Priest says no Kneeling, prefer no receiving Communion on tongue

[Regina7]

Yeah. I don’t doubt that certainly that could be in the heart of a man to do BUT I would think that would be so rare. I mean for someone to actually think, premeditate, and put into action the spectacle of kneeling for the motive of pride and selfishness would be downright evil. "“nah that whole reverence thing is overrated and kneeling before God is not why I do it… I just want people to see me and think well of me” However, I would think that the more common nonchalant way some receive in the hand could be more plausible as a reception that should be corrected. shrug:

I’d love to kneel but am afraid I’d knock down the priest and alter boy in the process

I do wear a chapel veil, which is another outward sign of reverence. However much I like the physical reminder, I’ve also been mocked and ridiculed for wearing one. My friends who kneel have also been jeered at for doing so…so I really don’t see that holier-than-thou attitude, at least in my parish.

 

[LongingSoul]

How can you be so sure of that?

I would think that there are many people who would like to kneel to receive Our Lord, but are reluctant to do so exactly because people will look at them and think, “Look at him, acting all holier than thou”. Personally I would much prefer to receive Communion kneeling, but don’t because I feel others will think I am trying to make some point about piety. The atmosphere in most parish churches is really not conducive at all towards receiving kneeling. But perhaps this is just an excuse for cowardice on my part.

But I mean we can all agree that the phenomenon is common. People put on facades of superior holiness, integrity, wealth, station without recognising this as lying. They turn others off by their continual comparisons to other lesser mortals and judgementalness. They actually do more harm than good in that sense.

 

[Lormar]

But I mean we can all agree that the phenomenon is common. People put on facades of superior holiness, integrity, wealth, station without recognising this as lying. They turn others off by their continual comparisons to other lesser mortals and judgementalness. They actually do more harm than good in that sense.

And how do you know that the person who receives in the hand isn’t the same?

I really am tired of this. It doesn’t bother me who receives in what manner. But it seems to get under more than a few skins that some of us prefer not to receive via the hand.

Let’s just worry about our own sinfulness and pride and “judgementalness” and leave the others to Our Lord.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

I’d love to kneel but am afraid I’d knock down the priest and alter boy in the process

I do wear a chapel veil, which is another outward sign of reverence. However much I like the physical reminder, I’ve also been mocked and ridiculed for wearing one. My friends who kneel have also been jeered at for doing so…so I really don’t see that holier-than-thou attitude, at least in my parish.

Yes, I have noticed a certain level of hypocrisy in many who look down upon those who choose to show outward signs of reverence. It is as if the only high horse it is acceptable to be on is the one accusing others of being on a high horse…

Ironic.

 

[Brendan_64]

Yes, I have noticed a certain level of hypocrisy in many who look down upon those who choose to show outward signs of reverence. It is as if the only high horse it is acceptable to be on is the one accusing others of being on a high horse…

Ironic.

Indeed. People can wander up as casual as they like, but someone wearing a mantilla, or kneeling to receive, or preferring to receive from a priest or deacon than an EMHC, and they’re viewed as dinosaurs, or doing it to put on a show.

 

[LongingSoul]

One of the reasons I read and post rather infrequently to these forae is that I don’t like how priests are treated. The sentiment I often read is, “Father’s wrong! You should write to the bishop! And if that fails, write to Rome!” Leaving aside the fact that no bishop that I know of has time to deal with every perceived liturgical abuse out there, we never hear the other side of the story. People are slow to listen and quick to judge when it comes to anything remotely resembling liturgical abuse. The reality is that most, and dare I say all, priests truly love the Lord and their people. They are trying to do the best they can with limited resources. We’re not perfect. We fail at our jobs, too. We don’t need criticisms; we need prayers.

This is the aspect of this new type of Catholic that has shocked me as well, Father. I only saw how ferocious it is since coming onto Catholic forums. There is a great policy on this site of not criticising the clergy (which is policed fairly well) but I know that still on some issues there are some who even imply the Pope is just an opinionated old nobody!

My uncle and a cousin are both Priests so I’ve grown up in and around the Church life. We used to swim in the seminary pool when I was kids! It makes me curious about these new type Catholics who don’t seem to respect the office of the clergy. Sure they are ‘servants’ of the Lord, but when you come to the Lords house, the servants should be respected as doing the Lords bidding.

 

[buc_fan33]

As a lay person, access to a spiritual director in our diocese is limited. The contacts for spiritual direction seem to be (I fear) of a ‘progressive’ persuasion, and I would also prefer a priest rather than a lay person as a spiritual director. How does a person go about getting a spiritual director other than through the set diocesan contacts?

