Pope Declares-Non Catholics Do Not Possess the Full Truth

[believers]

You are encouraged to help out with that, you know! We need more knowledgeable and biblically grounded catechists.

Amen!

There is no contradiction between the doctrine of purgatory, and the doctrine of the resurrection. They are seamless parts of one another. A person who thinks otherwise does not properly understand one or the other doctrine.

This is an erroneous conclusion, believers. We have been raised with Christ positionally only, and not practically. Otherwise, we would all be in heaven right now, instead of writing to each other on this forum. We have the rest of our lives on this earth to live out the practical sense of our positional reality.

On the contrary, estesbob, it is a perfect example of how protestants are missing part of the truth. This particular protestant denies the truth of purgatory, demonstrating the accuracy of the Pope’s statement!

There is no truth in purgatory. Purgatory is not in the Bible no matter how much you say it’s truth.

2Cr 5:8
We are confident, , and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

 

[estesbob]

Actually, you are the first person I’ve heard tell me this.

Seventh-day adventists go back to the Decalogue and tell me how the Catholic Church is breaking it. They admit this passage as precedent, but see it, rather, as a spirit filled extension of the Saturday Sabbath.

Better later than never.

 

[Milliardo]

There is no truth in purgatory. Purgatory is not in the Bible no matter how much you say it’s truth.

And like I said, neither is Sunday worship, yet you follow it, yes? So why do you go to church on Sunday? Or are you going to ignore this issue?

We are told in 1 Peters that Jesus also taught to the spirits in prison; where is this prison then? It’s not heaven, nor is it hell.

 

[believers]

Not quite, believers. The Catholic church teaches that both these things are true. No one experiences purgatory who is not risen with Christ. The Catholic church teaches that we die with Christ in baptism, and are raised with him when we come up out of the waters of baptism. Also, you are misunderstanding Purgatory if you think it is a “place”. It is not a “place” but a state of being, from which a saved person is brought out of any “weight of sin that clings so easily”, since we know that nothing unclean can enter heaven, any dead works must be burned away from us (purged) before we can enjoy the face of Christ.

You are making a distinction where none exists, believers. All those who are baptised have died with Christ, and are risen with Him. Purgatory is the state during which those risen with Christ are prepared to see Him face to face. It is not “somewhere else”.

I strongly recommend that you refrain from adding words to the scripture. Catholics do not insert purgatory here. Neither do Catholics teach that the dead are not raised. You are in error on both points.

I strongly suggest you prove purgatory before preaching it.

 

[Man]

Better later than never.

I’m interested in where your objection comes from.

I’ve heard an Abbot use it as precedent…

In any case, it isn’t the first time I received “no it’s not.”

That is why, well, I’ve explained that…

 

[Man]

I strongly suggest you prove purgatory before preaching it.

Believers,

The New Testament shows us that we have three Gods! YHWH, Jesus, and the Paraclete.

I don’t see any indication that they are the same god, do you?

David

 

[believers]

And like I said, neither is Sunday worship, yet you follow it, yes? So why do you go to church on Sunday? Or are you going to ignore this issue?

We are told in 1 Peters that Jesus also taught to the spirits in prison; where is this prison then? It’s not heaven, nor is it hell.

I go to church on Sun, Wed, Fri ONLY because it’s scheduled for those days. It does not have to be on specific day. The spirits in prison are the demons in hell bound by chains.

The “spirits in prison” in 1Peter 3:19 were demons who sinned against God by “abandoning their proper abode” (Jude 6) in the sons of God / daughters of men incident (Genesis 6:1-4). These spirits were put in prison as punishment for their wicked deeds, and to prevent further occurrences of such wicked and ungodly actions.

 

[Milliardo]

I go to church on Sun, Wed, Fri ONLY because it’s scheduled for those days. It does not have to be on specific day. The spirits in prison are the demons in hell bound by chains.

Not answering the issue–so I’ll keep coming back–where is Sunday worship found in the Bible?

The “spirits in prison” in 1Peter 3:19 were demons who sinned against God by “abandoning their proper abode” (Jude 6)

Demons are wicked spirits; they could not profit from any preaching by our Lord since they do not follow Him, nor will they ever. So no go on this. And you still have yet to account where this prison is.

 

[Crumpy]

…I think it’s great the pope has come out with the full guns. It’s about time they were pointed about what they think.

If the Catholic Church did not express the truth and say what if fully believes, then it shouldn’t be in business, should it?

What we didn’t hear is some sort of “anathema” or condemnation of others as might have been done in the past.

Let’s take your neighborhood “full gospel” church or Bible church, or even the Baptist, Lutheran, or Presbyterian church, etc. and see if they make the claim that the Pope has.

I have heard Billy Graham and some conservative evangelical preachers say that some Catholics might be saved.

John Paul II and Benedict XVI are a couple of modern popes who want to shake off the legacies of hurtful things in the past. They are really “sticking their chins out” so to speak to bring people into a dialog and perhaps even into the truty.

