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Sarah_Jane
Guest
Because they are with God in heaven.
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YAQUBOS
Guest
Peace be with you!
Sarah Jane:
This doesn’t tell me about how I can get in communication with them.
If they are with God in Heaven, so I can talk to them and they will hear??? Where did you find this principle?
Can you please explain more about how you can talk to dead saints?
In Love,
Yaqubos†
Sarah Jane:
Ok. So?
This doesn’t tell me about how I can get in communication with them.
If they are with God in Heaven, so I can talk to them and they will hear??? Where did you find this principle?
Can you please explain more about how you can talk to dead saints?
In Love,
Yaqubos†
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steve_b
Guest
Do you remember from the Gospels during Jesus transfiguration, that Peter James and John were with Him on top of the mountain? Who were the great OT saints they [Jesus , Peter, John and James] talked to? In fact Peter was going to make tents for them. Remember the passage? [Mt 17:3]
I havent’s read all the posts on this thread. Did anyone give you the following to read? catholic.com/library/praying_to_the_saints.asp
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RBushlow
Guest
rod of iron:
Pax vobiscum.
ROI, you don’t know who the good thief was?
Pax vobiscum.
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RBushlow
Guest
The same way the rich man spoke to Abraham and Lazarus. He also asked that Abraham warn his living brothers.
Dominus vobiscum.
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RBushlow
Guest
rod of iron:
You’re not familiar with the Church Fathers?
Yours in Christ.
Rod,
You’re not familiar with the Church Fathers?
Yours in Christ.
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RBushlow
Guest
rod of iron:
You don’t believe in the Holy Trinity?
May God bless you, Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
Rod,
You don’t believe in the Holy Trinity?
May God bless you, Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
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YAQUBOS
Guest
Peace be with you!
steve b:
“And behold, Moses and Elijah appeared to them, talking with Him.
Peter said to Jesus, “Lord, it is good for us to be here; if You wish, I will make three tabernacles here, one for You, and one for Moses, and one for Elijah.”” ( Matthew 17:3-4 )
Moses and Elijah were talking to Jesus.
Peter told Jesus that he will make tabernacles.
Where did you read that apostles talked to the prophets?
In Love,
Yaqubos†
steve b:
My friend, you are not reading the Bible, but what is in your mind. For the apostles didn’t talk to the OT prophets. Read carefully:
“And behold, Moses and Elijah appeared to them, talking with Him.
Peter said to Jesus, “Lord, it is good for us to be here; if You wish, I will make three tabernacles here, one for You, and one for Moses, and one for Elijah.”” ( Matthew 17:3-4 )
Moses and Elijah were talking to Jesus.
Peter told Jesus that he will make tabernacles.
Where did you read that apostles talked to the prophets?
In Love,
Yaqubos†
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YAQUBOS
Guest
Peace be with you!
RBushlow:
Abraham didn’t agree to send Lazarus.
I am asking how the LIVING can talk to DEAD saints.
In Love,
Yaqubos†
The rich was DEAD when he talked to Abraham and Lazarus.
Abraham didn’t agree to send Lazarus.
I am asking how the LIVING can talk to DEAD saints.
In Love,
Yaqubos†
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Sarah_Jane
Guest
First, the saints are not dead. We can “talk” to ALIVE saints by the authority of Christ. The saints are “great cloud of witnesses [martus]” (Hb 12:1). Like we see here, the witnesses are aware of what’s happening :
"If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every word may be confirmed by the evidence of two or three **witnesses **[martus]” (Mt 18:16)
The saints in heaven are aware of what’s happening on earth by the authority of God.
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steve_b
Guest
- The apostles obviously saw the OT saints.You need to ask yourself, why did Peter ask to build 3 tabernacles, one for Jesus one for Elijah, and one for Moses?
- What is the purpose of a tabernacle?
- Did you read the URL in the same post?
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Exporter
Guest
Saints who gone before us cannot hear our prayers because there ears are in the grave.
Spokenword, you gave the entire Caatholic Church a* SLAP IN THE FACE by posting what you did. You said** dead men’s ears are in the grave so they ( the saints) cannot hear any prayers!***
No, let me correct that. You made an attempt to slap Catholics in the face, but we Catholics know you are dead wrong!
Do you pray to God? He is a Spirit. Are his ears in the grave? Can God hear us? People (Saints) who have died a physical death, died a physical death! But any Christian knows that the spirit of a dead man is alive as a spirit. You might call them souls.
I should assume that you just made a slip-up, and not a bold statement. Give me proof that Saint John cannot hear iour prayers. Since it was your contention, the proof is up to you.
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Exporter
Guest
YAQUBOS,
You challamged a poster to give proof that dead saints can hear our prayers. Do you know of any LIVING saints? Please tell us.
If you are Christian ( I know you are not Catholic) you may believe that God hears your prayers - right? God is a spirit. He can hear prayers.
