Pregnant Student Banned from Graduation, Walks

[gelsbern]

I glanced through the replies to this and it’s amazing how many people in a backwards way condone this pregnant woman.

We need to go back to ostracizing those who are involved in fornication, if we just simply include them, we encourage their behaviour.

…

I can’t even think straigh on this… Good for the school, bad for the student, and the parents need to be horse whipped for not teaching their daughter morals.

 

[TPJCatholic]

Catholic,

What would you sat the purpose of the Church is? What would say the purpose of any Catholic school is?

 

[Trelow]

fix:

As a Catholic I am ashamed of these posts that support rejection of just authority and enabling of adolescent rebellion and selfishness.

Asinine ain’t it? And we wonder why our culture is in the state it is today.

 

[Scottyp]

TPJCatholic:

Catholic,

What would you sat the purpose of the Church is? What would say the purpose of any Catholic school is?

Ooh, ooh!! Can I answer?
The Church’s purpose is to reconcile the world to Christ!
Catholic school’s purpose is to reflect this in educating!

Or wait, is it to “ostricize those involved in fornication” as one of the other posters said?

 

[Brad]

fix:

Exactly. Feelings trump the truth. False notions of inequality trump legitimate authority. It is all about me.

What is the message people are getting from this story? They are thinking that the “poor” girl was discriminated against, that the boy got off without penalty and that the greater issue is the female student’s desire to walk across the stage.

It seems many think fornication is to be minimized, legitimate authority is to be obeyed if it is consistent with one’s feelings and scandal is not even on the radar screen.

If the father can be authenticated, then he too should be banned, but that is another matter. If the female student thought being banned was unwarranted, she should have approached it in a legitimate way. Catholic schools need to be Catholic, not PC.

It is a rare event but I disagree here. Catholic schools are in the business of providing Catholic education, not hiding the sins of it’s students as though they do not exist. The issue here is not the obstinancy of the girl (although there may very well be some) but that the school caused it’s own trouble by banning her. A simpler solution would have been to not draw any attention to the situation.

If Catholic schools would actually teach the faith, as in:

• sex outside of marriage is wrong
• chastity and purity are to be honored
• sin causes spiritual damage and Hell is eternal and real
• repentence is necessary, frequent confession is necessary

then they would be less likely to be pinned into these types of conundrums.

Plus, they give the wrong message by banning someone who opted not to have an abortion.

This case, in my mind, is identical to the case in California where the 2 adopted children of homosexual “parents” are going to a Catholic school.

We cannot pretened that our churches and our schools are filled with devout believers. They are not. The only way to change the culture is to teach the faith without reservation to any and all that step inside the doors.

The reason we have these problems is because we do not teach the faith without reservation.

Further example: We wouldn’t have needed the debate over whether pro-choice politicians should receive communion as much IF Bishops seized opportunities to teach about sin, Hell, dangers of supporting abortion, contraception etc. WITHOUT reservation frequently, but especially when such a politician is in the church.

For example, to the politician: “Mr. Kerry, it will be a grave sin for you to receive the Eucharist today as long as you are obstinant in your support of “choice.” Your soul will be in jeopardy if you do so without prior sacramental confession.”

The scandal is in that people are not being taught what is right or wrong, not that there are wrong-doers among us.

 

[fix]

TPJCatholic:

Catholic,What would you sat the purpose of the Church is?

The salvation of souls, despite popular propaganda.

 

[Brad]

Fix,

I didn’t mean to disagree with you on the point that what the girl ended up doing was wrong. That was certainly the wrong thing to do.

 

[felra]

Catholic2003:

So the message is that an unmarried pregnant woman isn’t truly forgiven in the Sacrament of Reconciliation until she isn’t showing anymore?

Was Jesus causing scandal when He said, “Let he among you who is without sin cast the first stone”? He told the woman caught in adultery to go and sin no more. This young woman is doing that, by carrying her baby to term instead of aborting it. I sincerely doubt that any of her peers are envying her situation and the “life of luxury” she will be living for the next 18 years.

**“A pregnant student who was banned from graduation at her Roman Catholic high school announced her own name and walked across the stage anyway at the close of the program.” **

“I can’t believe something like this is happening in 2005,” said her mother, Sheila Cosby. “My daughter has been through a lot and I am proud of her. She deserved to walk, and she did.”

The actions and comments by this student and her mother evidence a lack of humility—a replacing of pride with shame as previous posters have observed. I do not recall the woman caught in adultery grabbing the limelight shortly after her forgiveness—I am sure that she was about the business of re-tooling her person and life in greater conformity with Christ.

