Pope Francis calls for civil union law for same-sex couples

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Motherwit said:
The Mexican standoff approach is futile.
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Wasn’t that expressed in Gaudium et spes? Now, what was the Latin for Mexican standoff again…🤔

OTOH, giving up ground doesn’t seem to be a great approach either. (I’m not saying the Pope gave up ground) Look at what’s been done with trying to bring the SSPX back into communion with Rome. That hasn’t exactly worked either.
 
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Polak said:
Thank you for this.

Yes, can we post links to the reactions of cardinals and bishops if we find them. I care more about their responses to this than media personalities and even Catholic apologists.
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And I can guess 2 specific Cardinals you want to hear from as well as on auxiliary Bishop.
 
Motherwit said:
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BigBoom:
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meltzerboy2:
Why do you believe Pope Francis is leading people away from Christ? It seems to me he is doing just the opposite by showing that the Church cares for and loves all, because all people are children of G-d, as the Pope said. Wouldn’t more people be attracted to the Church because of such beliefs?
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Because he’s justifying people in their sin, not leading them away from it.
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The Mexican standoff approach is futile. The Church adopted the title of Pontiff meaning “bridge builder” from the Roman Pagans, who had a ‘college of pontiffs’ to build a bridge between their deities and the people. The idea of meeting people where they are at isn’t justifying them in their sin. It’s bringing God right into their world. For many years the Church struggled with how to serve Christians in China by the Mexican standoff but its become prudent to build a bridge and meet them where they are at.
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The pope and church isn’t meant to bring God into our world or "their world. It’s supposed to bring us to God.
 
SantaFe . . .
the same bunch who rewards Trump’s lies and incompetence with blind loyalty I might add.
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Why drag “Trump” into a forum thread having to do with Pope Francis and his opinion on “civil unions”?
 
Cathoholic said:
Why drag “Trump” into a forum thread having to do with Pope Francis and his opinion on “civil unions”?
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He gave his opinion on civil unions AND Donald Trump. The latter hasn’t generated much discussion on this particular board. At least for now.
 
But he’s always stepping in it. He’s always putting his foot in his mouth. He is in no JP II. Smh.
 
No; I’m not ‘complaining’ that they aired a report, but their interpretation of what was said was incorrect. The clips taken mentioned a support of laws and civil unions. As others have noted elsewhere, sentences were taken from previous interviews and ‘mashed together’, for example the words about having a family and not being thrown out of it (which sounds like parents not kicking out children and in fact appears to have been said in an interview in 2019) and then as if it were in the same ‘paragraph’ talking about the Pope ‘supporting a law’. And that ties back to his time in Argentina in which he most emphatically did not in any way support the CHURCH’s acceptance of civil unions, but rather of secular ‘protection’ laws. Pope Francis is not one who grew up in a US or European democracy and has a far different view of government than a US citizen.

Having a clear memory of how the media twisted Pope Benedict’s words regarding condoms and male prostitutes, and its attempts to make it appear he claimed the use of condoms was a moral good, I am very suspicious of any media remarks on this documentary as I do not feel that they have been any more ‘honest’ now than they were then.

I do not criticise or judge Pope Francis but I’m not going to accept what “the media says he says’. Their track record for most outlets (and that includes WCAX’s parent company of CBS) with regard to ‘getting it right’ is beyond abysmal.
 
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I’m very disappointed in the headlines and the usual ambiguity that will lead people astray, and also this will lead liberal clergy to take their usual mile anytime they are given an inch.

People ignorant of church law think the official teachings of the church have now changed. And yes, no matter what the Holy Father MEANT, saying you approve of same sex civil unions leads to the assumption that you approve of same sex relations. Of course! I mean who would approve of traditional marriage, but not sex??

I’m not a rad trad or anything like this, but I’m tired of this Pope saying things that lead to scandal and then refusing to clarify. I can only pray that the next pope is very orthodox and clear with what he says.
 
DlandFan06 said:
But he’s always stepping in it. He’s always putting his foot in his mouth.
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Is he? Yes, he does say a lot of things that those on the far right disagree with. But that does not mean he is misspeaking. It’s no secret that he harbors little sympathy for the far right.
 
I don’t know if Pope Francis vision is anything like mine, but I really lament the loss of the communion of Christian Brothers and of Religious Sisters that were a hallmark of Catholic education, healthcare, missionary work and other fields. There’s really no vocation anymore that requires that sort of community. I have often wondered if the civil recognition of a brotherhood and sisterhood, that one day the vocation of a chaste community of such would bring back those godly vocations for the work of God.
 
Harbors little sympathy for the far right? And how do you know that? Are you saying the Church’s teachings are far right?
 
It may be that the media is distorting the truth yet again and I think more faith in our Holy Father is warranted.
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Pope civil unions comment appears to be an edited mashup, and not in original transcript from 2019 Popular Media
I thought this deserved its own thread. So it appears the part about people having a right to a family was unrelated to civil unions. This is all from a 2019 interview. The “right to a family” part was about not disowning your kids and he is clear about the morality of same-sex acts. The endorsement for civil unions for legal protections is not in the transcript, but might be from the same interview. Not sure if true, but I read that comment was in relation to Argentina when he opposed same …
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DlandFan06 said:
Harbors little sympathy for the far right? And how do you know that? Are you saying the Church’s teachings are far right?
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He has spoken out against the wall builders, laissez-faire capitalism, climate change denial, mass deportation of refugees etc. He is very much espousing Church teaching in the face of far right political positions.
 
OraLabora said:
If the article is true, it’s a sign of the Holy Father’s humanity and pastoral wisdom. It only increases my admiration for him.
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Perhaps he might have mentioned in passing that while sensitive to the need for a legal framework for persons of the same sex who wish to live as “family”, the church does not endorse a sexual relationship between such persons.

I am certain his statement is going to be reported as endorsing far more than it actually does…
 
SantaFe said:
Because we ALL share the same tiny blue dot in this infinite universe, we’re all human and we all have different beliefs that need to be respected and heard.
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there is only one Jesus, one savior,

there is no salvation without Jesus
 
As parents we are working hard to be loving and teaching our children and teens the eternal teaching of the Church regarding sexuality and marriage. It just feels like Francis keeps pushing us under the bus. There are NO voices in the secular world supporting so-called “traditional marriage” it’s actually just marriage as every society has always know it: a permanent union between a man and woman who are the parents of their biological children.

The Bishops, priests and Cardinals barely say a world of support and now the Pope apparently allows a lot of people in and outside the Church to experience confusion about Church Teaching without explanation.

Sure enough the secular response is “oh well see, the Bible is irrelevant the Church should now have married clergy, Women priests and heterosexual couples should live together if they want”. I literally read and heard this today. People were saying “Well I guess that even the Pope’s not Catholic - 2020 strikes again”.

So yes, I totally understand her frustration. Where is the clear, sure voice of orthodox Catholic Christian teaching? Parents are assailed from all sides: media, internet, schools all attack Christianity and now the Pope seems to constantly enjoy flirting with ambiguity.

Doesn’t anyone understand how hard it is to be a Christian married couple raising a Christian family right now?
 
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