In the history of the church there has always been many voices on either side. It’s not always pretty but it is the way the Spirit works to help us find a solution. All these men and groups will at the end honor and follow the final outcome, no divergence.Cardinal Burke’s statement, Cardinal Marx’s declaration, The Polish Bishops Conference’s declaration, and more enlightenment from Cardinal Kasper. It is only March, October is a long way off. At this moment we seem to be heading full bore toward a divergence. A break point. Pray for Unity and Orthodoxy to prevail. Holy Mary, Blessed Mother, Ora Pro Nobis.
More or less what happened when the debate on artificial birth control took place, albeit probably with less public exposure.Just in the past several weeks we have had:
Cardinal Burke’s statement, Cardinal Marx’s declaration, The Polish Bishops Conference’s declaration, and more enlightenment from Cardinal Kasper. It is only March, October is a long way off. At this moment we seem to be heading full bore toward a divergence. A break point. Pray for Unity and Orthodoxy to prevail. Holy Mary, Blessed Mother, Ora Pro Nobis.
Please, rather than throw out accusatory rhetoric, tell which of the issues I listed did not play a part in the overall collapse of morality which aided the decline in Catholics practicing their Faith. I was responding to the graph which showed a steady decline in Catholic practice, while the prots held mostly steady in their attendance levels. We all recognize that Vatican II does not, as some suggest, carry all of the responsibility of the decline. There are many factors. And where did I dismiss relational correlations ?That is not a fact. That is an opinion, or rather several opinions, lumped together for a conclusion. It is rooted in the fallacy which you dismissed of drawing a relationship from correlations. Does critical thinking also have to be lost in this day of rising modernism, televisions, global warming, vernacular, shoe size, etc.?
Yes, the gates of hell will not prevail. But I see your Humanae Vitae,More or less what happened when the debate on artificial birth control took place, albeit probably with less public exposure.
The result of that exercise confounded the expectations of many: Humanae Vitae.
Fear, IMHO, regarding the Synod or the future, betrays a lack of faith in the Promise that Jesus made to St. Peter and thus a lack of faith in Christ himself.
The Holy Spirit will prevail, not the gates of Hades.
I’m not so sure that this can be said of mainstream Protestants, at least in Canada. In the same period they also have had a steep decline in attendance, have sold off churches, etc.I was responding to the graph which showed a steady decline in Catholic practice, while the prots held mostly steady in their attendance levels.
It is my understanding that the Anglicans and Lutherans used the same ICEL translations for their services.I just did a rapid check of some stats and found this graph for Anglicans:
Really? Never knew that.It is my understanding that the Anglicans and Lutherans used the same ICEL translations for their services.
More royalty $ for the ICEL.
catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?recnum=8806Really? Never knew that.
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As ICEL says:
Any publication produced for sale which contains ICEL translations is subject to a royalty or flat fee. Publications included are books, booklets, pamphlets, cards, diskettes, CD, and other electronic media used for liturgical celebrations or popular participation. Other publications containing ICEL texts but not for use during liturgical celebrations, such as textbooks, commentaries, religious education books and materials, private prayerbooks, recordings, etc. may be assessed a royalty or flat fee.
Even if you are not selling anything, you might still have to pay ICEL. Let’s say a local magazine publisher is a member of the parish and volunteers to print up programs for a Church dedication liturgy. That practice is excluded under ICEL’s permissions for free use.
forum.musicasacra.com/forum/discussion/1447/pay-to-pray/p1(more)
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I did not accuse anyone of anything, other than using the word “fact” for an opinion. My opinion is that the problems we experience are from a deterioration in culture, not any language or Church council. I base this by expanding outside of America and Europe and outside of the Catholic Church to note the numerous other Christians that have the same issues in America and Europe, and by noting that with the same Mass, vernacular and Vatican II, the Church is thriving in Africa or Asia. Prosperity leads to independence from a dependence on God. To use the example of Jesus, it is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for America to undergo conversion. That is my opinion, my assessment, of the data, using the only control groups available.Please, rather than throw out accusatory rhetoric, tell which of the issues I listed did not play a part in the overall collapse of morality which aided the decline in Catholics practicing their Faith. I was responding to the graph which showed a steady decline in Catholic practice, while the prots held mostly steady in their attendance levels. We all recognize that Vatican II does not, as some suggest, carry all of the responsibility of the decline. There are many factors. And where did I dismiss relational correlations ?
You are an intelligent guy, I’ve read your posts. What is your “opinion”?
P.S. Global warming?!? really?
And I understand they use Gregorian chant in Africa.… the Church is thriving in Africa or Asia.
I don’t doubt some places do. I know of ones that use lots of local singing and dancing though. They are thriving. Of course they also have “persecutions besides”.And I understand they use Gregorian chant in Africa.
Out of curiosity, I looked one up. It seems sincere enough.I don’t doubt some places do. I know of ones that use lots of local singing and dancing though.