It is apparent that the mother and student in this story lack the correct disposition to make a public show of consideration to the Catholic student body and institution. This is what legitimate authority is for—to guide, direct and enforce the appropriate response for the good of all based on the mission and ministry of Christ. What is shameful are those who coddle and minimize the corporal effect of sinful actions. Yes, the father should have likewise been banned from the commencement ceremony.

 

[TPJCatholic]

Brad,

Teaching the faith without reservation means a Catholic school does not allow a pregnant student (who clearly commited fornication), nor the father, to publicly celebrate. The entire student body must know that there are consequences for their actions. That girl and the father can simply place the baby up for adoption, and then other then the carrying of the baby they will have not learned anything from this situation and the rest of the student body will simply learn that it is acceptable to fornicate and that it is acceptable to defy the direct orders of their school administrators.

There is only one way to get these points across and you used the proper phrase: “Teaching the faith without reservation, including banning individuals from public activities.” This should be done for the sake of all of the young souls involved.

 

[Scottyp]

Good gravy… Do you really think that the “consequences of her actions” are not walking at graduation.

I don’t think a high schooler who has gotten pregnant needs any more “consequences” than she already has.

 

[fix]

Brad:

It is a rare event but I disagree here. Catholic schools are in the business of providing Catholic education, not hiding the sins of it’s students as though they do not exist. The issue here is not the obstinancy of the girl (although there may very well be some) but that the school caused it’s own trouble by banning her. A simpler solution would have been to not draw any attention to the situation.

If Catholic schools would actually teach the faith, as in:

• sex outside of marriage is wrong
• chastity and purity are to be honored
• sin causes spiritual damage and Hell is eternal and real
• repentence is necessary, frequent confession is necessary

then they would be less likely to be pinned into these types of conundrums.

Plus, they give the wrong message by banning someone who opted not to have an abortion.

This case, in my mind, is identical to the case in California where the 2 adopted children of homosexual “parents” are going to a Catholic school.

We cannot pretened that our churches and our schools are filled with devout believers. They are not. The only way to change the culture is to teach the faith without reservation to any and all that step inside the doors.

The reason we have these problems is because we do not teach the faith without reservation.

Further example: We wouldn’t have needed the debate over whether pro-choice politicians should receive communion as much IF Bishops seized opportunities to teach about sin, Hell, dangers of supporting abortion, contraception etc. WITHOUT reservation frequently, but especially when such a politician is in the church.

For example, to the politician: “Mr. Kerry, it will be a grave sin for you to receive the Eucharist today as long as you are obstinant in your support of “choice.” Your soul will be in jeopardy if you do so without prior sacramental confession.”

The scandal is in that people are not being taught what is right or wrong, not that there are wrong-doers among us.

If you are saying the school should do more to teach the faith in a clear manner, that is probably accurate, but I know nothing about the school.

I disagree with you about the pregnant student. The school has a policy, it seems, and they should apply it uniformly. If the girl received her diploma and was told the ceremony was off limits, her behavior was wrong. That is not only in terms of secular propriety, but wrong in terms of the moral law. By whose authority may she disobey a just rule? Why did her mother encouarge this behavior? What is the message to other students? Legitimate authorities may be disobeyed, at will, if you do not like their decision?

The abortion issue seems to me a red herring. Have we come to the point when one who chooses not to murder is to be commended? The bar is not only lowered, but discarded.

 

[TPJCatholic]

It seems to be lost to many that the root of this problem was the fornication that took place between the girl and the boy. Had that not happened (obviously) then there would be no problem, no pregnancy. That is exactly why the school needed to bring their sin to a proper consequence. The girl, the boy and the student body at large needs to know that forincation is a mortal sin and that it is not acceptable behaivor…it is a sin that is obviously forgiveable and I am sure we all hope and pray the two young parents sought reconciliation…yet there is a basic teaching that must be defended. That basic teaching is fornciation is a mortal sin, it is not cute, it is not acceptable, it is not okay just because thousands of kids and adults do it everyday, it is just plain a mortal sin.

People here applaud the girl because she did not have an abortion. Yet, this issue has nothing to with abortion, the girl and the boy are not heroes because they did not abort the bay (abortion is murder and should never be an option), and the girl is not a hero because she defiantly walked; rather they both comitted grave sin and should have sought reconciliation with God and the school, yet the girl’s actions do not reflect a Catholic spirit and the student boyd watched her state of fornication, followed by her defiance to school authority, young people live by example and the pregnant girl and the boy just gave them a whopper of an example to follow.

