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joyfulandactive
Guest
Marriage between a man and a woman is not “far right”.
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Gingersnaps4
Guest
Absolutely correct. Because I am catholic, my non-catholic dad actually called me today to tell me that the catholic teaching on gay couples/unions had changed. I tried to explain Church law and he disagreed and said that since the pope said it, it changed the teaching. :woman_facepalming:t2: And see, 90% of people out there are just as uninformed about the church as he is, and that includes people that ARE Catholic.
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Polak
Guest
Yet JPII never supported homosexual civil unions. Not saying Pope Francis definitely does, but he certainly appears to at the moment.
I thought this might be the case. So he doesn’t talk about how homosexuals have the right to be in a family and then right after that, say we need a law for same sex couples? This is what the CNA piece has implied.
Yes I mentioned the director being a Russian atheist before. It doesn’t surprise me if he has edited two different clips of the Pope saying something together to try to make it look as if one follows on naturally from the other. Again though, as I stated before, why is the Pope even taking part in a documentary made by such a guy? Doesn’t he have people to research a film director a bit before he agrees to be in his film?
Not looking to hear from any specific clergy, just as many clergy as possible.
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sorrowful1
Guest
Is civil union same as marriage? Or, how is it different from marriage?
H
humilityseeker
Guest
As in the Sacrament of Matrimony in the Catholic Church?
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Polak
Guest
Oh my is Jimmy Martin milking this as much as he can.
He says bishops who are very much against civil partnerships are now going to have to re-think their position on the subject.
He says bishops who are very much against civil partnerships are now going to have to re-think their position on the subject.
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sorrowful1
Guest
Well, I mean in general.
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Polak
Guest
Here is the director of the movie talking about being gay himself and his frustration with not being able to be with (and have children with) a man he loves, because that man’s mother is Catholic and isn’t approving of the relationship (from 0.39).
Certainly a very good motive for trying to paint the head of the Catholic Church as pro-gay.
Certainly a very good motive for trying to paint the head of the Catholic Church as pro-gay.
C
christofirst
Guest
Here is an informative article which explains that the short civil union quote in the new documentary originally came from a longer interview which Pope Francis gave in 2019 to a journalist from Mexico. This article is worth reading, for context regarding the current controversy, and also for the other topics that were covered in that 2019 interview.
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Petra202
Guest
Hi and welcome back! I often get riled up with things reported in the news and then I research and find out “the rest of the story”! Headlines can be so inflammatory! I’m waiting for further clarification! And in the meantime we can read the banter here on caf by some very knowledgeable people. 
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Xarto
Guest
Here I am, stuck in the middle with you 
This may be key to the whole discussion.
Obviously, the law grants some advantages exclusively to married couples. For example, in the U.S. there are a number of advantages to married couples, such as being able to file their tax returns jointly and obtain certain advantages from that.
From the article:
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StarMapp
Guest
The Pontif’s use of same sex couples could only be a description of the context that the letter applies. “Same sex couples” somehow has me reverting my research to the doctrine on the avoidance to the occasions to sin. If I was assigned to draw up a letter, it would have me focusing on the “don’t even go there” component as scripture would recommend.
I wonder what the letter to all those who through hard work and the help of the Holy Mother and operation Courage, have managed to trust their brothers and sisters who promised they can help turn their life around.
This is not to say their are not biological reasons for a person’s orientation , put that has always through the centuries been a very low percentage.
I wonder what the letter to all those who through hard work and the help of the Holy Mother and operation Courage, have managed to trust their brothers and sisters who promised they can help turn their life around.
This is not to say their are not biological reasons for a person’s orientation , put that has always through the centuries been a very low percentage.
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StudentMI
Guest
Too bad the Pope’s comments will probably be interpreted by some Courage members as “sorry you wasted your time here.”
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joyfulandactive
Guest
It’s just the confusion that now reigns. This director clearly doesn’t understand Church teaching, it’s just about people being “old-fashioned” and the “church teaching to hate people” - which I can definitely say NEVER happens, particularly because I have never heard a priest teach about homosexuality in my life.
It’s also the entitlement to children that is concerning. There was an article in the NYT in the last couple of months where a homosexual journalist talked about homosexual “Rights to Children” and that surrogacy should be a right. No mention of the woman (usually a poor woman) who would be providing a womb and bringing forth a child. There was lots of discussion on women’s forums about it.
It’s also the entitlement to children that is concerning. There was an article in the NYT in the last couple of months where a homosexual journalist talked about homosexual “Rights to Children” and that surrogacy should be a right. No mention of the woman (usually a poor woman) who would be providing a womb and bringing forth a child. There was lots of discussion on women’s forums about it.
