Pope & Icon of Kazan

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Amadeus:
HS:

I work about a mile from Skokie but I can assure you that I miserably failed to have a sniff of this article by “Fr. Willard Jabusch.”
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He seems like a wonderful man…

a composer of music
musicapacis.com/index.html

an article in the London Tablet
thetablet.co.uk/cgi-bin/archive_index.cgi/tablet-author-Willard_Jabusch

photo and interview here
catholicnewworld.com/archive/cnw2001/052701/interview.html

a couple of published books
amazon.ca/exec/obidos/search-handle-url/index=books-ca&field-author=Willard%20F%20Jabusch/ref=sr_sp_dp_1_1/701-0350443-1941942
 
However when all is said and done this quote from the NCR today
gives us the bottom line.

"At a deeper level, however, most analysts agree that the real issue between Orthodox and Catholics is fear: a general Russian fear of outsiders; a specific Russian fear of “the West,” especially in the form of Poles; and a post-Soviet fear that the Orthodox church, weakened by 70 years of state oppression, won’t be able to compete with a big-money, highly-organized Catholic missionary operation. Whether such an operation exists is a matter of debate, but in a way it’s irrelevant – many Russians believe it does. "

"Later, when reporters asked Archpriest Chaplin, the spokesperson for the Moscow Patriarchate, if the return of the icon could be said to mark a new chapter in Orthodox/Catholic relations, he was even more curt: “No.”

So be it.
 
Fr. Ambrose,

You seem to have a lot of time on your hands for being a priest-monk. It must be nice to be able to say anything you want about yourself on line in total anonymity. I believe your not a priest. If you are, you should spend more of your time praying and admistering the sacraments. Why waste your time on a Catholic web-site. I don’t forsee us rejecting Papal infallibility anytime soon.

.
 
Fr Ambrose:
. . .
But there is another reason why this pope, his health aside, will not visit Moscow. He is Polish. There is a long and unhappy history of Poles in Russia. The Russians believe that their “Time of Troubles” started when a young man appeared at the castle of a Polish nobleman claiming to be the Czarevich Dmitry, the heir to the throne of Russia. The papal nuncio and Polish Jesuits were very supportive since the young pretender, who converted to Catholicism, agreed to help establish Catholic schools and churches and convert Russians to the One True Church of Rome.
. . .
.
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There seems a longer, more unhappy, and more recent history of Russians in Poland.
 
As the redoubtable Orestes Brownson once observed:
The great objection the Russian clergy and the people appear to have to this reconciliation, is their fear that it would be only a prelude to the substitution of the Latin rite for their present Greek rite.* But this fear, created in past times by the Poles, is unfounded.* The Greek rite is as old, as legitimate, and as sacred as the Latin; and the popes give every possible assurance that it shall not be disturbed.* The Greek rite is more gorgeous, and in several respects more beautiful than the Latin, and far better suited to the oriental mind.* Nor is any change in discipline, save the restoration of the old discipline of the Greek Church, broken down by the interference of the civil power, to be apprehended.* The terms of reunion were foxed by the Council of Florence, and will not be departed from, at least to the prejudice of the Russians.* Most of the fear of the Russians on this point are due to the efforts of the Poles, when they had the ascendency in Russia, to force them not only to accept a reunion with Rome, but also to adapt the Latin rite.* The poles have much to answer for in the continuance of the Russian schism, and they still do much to prevent the reconciliation.
 
oat soda:
Fr. Ambrose,

You seem to have a lot of time on your hands for being a priest-monk. It must be nice to be able to say anything you want about yourself on line in total anonymity. I believe your not a priest. If you are, you should spend more of your time praying and admistering the sacraments. Why waste your time on a Catholic web-site. I don’t forsee us rejecting Papal infallibility anytime soon.

.
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Nice.:rolleyes:

It could be that God wishes Fr Ambrose to further ecumencial progress by participating on these forums. I’ve learned from him and yes there are things he has said I don’t agree with!

I don’t think he is wasting his time. Far from it.
 
oat soda:
Fr. Ambrose,

You seem to have a lot of time on your hands for being a priest-monk. It must be nice to be able to say anything you want about yourself on line in total anonymity. I believe your not a priest. If you are, you should spend more of your time praying and admistering the sacraments. Why waste your time on a Catholic web-site. I don’t forsee us rejecting Papal infallibility anytime soon. .
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Perhaps like Jesus, he sees being a “:contributor” more of a grace filled aim than beng a critiquer and adding nothing - you know like Shakespeare describes them, “a loud voice signifying nothing”.
 
oat soda:
Fr. Ambrose,

You seem to have a lot of time on your hands for being a priest-monk. It must be nice to be able to say anything you want about yourself on line in total anonymity. I believe your not a priest. If you are, you should spend more of your time praying and admistering the sacraments. Why waste your time on a Catholic web-site. I don’t forsee us rejecting Papal infallibility anytime soon.
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Dear Oat Soda,

I have been more active than usual because of bad health. The long church services for the feast of Dormition last weekend kicked off a bout of fibrillation, and I have been more or less sleepless and chained to this chair the last few days.

