"Praise and Worship" taking place in presence of the Blessed Sacrament

[RB2]

If the Pope were to say “no liturgical dance is allowed” and then had people dancing around during his Masses, maybe that would be similar. Campus Ministry has explicitly stated not to do something, and then contradicted themselves by authorizing them to use the chapel (I’m not even sure at this point if the group was authorized by Campus Ministry).

If they are allowed to close off the chapel and sing, why can’t I close off the chapel and practice gymnastics? Maybe you just don’t appreciate various forms of worship. Why is my gymnastics any less authentic than your praise and worship?

What a rant. Equating gymnastics to praise and worship?

Well one thing is known, your not very knowledgeable about the bible or current practices within the Church-- Healing Masses,Charismatic Renewal.

The Psalms are attributed to King David, they are songs that were performed in the temple, for and before God, and before King Saul. King David sung and played his stringed lyre((a rudimentary guitar).
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyre

Lyre from various times and places are regarded by some organologists (specialists in the history of musical instruments) as a branch of the zither family, a general category that includes not only zithers, but many different stringed instruments, such as lutes, guitars, kantele, and psalteries.

There are numerous bible quotes about God wanting our praise,song and worship.

Praise and Worship is a little bit outside the box for a ? Dedicated Blessed Sacrament Chapel?, but it has been officially allowed, else you wouldnt be crying on the internet.

Talk to the Campus Ministry officials and get off your internet soapbox.

 

[clem456]

The thing that is missing here is, these people are fellow Catholics. Everything was done but actually talk to these people. All the care and concern is focused on the OP’s idea of proper observance as opposed to the others. If the OP is concerned for the spiritual welfare of these people, he should havethe charity to speak to them directly. And it sounds like they are fellow students, I could be wrong. The focus is on the observance side of this only. If there was a getting-to-know after this episode we probably wouldn’t be talking about it here.

 

[hamburglar]

Singing is a universal way or worship, gymnastics is not. The student services making a rule is not equal to the pope making a rule. What a ridiculous arguemnt.

I was merely responding to someone else making the ridiculous argument equating the Campus Ministry’s rule making ability to the Pope dispensing someone from fasting.

Why must everyone attack me? You ask for me to treat others with charity, how about the same from you guys? I’m disappointed if this is the current line of thought of “Traditional” Catholics, that there is nothing wrong with ignoring the Blessed Sacrament and that things such as healing Masses where people are “slain in the spirit” are pretend to speak in tongues are acceptable practices. I posted in this particular forum because I thought there would be people who would understand my concerns instead of the usual Modernist Catholics that fill our Church these days. I guess I was wrong.

This is why so many people feel comfort in such groups as the SSPX and sedevacantists. It’s pretty bad when those outside the Church or with irregular canonical status espouse beliefs more in line with Tradition than those inside the Communion of Rome.

 

[maltmom]

Why must everyone attack me? You ask for me to treat others with charity, how about the same from you guys? I’m disappointed if this is the current line of thought of “Traditional” Catholics, that there is nothing wrong with ignoring the Blessed Sacrament and that things such as healing Masses where people are “slain in the spirit” are pretend to speak in tongues are acceptable practices.

Yes, charity should go both ways. Comments like the one I bolded will fire people up. Please tread lightly when talking about the gifts of the Spirit. I don’t speak in tongues, but I would never say that people are pretending to do so.

I’ve been dealing with Isaac coming to visit all day so I’ve just been following this thread. I’ve been on the fence about it because I can see both sides. I was giving you a 100% benefit of doubt that maybe there were things that you saw that were disrespectful other than the singing. You lost quite a bit of it with the above post. The 1st step would be for you to find out if they had permission. If they did, then there isn’t anything wrong with them praising and worshiping God in song in front of the Tabernacle. If not, then it needs to be addressed.

 

[AB_Juney]

I was merely responding to someone else making the ridiculous argument equating the Campus Ministry’s rule making ability to the Pope dispensing someone from fasting.