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JW55
Guest
KMC
18h
If Pope Francis says something that is seemingly contradictory to prior magisterial teaching (calling for same sex unions does this), then he has the responsibility to explain to the faithful how what he said does not conflict OR he needs to retract it.
When people rightly and justly show great concern in this regards, it does not make them anti-Pope Francis, it makes them pro-truth."
My commentary below;
My quoting didn’t quite get copied the way I would have hoped but the above statement is in reference to two different post. Sorry, if there is confusion.
There has been a lot of good commentary on this thread but the attachment above may be what I feel is the best statement. Often, there is commentary on something the Pope said that appears to question the statement, the label seems to routinely come out as labelling that person as anti-Pope or Pope-Hater. I would think for most people that statement isn’t true.
Whether it be the Pope is taken out of context, he is stating a personal opinion or the statement simply seems vague or ambiguous, we as Catholics would like clarification. As the poster above states, questioning or asking for clarification does not make one Anti-Pope Francis and our primary aim should be “pro-truth”.
We all know that the secular media often edits, twists statements or highlights portions of a statement very often to further their own agenda, The subject of this thread is very political and highly controversial and serves as a serious issue to be dealt within the church. We are in time of great upheaval and strife but many are trying to shape the Church in their own image. During these difficult times we need clear guidelines about what the church teaches.
This forum is obviously not a “go-to” documentation to supporting church teachings but it is an opportunity to exchange ideas and not silence others. I sure don’t agree with everyone on here and I know lots of people don’t agree with me, but that is what a forum is. It is an opportunity to share thoughts. Sometimes people link some relevant information on teaching that may help clarify someone’s misaligned thoughts. Sometimes it is just rants.
The Church is going in lot of different directions in our parishes all around the world. We are seeing teachings across the spectrum on how we should interpret our Catholic Faith. In many parishes, we are now seeing simply a reflection of the secular world out side the church walls.
18h
"I have the right as a baptized Catholic to be instructed properly about the faith (Code of Canon Law 217).
If Pope Francis says something that is seemingly contradictory to prior magisterial teaching (calling for same sex unions does this), then he has the responsibility to explain to the faithful how what he said does not conflict OR he needs to retract it.
When people rightly and justly show great concern in this regards, it does not make them anti-Pope Francis, it makes them pro-truth."
My commentary below;
My quoting didn’t quite get copied the way I would have hoped but the above statement is in reference to two different post. Sorry, if there is confusion.
There has been a lot of good commentary on this thread but the attachment above may be what I feel is the best statement. Often, there is commentary on something the Pope said that appears to question the statement, the label seems to routinely come out as labelling that person as anti-Pope or Pope-Hater. I would think for most people that statement isn’t true.
Whether it be the Pope is taken out of context, he is stating a personal opinion or the statement simply seems vague or ambiguous, we as Catholics would like clarification. As the poster above states, questioning or asking for clarification does not make one Anti-Pope Francis and our primary aim should be “pro-truth”.
We all know that the secular media often edits, twists statements or highlights portions of a statement very often to further their own agenda, The subject of this thread is very political and highly controversial and serves as a serious issue to be dealt within the church. We are in time of great upheaval and strife but many are trying to shape the Church in their own image. During these difficult times we need clear guidelines about what the church teaches.
This forum is obviously not a “go-to” documentation to supporting church teachings but it is an opportunity to exchange ideas and not silence others. I sure don’t agree with everyone on here and I know lots of people don’t agree with me, but that is what a forum is. It is an opportunity to share thoughts. Sometimes people link some relevant information on teaching that may help clarify someone’s misaligned thoughts. Sometimes it is just rants.
The Church is going in lot of different directions in our parishes all around the world. We are seeing teachings across the spectrum on how we should interpret our Catholic Faith. In many parishes, we are now seeing simply a reflection of the secular world out side the church walls.
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T
Toledo
Guest
It again is a debate of mercy and justice. If any part of the Church only preaches the mercy component without notifying people of God’s justice, it does all Catholics a disservice. God is both perfectly just and perfectly merciful.
The Church and its people need clarity. Confusion only serves Satan.
Does this surprise you? He is one of the chief pundits of giving only half the message.
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Polak
Guest
Headline In today’s Metro paper in the UK. It’s the most circulated paper in the country because it’s free on public transport.
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1Lord1Faith
Guest
There are plenty of examples in the gospels of the Apostles being confused about something Jesus said. The Bread of Life discourse is one example. There are several other parables which the Apostles expressed confusion about their meaning.
So, I don’t think your blanket statement about confusion is correct.
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StudentMI
Guest
Oh no that’s wasn’t foreseeable or anything!
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