I enjoy this list and the people on it. While everybody else who visits me at home is fussing over me and treating me as if I am on the threshold of death I can log in here and get involved in discussions which stimulate the brain and, hopefully, contribute to Catholic-Orthodox understanding.

My daily prayer rule needs two plus hours a day. I get through it.

You don’t believe I am a priest? Check for my name here

directory.sjkp.org/

and

rocor.org.au/
Click on Parish Directory

Why am I on this Forum?
  1. I enjoy it.
  2. I think that we should be interacting and gaining better understanding. This is the good side of ecumenism. And just look at the flak taken on this Forum by the Russian Patriarch because he is seen as being standoffish.
  3. I am on several Orthodox lists and they all have some Catholic apologists who contribute. It is very rare that somebody (usually a newcower to the list) will be boorish and ask “why waste your time here?”
I basically restrict myself to the Non-Catholic area of the Forum and to discussing Orthodox topics.

May God and His holy Mother bless you,
Fr Ambrose
 
You seem to have a lot of time on your hands for being a priest-monk. It must be nice to be able to say anything you want about yourself on line in total anonymity. I believe your not a priest. If you are, you should spend more of your time praying and admistering the sacraments. Why waste your time on a Catholic web-site. I don’t forsee us rejecting Papal infallibility anytime soon.
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I can’t claim to know Fr. Ambrose in real life, but I know people who do, and I can vouch that he is indeed a priest in the Russian Orthodox Church Abroad. And the good father is not “wasting his time”, but providing an Orthodox POV. Surely if Catholic-Orthodox relations are being discussed, it is good to have an Orthodox voice or two?
 
I too will say that I am glad the Fr. Ambrose is here. I can tell you from personal experience that there are few things so dull as a discussion forum where everyone agrees. Meanwhile, the charge that Fr. A is impersonating a priest is too silly to bear serious refutation. What possible sort of sly advantage could a man hope to win by adopting the identity of a schismatic priest on a Catholic board? I mean, really… :ehh:
 
Fr Ambrose:
How many Scottish pipers are masquerading as Polish traditionalists on this Forum??!!
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I cannot imagine that there are any, but if you find some, do let me know. I would be charmed to meet them. 🙂
 
Thanks very much for our Icon back letter!

vatican.va/holy_father/special_features/kazan/documents/kazan_message-alexis-ii_20040831_en.htm

Can any of you who know more about Orthodox / Catholic relations than I (all of you!) comment? Is it a genuinely warm letter or is it the sort of thank you you send to an aunt you don’t get on with but have to thank for her present?

E.G. I can interpret inter denominational stuff here which, occasionally, is on the surface is friendly, but underneath is a thinly disguised attack! :banghead:

For what’s it worth I think this looks genuinely charitable. Any signs of a thaw?🙂
 
Fr Ambrose:
I’ve been asking myself the same question, Grz. How many Scottish pipers are masquerading as Polish traditionalists on this Forum??!! %between%
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If you can give me some tips on the polish traditionalist part I’ll give it a go:D
 
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ybeayf:
I can’t claim to know Fr. Ambrose in real life, but I know people who do, and I can vouch that he is indeed a priest in the Russian Orthodox Church Abroad. And the good father is not “wasting his time”, but providing an Orthodox POV. Surely if Catholic-Orthodox relations are being discussed, it is good to have an Orthodox voice or two?
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I am glad to have the Orthodox here, as Grz said it would be a boring discussion board of everyone agreed. I am also glad to learn of the eastern churches.
 
Fr Ambrose:
Phew! Isn’t that a trenchant appraisal of the changes which have occured? 👋
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It’s a shame it took until John XXIII to open those windows…

To further the anology - however it’s a bit distressing nowadays to see some trying to nail the windows shut again (I always get a great mental picture of these people trying to catch the old air and get it back in!):rotfl: and equally distressing to see others attempting to dynamite the walls because enough new air isn’t getting in… if the walls go the roof’s going to come down…:eek:
 
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JGC:
If you can give me some tips on the polish traditionalist part I’ll give it a go
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Hey, JGC, are you a piper too? What grade do you play?
 
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GrzeszDeL:
Hey, JGC, are you a piper too? What grade do you play?
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Regretably I only learned a little chanter when younger and did not progress, so claiming to be a piper might be stretching it…🙂

However a teacher at my school keeps threatening to do staff lessons so you never know!
 
Fr Ambrose:
I have been more active than usual because of bad health. The long church services for the feast of Dormition last weekend kicked off a bout of fibrillation, and I have been more or less sleepless and chained to this chair the last few days.
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May God bless you and speed your recovery. I shall remember you at Mass tomorrow.

BTW, I am so slow. I just now caught the middle earth reference.
 
Russian Parliament dedicates the Mother of God and her Kazan Icon as Russia’s National Holiday

The Russian Duma (Parliament) today declared 4th November as a national holiday. On this day Russia celebrates the Icon of the Kazan Mother of God. Russia has always considered itself as being under the special protection of the Mother of God and countless churches and monasteries are consecrated in Her name.

Here is the link to the Russian TV piece:
1tv.ru/

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
 
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