Why must everyone attack me? You ask for me to treat others with charity, how about the same from you guys? I’m disappointed if this is the current line of thought of “Traditional” Catholics, that there is nothing wrong with ignoring the Blessed Sacrament and that things such as healing Masses where people are “slain in the spirit” are pretend to speak in tongues are acceptable practices. I posted in this particular forum because I thought there would be people who would understand my concerns instead of the usual Modernist Catholics that fill our Church these days. I guess I was wrong.

This is why so many people feel comfort in such groups as the SSPX and sedevacantists. It’s pretty bad when those outside the Church or with irregular canonical status espouse beliefs more in line with Tradition than those inside the Communion of Rome.

Wow, your own private religion sounds wonderful, with no room for others opinions, even if the Pope himself has approved of them (aka Charismatic, healing, tongue speaking congregations). Good to know that you’re more Catholic than the pope, cool!

 

[Alfonsus]

People, we are dealing with Devotion here.
People can have many devotional preferences and it all fine with the Church.
You can adore the Lord in the Sacrament (and we are not talking about Mass) with many forms. You can read the Liturgy of the Hour, you can sing Taize songs, you can just be there and read the Scripture. Silence is important element in the recipe, but that does not mean you can only sit silently there.

The Campus gave them permission to do praise and worship within the Chapel. Let us be charitable to the group and to the Campus authority.

 

[PatriceA]

I was merely responding to someone else making the ridiculous argument equating the Campus Ministry’s rule making ability to the Pope dispensing someone from fasting.

Why must everyone attack me? You ask for me to treat others with charity, how about the same from you guys? I’m disappointed if this is the current line of thought of “Traditional” Catholics, that there is nothing wrong with ignoring the Blessed Sacrament and that things such as healing Masses where people are “slain in the spirit” are pretend to speak in tongues are acceptable practices. I posted in this particular forum because I thought there would be people who would understand my concerns instead of the usual Modernist Catholics that fill our Church these days. I guess I was wrong.

This is why so many people feel comfort in such groups as the SSPX and sedevacantists. It’s pretty bad when those outside the Church or with irregular canonical status espouse beliefs more in line with Tradition than those inside the Communion of Rome.

Now the truth comes out. Its not the wording outside the chapel being ignored that you’re having such a problem with, its the actual activity of praise and worship and any thing that is associated with the charismatic movement.

 

[TrueLight]

I was merely responding to someone else making the ridiculous argument equating the Campus Ministry’s rule making ability to the Pope dispensing someone from fasting.

Why must everyone attack me? You ask for me to treat others with charity, how about the same from you guys? I’m disappointed if this is the current line of thought of “Traditional” Catholics, that there is nothing wrong with ignoring the Blessed Sacrament and that things such as healing Masses where people are “slain in the spirit” are pretend to speak in tongues are acceptable practices. I posted in this particular forum because I thought there would be people who would understand my concerns instead of the usual Modernist Catholics that fill our Church these days. I guess I was wrong.

It’s not the current line of thought of traditional Catholics who attend traditional parishes or who primarily attend the EF at diocesan parishes.

This forum is not usually the place to air such grievances. Whenever there has been a thread on the charismatic movement, it has usually been heated, which is why that topic is banned on the L&S forum, last time I looked. So there are a lot of charismatics on here.

I would do what another forum member says and just avoid adoration when there is “praise and worship” and go when there is silent adoration.

It is really all you can do.

 

[PatriceA]

It’s not the current line of thought of traditional Catholics who attend traditional parishes or who primarily attend the EF at diocesan parishes.

This forum is not usually the place to air such grievances. Whenever there has been a thread on the charismatic movement, it has usually been heated, which is why that topic is banned on the L&S forum, last time I looked. So there are a lot of charismatics on here.

I would do what another forum member says and just avoid adoration when there is “praise and worship” and go when there is silent adoration.

It is really all you can do.

Just to add to your comment, there are members of CAF that consider themselves both traditionalists and charismatic. Its not always an either/or line of thought.

 

[TrueLight]

Just to add to your comment, there are members of CAF that consider themselves both traditionalists and charismatic. Its not always an either/or line of thought.

