Pop singers to perform before papal Mass at Madison Square Garden

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yinekka

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Pop concert in Madison Square Garden before the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.

I am sick to my stomach and in tears as I type this. The concert is supposed to be reverent - yeah I can believe that there will be silence and prayer.

. Surely the organisers could have thought of a better preparation for the “Source and summit of our Faith.”

What are the organisers thinking of? What are those in Rome who approved this debacle thinking of?

What was Cardinal Dolan thinking of to give his permission for this insult to the Real Presence?Huge public Masses are never reverent. At the very least, Holy Communion shouldn’t be distributed. If It is I can envision consecrated Hosts turning up for sale.:mad:
 
“Classical music” concerts used to be done before Mass, and in churches, no one complained then. I didn’t complain about the super loud pipe organ at the church downtown (well, I guess I am now) before and after Mass.

I fail to see how this is a big deal, specifically if the sound is decent and they’re doing praise & worship or hymns.
 
Hi Melchoir,

When and where were classical music concerts done [performed] before and after Mass?

I think a “super loud” pipe organ could be dangerous to your hearing so maybe you should bring it to the attention of the parish priest.

That being said, I think that there is just a wee bit of difference between an organ playing hymns and a pop concert.
 
Gloria Estefan will probably sing some beautiful in Spanish. I don’t know Jennifer Hudson so well, but Harry Conick Jr doesn’t exactly give pop concerts as most would define them.

If we were talking Justin Bieber or Katy Perry, then I would be horrified.
 
1990Domer said:
Gloria Estefan will probably sing some beautiful in Spanish. I don’t know Jennifer Hudson so well, but Harry Conick Jr doesn’t exactly give pop concerts as most would define them.

If we were talking Justin Bieber or Katy Perry, then I would be horrified.
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Harry Connick jr. is a practicing Catholic, so he is not out of place.

Same with Gloria Estefan.

I agree Bieber and Katy Perry wold both be out of place, Perry because of her provocativ costumers and lyrics, and Bieber because his music is awful.
 
apparently the OP has never attended a life teen Mass.

We must showcase the music of the times we are in. Drought and desert and all.
 
Hoosier_Daddy said:
apparently the OP has never attended a life teen Mass.

We must showcase the music of the times we are in. Drought and desert and all.
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Well, there’s a difference… LifeTeen-Masses use “Contemporary Christian Music” which uses pop-melodies to praise & worship, contain biblical references and are used to carry prayer (this does not mean that everybody should like or accept LifeTeen-music or is likely to use them for prayer).

As someone pointed out, apparently the singers invited are practicant Catholics, have decent music & lyrics. But it is not music for prayer. I think, because it doesn’t promote anything vulgar, there is nothing against seeing other people’s talents on such a festivity (the singers will be fully aware that they are performing in relation to the Pope and the Catholic Mass, so they will choose their songs appropriately I hope).
Think of this: It could also be totally silent, creating a sort of camping ground with all sorts of things going on; having a decent entertainment creates a different and maybe more reverend ‘vibe’… I remember after one World Youth Day, several pop artists performed on the stage of the Papal Mass, give several testimonies about their own faith and helped to keep some crowds occupied a bit longer to relieve the stress on the exit- and transportation system. Was a great solution!

Another thing would be popstars known for their vulgarity. But that’s not the case here.
 
I do find it a little odd that Jennifer Hudson, who has a song highlighting same-sex marriage is performing, but… that doesn’t necessarily mean she shouldn’t perform? 🤷 After all she won’t be singing that particular song. I doubt whoever chose the performers looked significantly into the views of the performers, but just wanted great performers, not sure.
 
Melchior said:
“Classical music” concerts used to be done before Mass, and in churches, no one complained then. I didn’t complain about the super loud pipe organ at the church downtown (well, I guess I am now) before and after Mass.

I fail to see how this is a big deal, specifically if the sound is decent and they’re doing praise & worship or hymns.
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Here’s why it’s a big deal:

Is the church supposed to be changing the world

OR

Is the world supposed to be changing the church???

God bless you
 
Madison Square Gardens is telling mass attendees that they need to be there by 2:00 pm

The mass doesn’t start until 6:30 pm.

