Pope finally launches crackdown on world's largest illicit Catholic shrine [Medjugorje] and suspends 'dubious' priest

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I frankly hope it’s true…If it is not Catholics are going to look like superstitious idiots who tell outrageous lies

I know a lovely lady that has gone to Medjugorje…she will be so hurt if this is not true…It might cause people to lose their faith…The church must be careful
Despite the way my posts read, I also hope that the Church decides in favor of Medjugorje.

However, until or unless it is approved, those who promote it are usurping the authority of the Church.

For all we know, Medjugorje could be the work of Satan.
 
Despite the way my posts read, I also hope that the Church decides in favor of Medjugorje.

However, until or unless it is approved, those who promote it are usurping the authority of the Church.

For all we know, Medjugorje could be the work of Satan.
I agree once more
 
What ‘Imprimatur’ are you talking of??
I am not ignoring you. I will need some time to find it.

Let me backtrack. It is not an impramatur. However…

“Since the abolition of Canons 1399 and 2318 of the former Code of Cannon Law by Pope Paul VI in AAS 58 (1966), P. 1186, publications about new apparitions, revelations, prophecies, miracles, etc., have been allowed to be distributed and read by the faithful without the express permission of the Church, providing that they contain nothig that contravenes faith and morals This means no imprimatur is necessary. However it is welcome!”
Cardinal Bona

This is not what I was looking for, and I shall continue to look for it. But this seems enough to say that the Church does not stand in the way of believing or disbelieving…according to the fruits.
 
A FEW WORDS ON WHAT AN IMPRIMATUR IS NOT!!!

An imprimatur means that, to the best of a bishop’s awareness, the book or movie or publication in question has nothing in it that is opposed to Catholic faith. That’s it, nothing more. It does not mean that everything in the book is absolute truth. It does not mean that book is infallible. Bishops are not individually infallible. That a book has an imprimatur does not mean that it is Catholic doctrine and part of the deposit of faith received from the apostles.
 
Might be bogus. Might be.

Yet I know a lady who was diagnosed by two Neurologists as having M.S. Medication did some good, but certainly did not resolve the symptom onsets. She went to Med, came back asymptomatic and was declared by one of the neuros (she didn’t see the other) as being completely free of any sign of it. That was 20+ years ago, and she has remained totally symptom free despite taking no medication at all during all that time. Before she returned, a distant relative who knew nothing about her trip mailed to her home a painting of Our Lady holding a gold rosary which had been painted by another relative decades ago and ended up with the sender. The original artist was, then, still alive. No explanation was given other than “I thought you might want this.” The sender was not on the traveler’s side of the family, but her husband’s, and they have no other contact.

Could just be chance. Sometimes people with M.S. go symptom free for reasons no one knows. Sometimes even two neurologists can make a wrong diagnosis. Sometimes people send things to others they barely know without having the least idea that they would want them. Still, thing like that make it a little hard to give Med no credence at all.
 
That article was written 18 years ago…He could be mistaken, or speaking the truth

I am waiting for Rome
 
A FEW WORDS ON WHAT AN IMPRIMATUR IS NOT!!!

An imprimatur means that, to the best of a bishop’s awareness, the book or movie or publication in question has nothing in it that is opposed to Catholic faith. That’s it, nothing more. It does not mean that everything in the book is absolute truth. It does not mean that book is infallible. Bishops are not individually infallible. That a book has an imprimatur does not mean that it is Catholic doctrine and part of the deposit of faith received from the apostles.
Thank you for the information. I read so much that it will take a while to come up with exactly the information I was speaking of.
As I said, the word impramatur is not the correct one.
Yet, Medjugoria is still allowed to be believed. And it will continue to be so unless it’s fruits show themselves to be against the Truth. So it is a good thing, and totally acceptable to go and believe that the apparitions and messages are real. We are not compelled to accept them, but nor are we disallowed to accept them.
 
I hope it is true, but I don’t know, and am not going to get involved in anything that might be a hoax…
 
There have been countless “apparitions” claimed down through the centuries. Are we supposed to believe them too?

There are probably hundreds of apparitions being claimed around the world right now. Are we supposed to believe them too?

Our default perspective on apparitions should not be to believe them unless proved false. Rather, it should be to NOT believe them unless the Church approves of them first, otherwise we’ll be chasing every water stain under every highway overpass as an “apparition.”

