Pope Bluntly Faults Church's Focus on Gays and Abortion

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I totally agree with Havard, as him, i haven’t ever heard a practicing catholic preaching hatred toward gay people…And if a catholic has done such thing, s/he must be confused, because Jesus said " “let him who is without sin, cast the first stone” but He also told that woman “go and sin no more”… I don’t understand what’s wrong with the Church reminding us in daily basis that abortion or homosexuality are sins … It would also be great if they reminded us of other sins as well… But i don’t even know what the Pope means when he says that the church needs to stop focusing on gays an abortion… I mean, i don’t ever recall a homily in my church about those topics. Though when it comes to presenting our petitions to the Lord we always pray for the aborted babies and for abortion to come to an end.
 
lovetheworld said:
God made them this way. Putting them down is like telling God he messed up.
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God made them this way? There are many reasons why people suffer from such things. One of them may be biological to a certain extent. But not all cases are the same, so how could you possibly say such a simplistic thing?

The way God made them is male and female, with free will, and a conscience that He wished to be formed upon Divine and Natural Law. He gave us the commandments for a reason.
love the world said:
  • I’m not critisizing you at all… I’m just not into hating on anyone, as I am a Christian… I am totally on board with the Pope on this one…
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By the above statement, you are implying that others are “hating” by promoting the Gospel. You are also implying that the Pope felt the same way. That’s sheer nonsense, and really going overboard with baseless, whacky, unfounded accusations.

If you are “totally on board” with the Pope, then you agree that the Church’s teaching on these things is clear, and you too are a “son of the Church”. You would also just prefer not to always have to respond to/talk about these mattters as if they could possibly change…but that doesn’t seem to be where you’re coming from. You’re coming from a point of view formed by the press and secular society that insists that people are born this way, and all who follow the truth on the matter are “haters”. That is not anything close to being “on board” with the Holy Father.
 
BigBlueCane said:
You can be against those things and mind your own business at the same time. Its the fervent OBSESSION with issues like that which gives people a bad taste in their mouths about catholics. Which is unfortunate since the Church is WAAAAAAAAAAY more than gays, abortion, contraception. Those are fine points.
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Speaking out against abortion or homosexual marriage means you do not mind your own business.
 
manualman said:
  1. Plenty. What’s your point? Not an adult catholic on earth is unaware of the fact that priests are sinners like the rest of us. If you have a further point, go ahead and say it rather than insinuate it.
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Excellent.

Notice that there is not a single instance in the Gospel when someone guilty of a common vice – prostitution, adultery, bribery, etc. – would be condemned. Asked to repent, yes, but not condemned. There’s only one category of sins which brings condemnation – hypocrisy. This is what Pharisees were guilty of.

The “scandal” of Francis is that he is condemns hypocrites within the Church and highlights the good in a common man.
 
lovetheworld said:
No - I am speaking as someone raised in a heavy Catholic enviornment. Yes, Homosexuality is a very hated thing common among many Catholics. My feelings have nothing to do with pop-culture.

And yes, totall bigotry. when you hate someone… you are so far from God. Also, as a Christian, which Commandment are you refering too? Love they neighbour? As someone mentioned above… Did Jesus ever have an issue with anyone? Sorry, I just need to live like he did… and people like you will never change us true Christians.

PS: Sorry, not upset with you… My points are storng as my opinion are… but I pray for you… and hope you one day see the light, and can live in love and peace. Till now, I just send you love.
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Jesus did not simply (only) love, He also told us to sin no more.

“Us true Christians.” How very unjudgemental of you.:rolleyes:

I will now respond in kind. How dare you call yourself a “Christian” when you deny the truths of the Catholic faith. When Sacred Sripture condemns homosexuality (as in Romans and various other books of the Bible) Jesus is also condemning homosexual behaviour, since the Bible is God’s Word and Jesus is God. Scripture, according to the Holy Catholic Church, is inerrant and Jesus Himself said that not any part (jot or tittle) of the Law (Scripture) would pass away.

KNK
 
weller2 said:
Excellent.

Notice that there is not a single instance in the Gospel when someone guilty of a common vice – prostitution, adultery, bribery, etc. – would be condemned. Asked to repent, yes, but not condemned. There’s only one category of sins which brings condemnation – hypocrisy. This is what Pharisees were guilty of.

**The “scandal” of Francis is that he is condemns hypocrites within the Church **and highlights the good in a common man.
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I know plenty out of the Church too, don’t you? 🙂
 
BigBlueCane said:
You can be against those things and mind your own business at the same time. Its the fervent OBSESSION with issues like that which gives people a bad taste in their mouths about catholics. Which is unfortunate since the Church is WAAAAAAAAAAY more than gays, abortion, contraception. Those are fine points.
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But Sir/ ma’am… Don’t you think that it’s extremely sad how 3,000 babies die everyday because of abortion? I’m guilty of lust, and I would not care if the Church reminded me everyday about how lust is a terrible sin…
 
BigBlueCane said:
You can be against those things and mind your own business at the same time. Its the fervent OBSESSION with issues like that which gives people a bad taste in their mouths about catholics. Which is unfortunate since the Church is WAAAAAAAAAAY more than gays, abortion, contraception. Those are fine points.
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Lawl, I have never heard a homily on any of these topics. Yes, many Catholic organizations whose specific purpose is one or several of these topics do exist. But as far as actual contact in the parish setting with the teachings on these subjects, I have none.
 
manualman said:
As an aside, how cool is it that we’re hanging out having a nice, vigorous argu,…err… discussion about what the pope is saying in public? Regardless of anybody’s (wrong) views (:D), it sure beats talking football scores!