 

[fix]

TPJCatholic:

It seems to be lost to many that the root of this problem was the fornication that took place between the girl and the boy. Had that not happened (obviously) then there would be no problem, no pregnancy. That is exactly why the school needed to bring their sin to a proper consequence. The girl, the boy and the student body at large needs to know that forincation is a mortal sin and that it is not acceptable behaivor…it is a sin that is obviously forgiveable and I am sure we all hope and pray the two young parents sought reconciliation…yet there is a basic teaching that must be defended. That basic teaching is fornciation is a mortal sin, it is not cute, it is not acceptable, it is not okay just because thousands of kids and adults do it everyday, it is just plain a mortal sin.

People here applaud the girl because she did not have an abortion. Yet, this issue has nothing to with abortion, the girl and the boy are not heroes because they did not abort the bay (abortion is murder and should never be an option), and the girl is not a hero because she defiantly walked; rather they both comitted grave sin and should have sought reconciliation with God and the school, yet the girl’s actions do not reflect a Catholic spirit and the student boyd watched her state of fornication, followed by her defiance to school authority, young people live by example and the pregnant girl and the boy just gave them a whopper of an example to follow.

You and Felra have expressed the situation perfectly. I still contend that most who oppose these views are operating from emotion more than charity and justice.

 

[felra]

Scottyp:

Good gravy… Do you really think that the “consequences of her actions” are not walking at graduation.

I don’t think a high schooler who has gotten pregnant needs any more “consequences” than she already has.

Not anymore consequences, but a greater consideration for how her actions impact others implicitly, explicitly. Time for her start putting her adolescent personal preferences aside and to listen, obey and consider the needs of others. She is enrolled in a Catholic insititution.

 

[Scottyp]

If she is far enough along in her pregnancy to be showing under a graduation gown, it is not time for everyone to focus on the sin, but to focus on the new life growing inside of her. The sin is done. There is a person to be cared for now!

I certainly would hate to have been the baby known to all the world as the cause of my mom being a media spectacle and point of a “fornication” discussion on message boards.

Where is the Church’s tradition of caring for unwed mothers and their babies?

 

[fix]

Scottyp:

If she is far enough along in her pregnancy to be showing under a graduation gown, it is not time for everyone to focus on the sin, but to focus on the new life growing inside of her. The sin is done. There is a person to be cared for now!

I certainly would hate to have been the baby known to all the world as the cause of my mom being a media spectacle and point of a “fornication” discussion on message boards.

Where is the Church’s tradition of caring for unwed mothers and their babies?

The student brought the attention to herself.

 

[TPJCatholic]

fix,

I agree, and I think many people here are so happy that the girl did not abort, that they are willing to forget that little thing called fornication. The school does not have that luxury because they still have students to teach, and to give proper Catholic formation to.

It is a sad reflection of the state of our culture that so many people will applaud a young CATHOLIC woman simply because she did not murder/abort her child. This is not some unformed person who never was exposed to the faith, we are talking about a female who was in a Catholic school and most certainly knows where the faith stands regarding abortion and fornication. Yet, due to the extreme acceptance of abortion in our culture, we generally look the other way when it comes to things like fornication…ironically if people returned to accepting that fornication is wrong, then abortion would rarely ever be needed because pregnancies through fornication would drop.

The root of this problem was the fornication and I absolutely applaud the school for making that clear…I just wish they would have applied it to the boy (though for all we know they might have done that and the boy might have been just as defiant as the girl).

 

[Scottyp]

The school made the baby a public subject of shame for the whole school to see.

 

[fix]

TPJCatholic:

The root of this problem was the fornication and I absolutely applaud the school for making that clear…I just wish they would have applied it to the boy (though for all we know they might have done that and the boy might have been just as defiant as the girl).

Right on. Fornication is minimized in the minds of most folks. In this age we forget it is a grave sin that kills the soul.

 

[TPJCatholic]

scottyp,

It is not a sign of love or charity to not properly inform a person when they have commited mortal sin. Nor is it a sign of love or charity to allow a student body to receive the false and dangerous impression that mortal sin is okay, that it is even worth honoring. As for the child, we do not know if the girl plans to keep the baby, and if she does that baby will likely never know about these talks. Yet, when the baby is older and learns of these talks, then perhaps that will be a good tool for teaching that person that mortal sin is not acceptable.

You know, either we believe that mortal sin separates us from God, or we do not. If we do believe that, then we must do everything we can to teach that–that school did the right thing, the girl is NOT the only person involved, many other students witnessed her actions.