Edit…sorry, I thought I was responding to HoosierDaddy. My bad. Yes, your first step would be to contact either your local parish or chancery office to see if they could recommend someone. And, don’t be too afraid of the “progressive” label. Even though you may not see eye-to-eye with someone of that bent, the person still may be a top-notch spiritual director. Sometimes God surprises us with the people he sends us.

Also, ask God for one. He promised to answer our prayers. One of my favorite movies is The Mask of Zorro and there is a great line from Don Diego Delevega in that movie, quoting someone else; I’m not sure who. “When the student is ready, the master will appear.” I’ve certainly found this to be the case in my own life. Best of luck to you!

 

[LongingSoul]

And how do you know that the person who receives in the hand isn’t the same?

I really am tired of this. It doesn’t bother me who receives in what manner. But it seems to get under more than a few skins that some of us prefer not to receive via the hand.

Let’s just worry about our own sinfulness and pride and “judgementalness” and leave the others to Our Lord.

That’s the whole point. Worry about our own sinfulness and pride. If a Priest has asked for certain communion protocols for some reason… its not a sin to receive in the hand for the circumstances of this one time or this one parish. Why would someone say they would never receive in the hand unless they didn’t think it was below them or they knew greater holiness than the hand receivers? It’s not a liturgical abuse to receive in the hand so it seems unreasonable to say that one would never receive ever in the hand for any reason.

 

[Brendan_64]

Edit…sorry, I thought I was responding to HoosierDaddy. My bad. Yes, your first step would be to contact either your local parish or chancery office to see if they could recommend someone. And, don’t be too afraid of the “progressive” label. Even though you may not see eye-to-eye with someone of that bent, the person still may be a top-notch spiritual director. Sometimes God surprises us with the people he sends us.

Also, ask God for one. He promised to answer our prayers. One of my favorite movies is The Mask of Zorro and there is a great line from Don Diego Delevega in that movie, quoting someone else; I’m not sure who. “When the student is ready, the master will appear.” I’ve certainly found this to be the case in my own life. Best of luck to you!

Many thanks, Father. I see your point about not being afraid of a potentially ‘progressive’ spiritual director, but the turmoil in my spiritual life and my own battle has been very much connected to ‘progressive’ issues that prevail around. I would also feel far more comfortable with a priest than a lay-person (it seems that in our diocese lay-people get a lay spiritual director, while only clergy get a priest). Thanks for your advice though.

 

[buc_fan33]

Many thanks, Father. I see your point about not being afraid of a potentially ‘progressive’ spiritual director, but the turmoil in my spiritual life and my own battle has been very much connected to ‘progressive’ issues that prevail around. I would also feel far more comfortable with a priest than a lay-person (it seems that in our diocese lay-people get a lay spiritual director, while only clergy get a priest). Thanks for your advice though.

I hear ya, and that makes sense. There is something to be said about being able to go to confession to your SD. And, there is a real grace present in the sacrament of Holy Orders. Anyway, I don’t want to derail this thread too far from the original point about communion. Peace!

 

[Brendan_64]

That’s the whole point. Worry about our own sinfulness and pride. If a Priest has asked for certain communion protocols for some reason…

But it is not within his authority to ask for this. A priest has no right to insist that people receive in the hand or standing. Whatever his reason, he has no right to insist this, and by doing so he is disobeying Church law. The priest does not set the rules of the Mass within the particular church he operates, the rules represent the mind of the Church, not the mind of Father X. To tell a congregation that they ought to receive Communion standing or in the hand represents narcissism on the part of the priest and is denying the individual his legal rights under Church law.

 

[Lormar]

That’s the whole point. Worry about our own sinfulness and pride. If a Priest has asked for certain communion protocols for some reason… its not a sin to receive in the hand for the circumstances of this one time or this one parish. Why would someone say they would never receive in the hand unless they didn’t think it was below them or they knew greater holiness than the hand receivers? It’s not a liturgical abuse to receive in the hand so it seems unreasonable to say that one would never receive ever in the hand for any reason.

I never said it was a liturgical abuse. I’ve already said, and sincerely mean it, I don’t care what you or anyone else does. In turn, I would like to be left alone too and not judged for what I do. Reception of Holy Communion on the tongue is the norm and allowed.

Why would someone say they would never receive in the hand **unless they didn’t think it was below them or they knew greater holiness than the hand receivers? **I

And you know this how?