A dead person including saints died a physical death. But their spirit ( soul) is alive, just like Jesus’ spirit is alive. Ever hear of life after death? So , as you call it - a dead man- is really alive as a spirit. He is in Hell, Purgatory or Heaven. You prove to me that a living soul in heaven cannot hear a prayer directed to them.
You challamged a poster to give proof that dead saints can hear our prayers. Do you know of any LIVING saints? Please tell us.
If you are Christian ( I know you are not Catholic) you may believe that God hears your prayers - right? God is a spirit. He can hear prayers.
A dead person including saints died a physical death. But their spirit ( soul) is alive, just like Jesus’ spirit is alive. Ever hear of life after death? So , as you call it - a dead man- is really alive as a spirit. He is in Hell, Purgatory or Heaven. You prove to me that a living soul in heaven cannot hear a prayer directed to them.
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YAQUBOS
Guest
Peace be with you!
Sarah Jane:
They witnessed by their life. Thus, they are a cloud of witnesses for the victories of faith. Read carefully Hebrews 11, and then pass to Hebrews 12:1.
In Love,
Yaqubos†
Sarah Jane:
Those saints are not dead for God, but they are dead for us.
They witnessed by their life. Thus, they are a cloud of witnesses for the victories of faith. Read carefully Hebrews 11, and then pass to Hebrews 12:1.
In Love,
Yaqubos†
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YAQUBOS
Guest
Peace be with you!
Yaqubos†
steve b said:
- Do you see the saints when you pray to them?
What happened with the apostles that day was an exceptional thing. - Who said that Peter was right in talking about tabernacles?
“And as these were leaving Him, Peter said to Jesus, “Master, it is good for us to be here; let us make three tabernacles: one for You, and one for Moses, and one for Elijah”–not realizing what he was saying.” ( Luke 9:33 ) - I took a look on it. I prefer to discuss it with you.
Yaqubos†
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YAQUBOS
Guest
Peace!
God is everywhere, while dead saints are not. Being everywhere is an Attribute of God.
In Love,
Yaqubos†
Exporter said:
God is everywhere, while dead saints are not. Being everywhere is an Attribute of God.
In Love,
Yaqubos†
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Sarah_Jane
Guest
The saints are not dead for me too! I don’t see God, but I’m sure that He’s alive. I don’t see the saints, but I’m sure that they’re alive.
In Matthew 18:16, the witnesses (martus) are aware of what’s happening. We have the same word “martus” in Hebrews 12:1. The witnesses are aware of what’s happening on earth.
The saints in heaven are not subject to the time-space limitations of this life.
This does not imply that the saints in heaven therefore must be omniscient, as God is, for it is only through God’s willing it that they can “communicate” with us.
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NewChristian27
Guest
Don’t you mean “pardon me for thinking the Lord’s authority is better than yours”???
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YAQUBOS
Guest
Peace be with you!
Sarah Jane:
What is death, Sarah? Does death separate you in flesh from those who die?
Sarah Jane:
You cannot just say that the same word “witness” is used in both passages. Let me just give you this example:
“This heap is a witness, and the pillar is a witness, that I will not pass by this heap to you for harm, and you will not pass by this heap and this pillar to me, for harm.” ( Genesis 31:52 )
Question: do you think that the heap and the pillar were aware about what was happening there?
Sarah Jane:
In Love,
Yaqubos†
Sarah Jane:
Me, too, I am sure that they are alive, but not for me. Do you see any dead saint these days walking in your streets?..
What is death, Sarah? Does death separate you in flesh from those who die?
Sarah Jane:
You need to learn how we study the context. You have to read carefully Hebrews 11 to see about which kind of witnessing the Scripture is talking in Hebrews 12.
You cannot just say that the same word “witness” is used in both passages. Let me just give you this example:
“This heap is a witness, and the pillar is a witness, that I will not pass by this heap to you for harm, and you will not pass by this heap and this pillar to me, for harm.” ( Genesis 31:52 )
Question: do you think that the heap and the pillar were aware about what was happening there?
Sarah Jane:
You need to learn the basic beliefs of Christians. Because we believe that all creatures, even spiritual, are limited, and only God is everywhere in the same time.
In Love,
Yaqubos†
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Sarah_Jane
Guest
Do you see Jesus walking in your streets?
, and the pillar is a witness, that I will not pass by this heap to you for harm, and you will not pass by this heap and this pillar to me, for harm." ( Genesis 31:52 )
Question: do you think that the heap and the pillar were aware about what was happening there?
The Old Testament is written in hebrew. The New Testament is written in greek. Find me an example in the New Testament.
Only God is omniscient. But we know that the saints in heaven and the angels are not subject to the time-space limitations of this life because they are in heaven. The saints in heaven and the angels are aware of what is happening on earth by the will of God.
“When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the witness they had borne; they cried out with a loud voice, ‘O Sovereign Lord, holy and true, how long before thou wilt judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell upon the earth?’ Then they were each given a white robe and told to rest a little longer, until the number of their fellow servants and their brethren should be complete, who were to be killed as they themselves had been.” (Rev 6:9-11)
How would they be able to say these things if they didn’t know what was happening on earth?
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