Recent famous “apparitions” which have been deemed false by the Church are those from Bayside, New York and Garabandal, Spain. Both of those had large followings, and still some people persist in disobedience to the Church. Will Medjugorje be next? It’s up to the Church to decide and we should have the virtue of patience.

I once heard the story of a bishop who was saying Mass around the 17th century (I don’t recall the details). During the Mass, one of his aides ran into the chapel to tell him that there was an apparition of Jesus Christ in the other room. The bishop looked at his aide and said, “There’s no need for me to go there to see Christ. I see him here in the Eucharist.” (If anyone has any details on this allegedly true story please post them.)
 
There have been countless “apparitions” claimed down through the centuries. Are we supposed to believe them too?

There are probably hundreds of apparitions being claimed around the world right now. Are we supposed to believe them too?

Our default perspective on apparitions should not be to believe them unless proved false. Rather, it should be to NOT believe them unless the Church approves of them first, otherwise we’ll be chasing every water stain under every highway overpass as an “apparition.”

On paper, that looks really good. But if we ignore the messages and do not increase our prayers, and do not turn away from our sin under threat of grave consequences…which is exactly the messages of these and other apparitions…then we pass up the chances to change what would happen if we didn’t pray and change.
The messages of Medjugoria are quite simple…Love JESUS, pray the Rosary, faste, recieve the Sacraments.


Recent famous “apparitions” which have been deemed false by the Church are those from Bayside, New York and Garabandal, Spain. Both of those had large followings, and still some people persist in disobedience to the Church. Will Medjugorje be next? It’s up to the Church to decide and we should have the virtue of patience.

The thing about Garabandal is this: it was the same message. Love JESUS, pray, faste, recieve the Sacraments. So even if there were no apparitions, the message is still correct.

I once heard the story of a bishop who was saying Mass around the 17th century (I don’t recall the details). During the Mass, one of his aides ran into the chapel to tell him that there was an apparition of Jesus Christ in the other room. The bishop looked at his aide and said, “There’s no need for me to go there to see Christ. I see him here in the Eucharist.” (If anyone has any details on this allegedly true story please post them.)
None of these alleged apparitions do anything other than to point toward Jesus in the Eucharist.
I’ve never even heard of anyone trying to get people to go to Medjugoria in order to see the Blessed Mother Mary.
 
The messages of Medjugoria are quite simple…Love JESUS, pray the Rosary, faste, recieve the Sacraments…
This is a great message, but we don’t need unapproved apparitions to tell us what the Church, scripture, and the saints have been telling us for 2,000 years.

It’ll be great if Medjugorje is approved, but it is not needed to know that we should “Love JESUS, pray the Rosary, faste, recieve the Sacraments.”

The real danger here is that if Medjugorje is condemned, as many claimed apparitions eventually are, is what will happen to all the disillusioned people? Will they have invested so much in a false seer’s words that they end up drifting away from the faith?

And again I ask, why the desire to believe in apparitions that have yet to be approved? How do we know that this is not a diabolical trick?
 
This is a great message, but we don’t need unapproved apparitions to tell us what the Church, scripture, and the saints have been telling us for 2,000 years.

then why did the Blessed Mother Mary appear to the three children in Fatima? And what was the apparition before it was approved? Did the fact that it had not had the chance to be investigated and approved make it any less real?

It’ll be great if Medjugorje is approved, but it is not needed to know that we should “Love JESUS, pray the Rosary, faste, recieve the Sacraments.”

***I grew up in the Catholic Church…never missing Mass on Sundays. I NEVER recall being prompted by anyone within the Church to go to Confession or say the Rosary…let alone to faste, even on Friday’s during Lent.
And I have talked to many people in my adult life from many places who didn’t have ANYONE talk to them about these things, or the importance of them.

They were spoken of once Medjugoria became known…especially because of Pope John Paul II. But without what was begun in Medjugoria, I don’t think that the Pope would have had half of the popularity that he did. I don’t think the poeple would have given him their attention. The apparitions in Medjugoria woke people up. And we had been asleep for a generation or two.***

The real danger here is that if Medjugorje is condemned, as many claimed apparitions eventually are, is what will happen to all the disillusioned people? Will they have invested so much in a false seer’s words that they end up drifting away from the faith?