Well, I guess there would have to be an agreement on the meaning of the word “traditionalist”. We’ve reshashed this over and over.

But I would think that those who are attracted to a praise and worship type of service would not be too happy/ comfortable with a more rigid structure.

 

[Phillip_Rolfes]

But I would think that those who are attracted to a praise and worship type of service would not be too happy/ comfortable with a more rigid structure.

The exact opposite has been my experience. I’ve known quite a few people who grew up in Charismatic parishes and attended Charismatic colleges that now attend - either occasionally or “full-time” - parishes that exclusively utilize the Extraordinary Form of the Mass. My own wife grew up in a Charismatic (Roman) parish and is now quite taken with the liturgical life of the Byzantine/Melkite East (as am I). While we both love the rich liturgical tradition of the Melkites, we do still appreciate good P&W meetings and believe that they do serve a valuable (non-liturgical) function in the Church. My other “traditional” friends all feel the same way.

 

[graceandglory]

I go to a Catholic university and in all the Residence Halls, they have chapels with the Presence of Christ in the Tabernacle.

I pray all 8 hours of the Little Office of the Blessed Virgin Mary, in conformity with the 1961 Editio Typica of the Roman Breviary that was permitted by Summorum Pontificum and I like to do this in the chapel.

I was told that the chapels were a place for that Hall’s residents to silently pray in the Presence of the Eucharist. In fact, there are signs outside the chapel that instructs students to be quiet in and around the Chapel.

It was 9:00 pm and I went down to pray Compline, as that is the time instructed by St. Benedict. I was shocked to see all the chairs and kneelers removed and people sitting on the ground, ignoring the presence of Christ. Then the guitar music starts and people begin singing loudly. Everything was focused on the music and guitar player and the Blessed Sacrament seemed to get lost.

I talked to the person in charge of the dorm and explained to him that the chapel was designated for students to pray. I felt they were disrespecting Christ. I was told that there are “many different liturgical traditions” and we should respect them all. I’m sorry, but since when has guitar music and hand waving been a part of the Catholic Liturgical tradition? I want to pray in a liturgical way that dates back to the eight century.

Is it wrong for them to do this “Praise and Worship” in the presence of Christ in the Eucharist? I hope to talk to the priest in charge of campus ministry soon.

The Parable of the Pharisee and the Tax Collector

9 To some who were confident of their own righteousness and looked down on everyone else, Jesus told this parable: 10 “Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee stood by himself and prayed: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other people—robbers, evildoers, adulterers—or even like this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.’

13 “But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, ‘God, have mercy on me, a sinner.’

14 “I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God. For all those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted.”

 

[TrueLight]

The exact opposite has been my experience. I’ve known quite a few people who grew up in Charismatic parishes and attended Charismatic colleges that now attend - either occasionally or “full-time” - parishes that exclusively utilize the Extraordinary Form of the Mass. My own wife grew up in a Charismatic (Roman) parish and is now quite taken with the liturgical life of the Byzantine/Melkite East (as am I). While we both love the rich liturgical tradition of the Melkites, we do still appreciate good P&W meetings and believe that they do serve a valuable (non-liturgical) function in the Church. My other “traditional” friends all feel the same way.

I know some who used to attend charismatic parishes who have moved to the EF. I don’t think they still attend charismatic services.

 

[Cran]

I think, OP, your spirit would be more tranquil if you tried to read the sign at the chapel door not in the sense of “Singing etc. is NEVER-EVER permitted here!!!”

We have a similar sign posted at our local parish, because many tourists visit the church, and not all of them know how to behave respectfully in church, and the sign is a reminder.
This does not mean that we are not allowed to sing in our church - but we should refrain from it if it is not the proper moment and would disturb others. So we do not sing individually when we enter, but of course we sing during worship! But if campus ministries gave permission for this meeting, the time to sing IS proper.

If they actually brought food and drinks, that would be an issue to complain of in a meek and respectful fashion.

I am sorry you lost your time of silent adoration and prayer before the sacrament, next time, you could go earlier or later.

 

[Rich_C]

I was merely responding to someone else making the ridiculous argument equating the Campus Ministry’s rule making ability to the Pope dispensing someone from fasting.

