Church militant determination of heretics end at death, AFAIK.
Catholic Catechism. 817-820.
I don’t need a red pill. I was baptized.
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Catholic Catechism. 817-820.
I don’t need a red pill. I was baptized.
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JUPITERMADCAT
Guest
Lol you guys are funny
While I’m happy you’re amused, I don’t find triumphalism by either side particularly funny.
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MagdalenaRita
Guest
Ok. That is incorrect. Luther’s theories are still at odds with the beliefs of the Catholic church, which is what heresy means. Through certain means we may be trying to end division but we are a long way from there.
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MagdalenaRita
Guest
After watching it, there were some things I hadn’t heard before but a good portion of it I had learned during my protestant years. There were usually just excuses for his actions on the protestant side, though. So it was interesting to hear the Catholic view. I had never really heard that before. Also very sad to see all the destruction of the churches.
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rightness
Guest
I believe Saint Paul VI simply wanted their opinions. I don’t think the non-Catholic denominations had great effect on the new liturgy.
As for Pope Francis, I can only pray for him and hope he has some master plan of why he’s engaging other religions in this manner, including Islam.
Yes, Martin Luther is heretical. We’re all sinners that can be used as instruments of Satan, but, wow, Martin Luther takes that point to the extreme in a lot of his writings. Reading some of them, I’m definitely convinced that he is not a Saint, nor does he make a good argument.
This is one of the things I read, a free archive of “Luther’s Own Statements”: https://dads.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/Highlighted-Luthers-Own-Statements.pdf
As for Pope Francis, I can only pray for him and hope he has some master plan of why he’s engaging other religions in this manner, including Islam.
Yes, Martin Luther is heretical. We’re all sinners that can be used as instruments of Satan, but, wow, Martin Luther takes that point to the extreme in a lot of his writings. Reading some of them, I’m definitely convinced that he is not a Saint, nor does he make a good argument.
This is one of the things I read, a free archive of “Luther’s Own Statements”: https://dads.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/Highlighted-Luthers-Own-Statements.pdf
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glencor63
Guest
And yet Protestantism remains a force to be reckoned with and has grown exponentially. It encompasses the entire globe. The Eastern Orthodox Church remains divided from Rome. Sometimes, it behooves one to practice self-examination. There is a reason Jesus allows this division. It is not simply a respect of free will, but because there are serious problems in the Catholic Church that have still not been addressed. Catholics should ask themselves if Jesus Christ walked into the Vatican today would he be pleased? Would Jesus recognize the Gospel in the Catholic Church? When I say Gospel, I mean the simple message of Christ as Redeemer, Healer, Savior, and Lord. The Gospel is very simple. Human beings complicate the message.
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Wannano
Guest
I just so agree with everything you presented here. The fact that Jesus allows these divisions among people is proof that He is in control. None of us measure up to the standard He would desire for all of us.
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TertiumQuid
Guest
Hmm… The book being recommended is an old small anthology of Luther quotes, peppered with vilifying commentary from Henry O’Connor, a Catholic writer.
O’Connor declares Luther to be in league with Satan: “A man who Pretends to be a Reformer is sent either by God or by Satan” (p. 61). Earlier in the book, O’Connor presents an entire section linking Luther, and Luther’s teachings to the Devil: “Luther received the full and unqualified approval of the Devil for these new doctrines. It was the Devil who spoke in favour of the new doctrine of justification by faith alone, and against Mass, Mary, and the Saints” (p.18).
He argues Luther was a liar, a hypocrite, one who wrote a “Satanical book”, it is Satan that speaks through Luther, Luther has a “Satanical hatred of the Pope,” he was responsible for the deaths of 100,000 peasants; where Luther’s teaching is accepted the sick, poor, and children are neglected, and drunkenness spreads like a deluge. And, these are only a few of the the charges and attacks against Luther.
There are many better Catholic books on Luther!
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TULIPed
Guest
Luckily, we Calvinists were predestined to be on the right side of the chasm 
There’s always room in the TULIP garden for one more Jon!
There’s always room in the TULIP garden for one more Jon!Thanks for the invite, sincerely, but the differences in theology of the Eucharist and soteriology are far too distant.Luckily, we Calvinists were predestined to be on the right side of the chasm
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TULIPed
Guest
Fair enough. Although these days, given the dearth of no-kidding 5 pointers, I’d bet the average, run-of-the-mill “reformed” perspective (maybe 3 pointers) isn’t as far away as you’d think in terms of soteriology.
This would be an interesting thread, I think.TULIPed:
Thanks for the invite, sincerely, but the differences in theology of the Eucharist and soteriology are far too distant.Luckily, we Calvinists were predestined to be on the right side of the chasm
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Darryl_B
Guest
Martin Luther did not harm the Catholic Church.
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Darryl_B
Guest
Luck?
please go through please go through please go through
please go through please go through please go through
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MagdalenaRita
Guest
How do you figure that?
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TMC
Guest
It is interesting to me that there are so many threads here banging on Luther in very hateful (and often historically inaccurate) ways. I really don’t get it. The Church as come to terms with Luther and Lutherans, and it seems to me that the Church has all but rehabilitated his image and reputation. But it seems some Catholics want to continue to fight against a guy that has been dead for centuries. Not sure why that is. For those obsessed with attacking Luther, why is that?
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MagdalenaRita
Guest
Perhaps because the chaos and destruction he started continues to this day and it is in examining the past you prevent the same problems from happening again.
If people know the truth they are more likely not to follow a deception.
We can also see here how our actions dont just effect our own little world but can impact centuries.
If people know the truth they are more likely not to follow a deception.
We can also see here how our actions dont just effect our own little world but can impact centuries.
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DENNYINMI
Guest
Jesus asked, “And will you too walk away” within the Bread of Life Discourse in John.
I agree with the prior comment above your post. Today we have persons leaving long after Luther, the child abuse scandal did that for many, many!~
The idea in Luthers day that indulgences could be bought and sold was dead wrong. The underlying misunderstanding would be that one needed to wealthy to obtain grace and mercy, think of how many persons would have been turned away let alone repelled at this idea which certainly was not from our Lord.
Luther didn’t cause the schism between the East and West, nor the plethora of mini-schisms that followed under the guise of Protestantism…I would suggest if not Luther, we would have seen this play out again a few times during history as the Church learned from it’s failings and grew.
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MagdalenaRita
Guest
The Church never taught that indulgences could be bought and sold. There were some who committed abuses in the name of indulgences at that time.
Luther was more concerned about the personal interpretation of scripture rather than anything else and that is what has caused the snowball effect of protestantism and so much division and so many denominations.
The real heroes of that time were those who worked in the Church to end abuses and clarify Catholic teaching.
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