***Only if they are basing their faith on these apparitions. Fact is, people who recieved the message and did what the Blessed Mother asked do not need the apparitions to be proven in order for their faith in Christ and His Church to be real. We go to Adoration of the Blessed Sacrament, recieve the Sacraments often, pray the Rosary, & faste. The messages are for those who haven’t been doing it. I had not…nor had millions of others who are now doing so because of the message of Medjugoria.
Our faith is not based on the authenticity of the apparitions. By it’s fruits, we have been converted to Christ Jesus. Just like those converted because of the messages of Fatima or Lourdes or Guadaloupe.

And again I ask, why the desire to believe in apparitions that have yet to be approved? How do we know that this is not a diabolical trick?

***It took years for Padre Pio to be authenticated. What about all of the thousands of people who would not have been helped by him if they had waited until he was authenticated. According to what you are saying, no one should have gone to Confession to him until he was approved. But many went to him for Confession, and recieved special words for themselves about the state of their souls. What if they had not gone to him for Confession, and died before he had been approved?
By the fruits shall you know them.
By the fruits of what is coming out of Medjugoria do we know it. And the most important thing is not the apparitions or apparitioners. It is the conversions. Conversions by the hundreds that were not happening in our lukewarm society until word came of Medjugoria.

 
We need to be more precise with the language.

The claimed apparitions are still going on. To speak of them in the sense that you do is to have already validated their authenticity without evidence.

These are claimed apparitions.

Where does this leave all those tons of former trees that have the BVM’s (supposed)utterances printed on them ? How did those “messages” come about ?​

 
People claim to see the Blessed Mother in toasters, skillets and the side of buildings. My experience with many, many people who believe Medj. is they follow it with a cultish zeal. Any comment against Medj. and they get really defensive.

Sadly - I firmly believe that if the Vatican disapproves of the “apparitions”, it will not change the devotion at all.

I personally do not believe the “seers” are seeing anything holy.
 
I would like to comment on a couple posts. First to JesusNCherie I can’t believe you never heard of fasting and rosary or confession or were encouraged to participate in them while attending Mass every Sunday. This strains credulity.
How about the other members of your parish ? If you went back and talked to them now would they all say the same as you? That would make it the strangest Catholic Parish in the world. This is probably why some people go to Medj. For whatever reason they did not connect with their faith through the proper channels and want some new "exciting " way to do it. This is not where true spirituality lies.

Also , knowing that Fatima and Lourdes are approved as you say, why on earth would you not chose to make a pilgramage there than to a place high in controversy unapproved by the Church?

In regard to Padre Pio, thosands of people were helped by GOD not by Padre Pio and if going to confession to him had been banned then GOD would have chosen another channel and Padre Pio would probably obeyed the Church and stopped hearing confessions. There have been distinct obedience problems with Medj. seerers and promotors.

I also watched that video of one of the seers allegedly having a vision (Jan 2009) Never saw anything so fake in all my life. So fake it is laughable.

Please, be obedient to the Church, exercise caution in very gray areas like this. Pray to God daily without fan fare. You never have to leave home to be with God.
 
I have been to Medjugorje 2004. I went with a group and Spiritual Director. I am aware about everything that is being said about the visions. However from the moment we arrived we were warned not to be looking for anything supernatural, like the Sun spinning or anything else that we might have heard about.
We in Ireland have not been told that we should not go.
Anything that Our Lady is related as saying, is Pray, Pray, Pray, and do sacrifices. Turn to my Son.
For myself I cannot see anything harmful in that, and the devotion and Prayer and Masses that are said hourly, surely can only be good. When people pray together it can only be a good thing.
However I do see where people could let their imaginations run away with them and think they have experienced something supernatural and it could be harmful and I think the Pope is concerned about that.
However only time will tell what the truth is and if the Pope made a world-wide announcement that we were forbidden to go I would obey that.
I think that if the Pope really forbids it, it will be announced through our Priests in every Catholic Church.
 
In the last half of the article it says that the Pope, as Cardinal R., banned all pilgrimages to the illicit shrine…but that his ban has been “widely ignored.” The article also comments about three investigations which found the apparitions to be unsustainable–without evidence.
 
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