Why must everyone attack me? You ask for me to treat others with charity, how about the same from you guys? I’m disappointed if this is the current line of thought of “Traditional” Catholics, that there is nothing wrong with ignoring the Blessed Sacrament and that things such as healing Masses where people are “slain in the spirit” are pretend to speak in tongues are acceptable practices. I posted in this particular forum because I thought there would be people who would understand my concerns instead of the usual Modernist Catholics that fill our Church these days. I guess I was wrong.

This is why so many people feel comfort in such groups as the SSPX and sedevacantists. It’s pretty bad when those outside the Church or with irregular canonical status espouse beliefs more in line with Tradition than those inside the Communion of Rome.

Hamburglar, I couldn’t empathize more, but when others say that the Church allows these things, they’re right. We can feel these things aren’t quite right all we want but what can we say? Any complaint comes off as a personal attack, and I know that’s not how you wanted to be perceived. We have to find peace where we can and ignore the rest.

There are few traditionalists on these boards. I see this as outreach territory. If you want to commune with like-minded folks, why not check out Fish Eaters Forum?

 

[PatriceA]

Well, I guess there would have to be an agreement on the meaning of the word “traditionalist”. We’ve reshashed this over and over.

But I would think that those who are attracted to a praise and worship type of service would not be too happy/ comfortable with a more rigid structure.

Or there are those that like both styles from time to time. I know quite a few fellow Catholics that attend the latin mass and also attend healing masses and fesitvals of praise when they’re held in our diocese. Like I said, its not always an either/or decision.

 

[denitaA]

I was merely responding to someone else making the ridiculous argument equating the Campus Ministry’s rule making ability to the Pope dispensing someone from fasting.

Why must everyone attack me? You ask for me to treat others with charity, how about the same from you guys? I’m disappointed if this is the current line of thought of “Traditional” Catholics, that there is nothing wrong with ignoring the Blessed Sacrament and that things such as healing Masses where people are “slain in the spirit” are pretend to speak in tongues are acceptable practices. I posted in this particular forum because I thought there would be people who would understand my concerns instead of the usual Modernist Catholics that fill our Church these days. I guess I was wrong.

This is why so many people feel comfort in such groups as the SSPX and sedevacantists. It’s pretty bad when those outside the Church or with irregular canonical status espouse beliefs more in line with Tradition than those inside the Communion of Rome.

We’ll I’m with you all the way, my friend. Like I’ve often said, I did notjoin the Catholic Church to be Protestant. I got enough of that Charismatic stuff growing up with my mom’s UPC family.
That said, have you ever been to an FSSP Mass? The Fraternity of St. Peter is a lot like the SSPX, but they’re in communion with Rome. Please feel free to message me, I’d like to be your friend.:hug3::console:

 

[denitaA]

Hamburglar, I couldn’t empathize more, but when others say that the Church allows these things, they’re right. We can feel these things aren’t quite right all we want but what can we say? Any complaint comes off as a personal attack, and I know that’s not how you wanted to be perceived. We have to find peace where we can and ignore the rest.

There are few traditionalists on these boards. I see this as outreach territory. If you want to commune with like-minded folks, why not check out Fish Eaters Forum?

For your information, Fish-Eaters are now ***charging money ***for posting there. Some of us can’t afford to make a donation every time we post, OK?:dts:

 

[Rich_C]

Or there are those that like both styles from time to time. I know quite a few fellow Catholics that attend the latin mass and also attend healing masses and fesitvals of praise when they’re held in our diocese. Like I said, its not always an either/or decision.

I wouldn’t call someone who likes the traditional Mass once in a while a “traditionalist,” but I’m sure there are many Catholics like the ones you describe. I’d be interested to meet one.

 

[Rich_C]

For your information, Fish-Eaters are now ***charging money ***for posting there. Some of us can’t afford to make a donation every time we post, OK?:dts:

Actually, you’re mistaken. Non-subscribing members simply don’t have access to certain forum functions, but posting isn’t one of those. Anyone with a free registration can post.