 

[Lormar]

Threads like this always turn out the same. They go nowhere except around in the same ubiquitous circle.

Let’s just each mind our own business and not be worried about the motives of anyone receiving Holy Communion. I’m sure it will please Our Lord if we impart the most charitable interpretation to what it is we see - whether we agree with it or not. :tiphat:

 

[adrift]

Again, don’t misunderstand me. I’m sure that many, if not most, people who choose to receive on the tongue, kneeling, or both, do so for the right reasons and have the right motivations. But, I’m equally certain that there are some who are doing it for the wrong reasons. .

Father I found this to be disturbing. It wouldn’t have bothered me if you had said that many who receive communion do so for the right reason and have the right motivation. It was my understanding that receiving on the tongue was the norm and that receiving by hand was a permission to deviate from the norm. Your presentation seem to say that it is the opposite that receiving by hand is the norm and by tongue is by permission. I don’t believe that a judgment should be made either way. Why is it that to receive by tongue has to be justified and put to the test of you are doing it for the right reason. I think that both ways should be questioned. If you question those who receive by tongue, than you should equally question those receiving by hand or better yet don’t question at all. My preference is by hand, has been since I first encountered it in Canada forty years ago. I am glad I have the option which I don’t believe todays youth do since they are not taught it is their option. I would prefer to receive kneeling but I don’t because I feel it is more in line with the desires of the bishops.

 

[buc_fan33]

Father I found this to be disturbing. It wouldn’t have bothered me if you had said that many who receive communion do so for the right reason and have the right motivation. It was my understanding that receiving on the tongue was the norm and that receiving by hand was a permission to deviate from the norm. Your presentation seem to say that it is the opposite that receiving by hand is the norm and by tongue is by permission. I don’t believe that a judgment should be made either way. Why is it that to receive by tongue has to be justified and put to the test of you are doing it for the right reason. I think that both ways should be questioned. If you question those who receive by tongue, than you should equally question those receiving by hand or better yet don’t question at all. My preference is by hand, has been since I first encountered it in Canada forty years ago. I am glad I have the option which I don’t believe todays youth do since they are not taught it is their option. I would prefer to receive kneeling but I don’t because I feel it is more in line with the desires of the bishops.

Sorry, but I’m not sure I really understand what’s bothering you. You said,

It wouldn’t have bothered me if you had said that many who receive communion do so for the right reason and have the right motivation.

which is pretty much what I said,

I’m sure that many, if not most, people who choose to receive on the tongue, kneeling, or both, do so for the right reasons and have the right motivations.

no?

I’m not sure what the problem is. My statement had nothing to do with what is the norm for receiving Holy Communion. Nor was it a judgment upon anyone. It was an invitation to examine our motives, and, yes, I would say the same to someone who opts to receive on the hand.

 

[LongingSoul]

It was my understanding that receiving on the tongue was the norm and that receiving by hand was a permission to deviate from the norm. Your presentation seem to say that it is the opposite that receiving by hand is the norm and by tongue is by permission. I don’t believe that a judgment should be made either way. Why is it that to receive by tongue has to be justified and put to the test of you are doing it for the right reason.

I don’t know whether ‘norms’ are different in different countries, but in Australia we have very few churches that cater for kneeling and receiving on the tongue ie. altar step and rails for support or altar server with paten at the ready for drop accidents etc. To kneel is really limited to those under about 45 (that’s when kneeling and standing again without support started to be a trial for me because I’m tall and awkward.)

 

[vsedriver]

Your priest does not have authority to demand that. He can certainly request it though. I knelt this morning. According to some I guess it was to appear better than others. I thought I was just honoring my Lord… Oops!

If I knelt to receive, I wouldn’t be able to get back up!

 

[adrift]

no?

I’m not sure what the problem is. My statement had nothing to do with what is the norm for receiving Holy Communion. Nor was it a judgment upon anyone. It was an invitation to examine our motives, and, yes, I would say the same to someone who opts to receive on the hand.

It seemed that only those who received by mouth motives were being questioned your statement clears that up.

 

[Duane1966]

Most people who appear to be holier than me, I am quite sure are holier than me.

 

[Share_love]

As for finding another parish, there isn’t one that encourages people to kneel. I don’t kneel because when they ripped out the alter rail at the church when I was young, my father tried to kneel for communion, he was berated and demeaned by the priest in front of the whole church and was not allowed to receive. I never wanted to be humiliated like that so I always receive standing up.

That’s horrible! I’m so sorry to hear that.