What are those people supposed to do for the time between their arrival and when the mass actually begins?

NYC has decided they will be entertained. They are picking entertainers that respect Catholicism.

How is this any different than a major Catholic gathering for the Eucharistic conference? The mass is separate from the ‘entertainment’.

I see no problem at all.
 
frangiuliano115 said:
Here’s why it’s a big deal:

Is the church supposed to be changing the world

OR

Is the world supposed to be changing the church???

God bless you
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You don’t change the world by ignoring its existence.

The history of Catholicism is.full of such accommodations. Pagan midwinter and spring traditions rechristened as ‘Christmas’ trees and ‘Easter’ eggs, Popes borrowing the title ‘Pontifex Maximus’ from the pagan chief priests of.ancient Rome and the like.
 
LilyM said:
You don’t change the world by ignoring its existence.

The history of Catholicism is.full of such accommodations. Pagan midwinter and spring traditions rechristened as ‘Christmas’ trees and ‘Easter’ eggs, Popes borrowing the title ‘Pontifex Maximus’ from the pagan chief priests of.ancient Rome and the like.
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Yes. Let’s not ignore its existence. Let’s become a part of it, no?

How about that christian saying:

We are IN the world, but we are not OF of the world.

I think Jesus had that concept in mind.

John 15:19 “but because you are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, threfore the world hates you”

John 17:16 Same as above. Repeated. You know history, you might know what it means when Jesus repeats what he says more than once. For those who don’t: It’s very important.

Romans 12:2 “And be not conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind.”

The “world” is always referring to the world system. The transformation refers to a spiritual transformation once one has known God.

And what more can I say? You seem to know church history. Aren’t you kinda sorry for the 1st, 2nd and 3rd century christians who just could not adhere to Roman worship of Roman gods and preferred to die insead?

Are we not willing to do anything for our faith? Demand nothing? I don’t want to die. I do demand that my faith stay out of the world. I agree with Yinekka. This is not a sin but I do think it’s a mistake. Maybe we should have had some rock instead? I much prefer that to pop and I do wish to be entertained, after all! Where does it stop?

Samwise1 says: “as long as it doesn’t promote anything vulgar, there is nothing wrong with seeing other people’s…”

Wow. Is that all it takes? That it isn’t vulgar? Tto what depths have we sunk? If it isn’t vulgar we’re at neutral - could we take it a notch up and get it into the spiritual?

I like Yinekka’s signature line:

“If you were accused of being a catholic, would there be enough evidence to convict you?”

Think on that for 5 minutes.

God bless you
 
frangiuliano115 said:
Samwise1 says: “as long as it doesn’t promote anything vulgar, there is nothing wrong with seeing other people’s…”
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Please don’t cut in the middle of my sentences. I said “I think, because it doesn’t promote anything vulgar, there is nothing against seeing other people’s talents on such a festivity (the singers will be fully aware that they are performing in relation to the Pope and the Catholic Mass, so they will choose their songs appropriately I hope).”
adding context, also with what I added about the concert after World Youth Day.

It’s not about what it DOESN’T show (vulgarity, hopefully), but what it shows:
->Other people’s TALENTS (God given)
->Appropriate lyrics (giving a different perspective for people in this world sinking into bad lyrics - we should give them alternatives that reach them but that also save them - one of these examples is U2, partly, which you quote in your signature)
->An alternative to a waiting place becoming a camping ground.
 
Samwise1 said:
Please don’t cut in the middle of my sentences. I said “I think, because it doesn’t promote anything vulgar, there is nothing against seeing other people’s talents on such a festivity (the singers will be fully aware that they are performing in relation to the Pope and the Catholic Mass, so they will choose their songs appropriately I hope).”
adding context, also with what I added about the concert after World Youth Day.

It’s not about what it DOESN’T show (vulgarity, hopefully), but what it shows:
->Other people’s TALENTS (God given)
->Appropriate lyrics (giving a different perspective for people in this world sinking into bad lyrics - we should give them alternatives that reach them but that also save them - one of these examples is U2, partly, which you quote in your signature)
->An alternative to a waiting place becoming a camping ground.
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Hello Samwise1,

It’s a common problem today to accept pretty much everything, including vulgar stuff. I didn’t mean what I said in a bad way and I apologize if I didn’t explain myself properly.

