hence, it becomes easy for a person to misread the intentions of the person they are chatting with. This is not something we usually experience with real people. When a real person is happy, sad, or angry, we can tell from their behavior as well as their words. But, if we imagine the person on a message board is happy, sad, or angry (when they really aren’t), then we are more apt to misunderstand what they are saying and what their motivations really are.
There is a real need now for people to return to actual conversation and begin leaving anonymous text based communication aside. Its not helping society. It’s just another way to isolate us from our fellow human beings.
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Rozellelily
Guest
Could he do some drawing or painting perhaps?
Or even putting on some music and dancing together?
It might exhaust some of his energy
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Or even putting on some music and dancing together?
It might exhaust some of his energy
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Xantippe
Guest
Ooooh!
That makes a big difference. I was imagining that you were substantially younger. (My own grandma was 54 when I was 4.)
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Viki63
Guest
True. I mention it because we adopted my son when I was 52, and that was 22 years ago. I had lots of energy then!
I took him to the water spray park today. He ran himself to exhaustion and I sat on a bench. Worked well.
I go out to lunch with friends once a week. We do need face to face interaction.
I took him to the water spray park today. He ran himself to exhaustion and I sat on a bench. Worked well.
I go out to lunch with friends once a week. We do need face to face interaction.
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heidi_storage
Guest
Dear lady, your comments may be entirely appropriate to someone who actually is neglecting the child in her care except for a few minutes of interaction, but absolutely nothing in this thread suggests that the OP is doing so. Not wishing to spend hours on end playing cars is not the same thing as wanting to warehouse the kid like a plant or an animal.
Given this, your comments are both inappropriate and rude.
If you have any helpful suggestions for the OP, I am sure the OP would welcome them, though it sounds like the situation is better.
Given this, your comments are both inappropriate and rude.
If you have any helpful suggestions for the OP, I am sure the OP would welcome them, though it sounds like the situation is better.
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