👍
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You are getting close to my Cleveland Browns trading Trent Richardson button. :banghead:
 
weller2 said:
Excellent.

Notice that there is not a single instance in the Gospel when someone guilty of a common vice – prostitution, adultery, bribery, etc. – would be condemned. Asked to repent, yes, but not condemned. There’s only one category of sins which brings condemnation – hypocrisy. This is what Pharisees were guilty of.

The “scandal” of Francis is that he is condemns hypocrites within the Church and highlights the good in a common man.
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No one is upset about the call not to condemn. People are upset because it comes across as the Pope not speaking out against abortion and lumping abortion in with less serious matters.
 
Just exactly - what is morally wrong about someone being gay? They were born that way, its the way God made them… As a Crhistian, ask yourself… who did Jesus ever Judge? Esp that no gay person has ever hurt you or anyone because of the way they are.

You have simply been taught hate… there is nothing Christian about your view… just because a lot of Christains maybe share it… does not make it right.

Like I said… Love the new pope!
AdvanceAlways said:
We are against those things because they are morally wrong. That does not mean we hate gay people.
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weller2 said:
Excellent.

Notice that there is not a single instance in the Gospel when someone guilty of a common vice – prostitution, adultery, bribery, etc. – would be condemned. Asked to repent, yes, but not condemned. There’s only one category of sins which brings condemnation – hypocrisy. This is what Pharisees were guilty of.

The “scandal” of Francis is that he is condemns hypocrites within the Church and highlights the good in a common man.
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As I noted above, the difficult thing there is that we aren’t aware of any society-wide movement in Jesus’ day to redefine “common vices” as moral goods, are we?

I’m all for calling out hypocrisy where it exists. I got no beef with you there. But I’m not sure we have a precedent for what Jesus would say to an angry gay rights activist or Planned Parenthood lobbyist.
 
catholicguy25 said:
But Sir/ ma’am… Don’t you think that it’s extremely sad how 3,000 babies die everyday because of abortion? I’m guilty of lust, and I would not care if the Church reminded me everyday about how lust is a terrible sin…
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Its sir. 🙂 but you can call me bbc or whatever. 😃

It is extremely sad but there are a ton of extremely sad things going on in the world. Abortion isn’t the only issue out there and it seems that the only thing the Church has been focused on is abortion, contraception and gay marriage. How is the Church supposed to attract more members when people are starving, and have so many needs today and they see the church more worried about a couple of dudes marrying or abortion.

Again thats not to say that you have to be for those things. But I think the priorities have been messed up in recent years. Which is what I think the Pope is driving at. There are things we all can do today, right now to ease some of that suffering. Holding up a sign protesting abortion isn’t it.
 
lovetheworld said:
Just exactly - what is morally wrong about someone being gay? They were born that way, its the way God made them… As a Crhistian, ask yourself… who did Jesus ever Judge? Esp that no gay person has ever hurt you or anyone because of the way they are.

You have simply been taught hate… there is nothing Christian about your view… just because a lot of Christains maybe share it… does not make it right.

Like I said… Love the new pope!
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So i guess many of us hate ourselves… because we dislike even our own sins… is not like we only hate the sins of our neighbor. The gay person just like the straight person needs to be abstinent until marriage… and marriage is between a man and a woman. Jesus said " ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’
 
BigBlueCane said:
Its sir. 🙂 but you can call me bbc or whatever. 😃

It is extremely sad but there are a ton of extremely sad things going on in the world. Abortion isn’t the only issue out there and it seems that the only thing the Church has been focused on is abortion, contraception and gay marriage. How is the Church supposed to attract more members when people are starving, and have so many needs today and they see the church more worried about a couple of dudes marrying or abortion.

Again thats not to say that you have to be for those things. But I think the priorities have been messed up in recent years. Which is what I think the Pope is driving at. There are things we all can do today, right now to ease some of that suffering. Holding up a sign protesting abortion isn’t it.
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Abortion is the greatest evil in the world today and no matter what dissident excuses you come up with for trivializing it, the fact remains the same.

“A couple of dues marrying or an abortion.” You have proven that you are nothing more than a dissident if you simply write off abortion as some trivial after thought.
 
Well our (clowns) journalists are discussing it now, on an evening news report show, as it’s in tomorrow’s newspapers. How revolutionary he is and totally different to P Benedict, etc., what a shakeup for the church, yada, yada.

READ THE ORIGINAL LETTER, NOT THE MSM EDITED VERSION! 😦
 
lovetheworld said:
Just exactly - what is morally wrong about someone being gay? They were born that way, its the way God made them… As a Crhistian, ask yourself… who did Jesus ever Judge? Esp that no gay person has ever hurt you or anyone because of the way they are.

You have simply been taught hate… there is nothing Christian about your view… just because a lot of Christains maybe share it… does not make it right.

Like I said… Love the new pope!
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Homosexual inclination is not sin, but homosexual acts are.

Origin of homosexuality is debated.
 
lovetheworld said:
Just exactly - what is morally wrong about someone being gay? They were born that way, its the way God made them… As a Crhistian, ask yourself… who did Jesus ever Judge? Esp that no gay person has ever hurt you or anyone because of the way they are.

You have simply been taught hate… there is nothing Christian about your view… just because a lot of Christains maybe share it… does not make it right.

Like I said… Love the new pope!
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You do not speak for Catholic teaching.
 
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