I meant that if something is NOT vulgar we’re up at a neutral stance. Okay. Now we’re neutral. That shouldn’t be enough for a christian. Do you see what I mean? Words, sometimes I hate words.

Now I love U2 and have since 1985. That may give my age away, but it’s okay. I went to see them in Turin two weeks ago. Their concerts bring tears to my eyes, especially this one. It should be mandatory for christians to know their work, which it sounds like you might.

Would I want to see them at this Mass? I don’t think so. Because we’d be cheering away at them and not at God. (well, in their case, maybe we would!)

I mean, is Harry going to sing HIS songs, and Jennifer and Gloria? We’ll just have to wait and see. Why couldn’t it have been a christian choir, for instance?

I just feel like we’re becoming more and more like secular people. I sometimes feel like there’s going to be a small remnant of us remaining, like the Jews after the Babylonian and Assyrian exiles.

Hope you understand me. I have nothing against you.

God bless
Fran
 
FOR SAMWISE1

You actually think U2 might save people? That’s interesting.

At the concert they had taken copies of a bible called The Message, ripped it into small pieces and threw it out over the audience.

Not like they haven’t been trying all these years!

Fran
 
Too bad they couldn’t get Flyleaf to play. Really like their song ‘Beautiful Bride’.
 
I attended the Papal Mass in Yankee Stadium when Pope Benedict came to visit.

There were performers there as well.

Madison Square Garden is a very large venue, and I am sure there will be security checks and it will take a great amount of time for everyone to be seated. That’s how it was at Yankees Stadium.

We were there about 2 hours if I remember correctly before Mass began. It wasn’t irreverent at all. The whole experience was quite beautiful, and as I listened to the homily I seriously wondered if heaven would be similar.

And my two children at the time aged 7 and 4 were impeccably behaved.
 
_Abyssinia said:
I do find it a little odd that Jennifer Hudson, who has a song highlighting same-sex marriage is performing, but… that doesn’t necessarily mean she shouldn’t perform? 🤷 After all she won’t be singing that particular song. I doubt whoever chose the performers looked significantly into the views of the performers, but just wanted great performers, not sure.
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And therein lies the problem. Even the people who organized this do not take the Eucharist seriously for what it is.

How can you not look into the beliefs and backgrounds of the people involved? At least on non-negotiable issues? There are no shortage of Catholics who could do this job - at least find some who believe what it is to be Catholic.
 
Fran, your apology suits you - thank you. Also apologies on my side if I reacted too quickly.

My understanding was that you found U2 agreeable - I know several more people who take some quotes of Bono (that he believes in Jesus) and his charity work and use it to show that it’s one of the few Christian bands.

Despite several of the lyrics, the syncretism shown in the concerts, and recently the revelation that their charity is not too charitable - I took U2 as one of the ‘least un-Christian’ mainstream acts.
What you tell me adds to this idea and clearly crosses this line.

My point is a bit this:
One might think that U2 would be a good choice because they are so ‘Christian’. As per some of Bono’s quotes, as states above.
A catholic radio station around here plays random classical music - I didn’t research into it but some of the composers may have masonic influences. But maybe they just think it’s bett
I’d prefer Gloria Estefan - her Latin roots remind of a love purer than what I see around me here.

To carry your idea further: Yes it could be a christian choir - but that would demand a type of more reverence. Someone pointed out that (probably for security reasons) people have to be there 4 hours in advance.

Most lay people can’t focus on God for 4 hours, risking that by the time the Mass started, all kinds of strange things are happening. Better to first serve them acceptable secular entertainment, so when the Pope comes the reverence can be accentuated.

I don’t know though - big Masses are not my favorite kind anyway, especially when they are celebrated in a secular environment. There was a big difference to me between the beach of Copacabana and the field at Madrid. That’s why I am so delighted that next WYD is in Poland, and I see a lot of spiritual initiatives rather than 'make-a-selfie’actions from the organisations. But that’s another topic…
 
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