I just had the experience of a protestant preacher acquaintance throw the deaths of the Inquisition in my face. You know? It’s the truth, but not the whole truth. There were also a lot of Catholics killed at the hands of protestants. Take the persecution in England when Henry the Eighth left the Catholic Church and formed the Anglican Church. He made everybody sign an oath of loyalty – or else, the “big” or else.

In the early colonies of what would be the United States, there were protestants executing “witches” in Salem Massachusetts, no?

I’m glad the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith said something like it did. I’m tired of just hearing the usual protestant complaints about Catholics.

It’s not very often these days that you hear Luther, Calvin, and Zwingli called heretics as they deserve to be. But, you sure hear a lot the other way around, from protestants.

The Reformation wasn’t! It didn’t reform the Catholic Church. It was as much a political reaction against Rome and its secular power as anything else.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

Hi,

I have a simple answer to the question of why we worship on Sunday.

Go all the way back to Genesis when God said He rested on the seventh day–right? Well in the Jewish calendar that would be on Saturday and in the Romans calendar(which we follow) it would be Sunday.

How is that for simple

K.I.S.S–Keep it simple stupid.

 

[Man]

That isn’t true, nor would it be effective.

 

[estesbob]

First you said this;

;Actually, you are the first person I’ve heard tell me this.

Now you say this:

In any case, it isn’t the first time I received "no it’s not."

…

 

[believers]

Not answering the issue–so I’ll keep coming back–where is Sunday worship found in the Bible?

Demons are wicked spirits; they could not profit from any preaching by our Lord since they do not follow Him, nor will they ever. So no go on this. And you still have yet to account where this prison is.

The Word is clear about who are chained in hell. The angels (sons of God) who did not obey from the Old Testament who went into the “daughters of men” from before the time of Noah. Unless you’ve read the OT, you’re not going to understand this.

 

[Man]

First you said this;

Now you say this:

I have had… several discussions, not all of them revolve around the same thing. I have at different times had reasonable arguments dismissed “out of hand.”

Are you really Catholic or are you “trolling” me for fun?

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Interesting, ALLFORHIM, but still begs the question–why do we follow the Roman calendar and not the Jewish one? Where was the 'break" made in the Bible? Why do we not follow the “Sabbath” day AND the “Lord’s Day” instead of changing Sabbath for “Sunday”?

For the Sabbath and Sunday are not ‘interchangeable’.

As Christians, we do not celebrate the Jewish Sabbath but rather its fulfillment in “The Lord’s Day”. Because this is a fulfillment, we are not breaking the command to ‘keep holy the Sabbath day’ when we go to church on Sunday.

 

[believers]

Believers,

The New Testament shows us that we have three Gods! YHWH, Jesus, and the Paraclete.

I don’t see any indication that they are the same god, do you?

David

Eph 4:6
One God and Father of all, who [is] above all, and through all, and in you all.

Gal 3:20
Now a mediator is not [a mediator] of one, but God is one.

1Ti 2:5
For [there is] one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

Jam 2:19
Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

I’m still waiting for Believers to tell us why we worship (as Christians) on Sundays. Sabbath Day and Sunday are NOT the same thing, but Sunday is the ‘fulfillment’ of the Sabbath; the Sabbath foreshadowed the Day of Resurrection. But that is not explicitly stated in the Bible. Therefore, it must be part of that oral tradition of which St. Paul spoke; it must be part of that ‘all truth’ to which we are told the Holy Spirit will guide us. IOW, it must be like the Trinity being “Three Divine Persons in One God” which is never stated in the Bible. It was the Holy Spirit who guided us to the Truth of the Trinity and enabled us to see, from what had been written, ‘beyond’ what was written to understand that Father, Son, and Spirit are One God in Three perfectly equal Divine Beings.

Jesus Christ is the Word of God, isn’t He? The Bible is the Word of God but is limited to specific written ‘words’ while Christ is the fullness of truth and the living Word. But, just as Jesus is ‘more’ than the Bible (though never contradicting it), the Holy Spirit is also ‘more’ than the Bible, and the Word is not to be found cramped into one book–even if that book is the Holy Bible.

Unless you think the Bible is equal to God Himself. . .

 

[Man]

Eph 4:6
One God and Father of all, who [is] above all, and through all, and in you all.

Gal 3:20
Now a mediator is not [a mediator] of one, but God is one.

1Ti 2:5
For [there is] one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

Jam 2:19
Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

Right, all those verses refer to YHWH, the problem you have understanding me is because your Bible doesn’t include the proper name! OF COURSE THERE IS BUT ONE YHWH!

 

[flyersfan1088]

So becuase they broke bread on a Sunday that makes it the Lords day? Following that logic it would appear Thursday should be the Lords day as that is the Last time Jesus “broke bread”

No, it would go back to Sunday because of what happened on the road to Emmaus

 

[estesbob]

No, it would go back to Sunday because of what happened on the road to Emmaus

Well I go everyday so i guess I’ve got all the bases covered,