Protestants as "brethren"

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being politically correct, I refer to them as brethren and sistern (cistern?) you see why PC can get you into trouble
 
i think the idea of separated brethren comes from the fact that we have similar central doctrines like the trinity, death and resurrection, etc. thus, even people with such different doctrines from us as s.d.a.'s are considered separated brethren.
the church teaches that all systems of faith have the truth to a greater or lesser degree and the catholic church to the highest degree presently possible(excluding that which is not yet known and perhaps will never be known till the end of time)
in that sense, protestant faith is much closer than other faiths to us and are thus rightfully called separated brethren
by the way, does that make the eastern orthodox church “less-separated” brethren?
 
kepha1,

Thank you for your post on CCC 817 & 818. That was very good and solid proof about what the Church teaches. So much for opinions. Amazingly, this is not what the anti-Catholics teach like at jesus-is-lord.com, mtc.com or bible.ca, etc. I wonder why? Is the truth that hard for them to accept?

When I talk to anti-Catholics (or sometimes just protestants in general) I know I gave solid proof of my point when they ignore what I said and change the subject totally. They don’t admit they are wrong or accept my proof, they just continue to believe what they want to and walk off or change to a new topic.
Great job and keep up the great proof texts!:clapping:
 
justinianplague:
in that sense, protestant faith is much closer than other faiths to us and are thus rightfully called separated brethren
by the way, does that make the eastern orthodox church “less-separated” brethren?
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On the contrary, the Eastern Orthodox, doctrinally speaking, are closer to Catholicism than Protestantism. However, the use of the term “separated brethren” I believe, does not really make distinctions as to who are in fact “less” or “more” separated. The fact is, they are separated from us, though they are our brethren still.

Gerry 🙂
 
justinianplague:
by the way, does that make the eastern orthodox church “less-separated” brethren?
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Yes, I think so, although it is not defined as such. I have heard that the Orthodox faith is THE closest of any to Catholicism.
 
scborromeo.org/ccc/ccc_toc.htm

CCC

838 “The Church knows that she is joined in many ways to the baptized who are honored by the name of Christian, but do not profess the Catholic faith in its entirety or have not preserved unity or communion under the successor of Peter.” Those "who believe in Christ and have been properly baptized are put in a certain, although imperfect, communion with the Catholic Church." With the Orthodox Churches, this communion is so profound "that it lacks little to attain the fullness that would permit a common celebration of the Lord’s Eucharist."
 
I think too many people focus on the “seperated” and not the “bretheren”.
Matt. 18:12-14
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12 What do you think? If a man has a hundred sheep, and one of them has gone astray, does he not leave the ninety-nine on the mountains and go in search of the one that went astray?
13 And if he finds it, truly, I say to you, he rejoices over it more than over the ninety-nine that never went astray.
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I think some people’s version of ecumenism would have the shepherd stand by the ninety-nine and holler: “COME BACK HERE! HERE IS THE FLOCK! WHAT’S THE MATTER WITH YOU? THE FLOCK IS RIGHT HERE!!!”

Hmm.

John
 
John Higgins:
I think too many people focus on the “seperated” and not the “bretheren”.

I think some people’s version of ecumenism would have the shepherd stand by the ninety-nine and holler: “COME BACK HERE! HERE IS THE FLOCK! WHAT’S THE MATTER WITH YOU? THE FLOCK IS RIGHT HERE!!!”
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:rotfl: very true
 
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montanaman:
I used to think Protestants were children of the devil. Then, cooler heads prevailed and I softened, tending to think of them as a big, mysterious question mark. Many of them really inspired me.

But now, I don’t know. They shift and change their beliefs. They’re awesomely capable of cognitive dissonance. They are always interrogating me, making me justify my Christianity, as though I have some radical new system of beliefs that needs to be explained.

After talking to them, I feel like I need a shower.
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Amen!
***Having left the Church and come back, I see this even more clearly. We live in an White Anglo-Celtic Protestant Culture, shape by the piety and anti-Catholicism of the Puritans on one hand and the elitism of Unitarians, Transcendentalist and the moral positivists on the other. Protestantism is actually a unity within a chaos, whereas we as Catholics struggle with but have chaos within our unity. ***
What unites the protestant consesus, from the bible chapel literalist to the high church Episcopalian, from the tyranny of the God of Calvin and Knox, to the more catholic and generous God of John Wesley (who would have been a Catholic I believe if he lived in the time of John Cardinal Newman), is their CERTAINTY THAT CATHOLICISM IS WRONG AND EVIL!.
What unites protestants is their SUREFIRED CONFIDENCE THAT WE ARE WRONG!
But the church tells us to forgive wrongs and to be charitable. Still, one can empathize with the hot tempered outbursts of Peter and Paul after a typical exchange of views. No matter how humble, charitable or sound the Catholics’ exposition, they are sneered at, patronized, given short shrift and usually handed a tract. They will talk unselfconsciously for 20 min on their faith based on their understanding of Romans and Galations and say, with absolute authority that this or that is certainly what the bible teaches.
When its the Catholics’ turn to talk, They are shut down hard and fast. Often, if the Catholic makes a point they can’t refute they will brush it away with the sweep of a hand and end the conversation.
We are not equals and even when we are doing what is obviously right, we are deemed wrong.
A Christian is one who follows Christ. Praise God for beautiful protestants like Corrie Ten Boom, Johnny Ericson and yes, Billy Graham. But I choose to follow Christ in the footsteps of Max Kolbe, Edith Stein, Juan Hidalgo, Saints Clare and Francis of Assisi and the Nagasaki Martyrs. There is nothing that A W Tozer, Charles Hodge, or John Knox, who inspired Oliver Cromwell, the great Ethnic Cleanser of the Irish Holocaust, on how to love, live and follow Christ.
Steve
 
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Catholic4aReasn:
With love and respect I must say that I couldn’t disagree more with this sentiment. I not only don’t hope they keep their distance I hope they come close enough to see what they’re missing and make the journey all the way home!!

In Christ,
Nancy 🙂
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Thank you for the kind loving words Nancy. I think sometimes people forget about Discipleship and it being our duty Christians.
 
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Exporter:
The term “separated brethern” is gratuitus in my opinion. But since for some reason the Pope has used that term who am I to correct him.

They are “separated” from us by their own choice. Are they “brethern”? Some are but most aren"t !!

Truely, in all my 73 years I have not heard one good word about Holy Mother Church from a Protestant, Jew or Muslim. All I hear is derogatory remarks and how they can’t believe John Paul II is infallible. In my book since they are separated, I hope they keep their distance.:tiphat:
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This is hateful.
 
Joe Kelley:
I think the technical definition of heretic requires that one once profess the Catholic Faith and then reject portions of it. For that reason the first generation Protestants are regarded as heretics but not their descendents, who were never professing Catholics.
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One does not need to profess the Catholic Faith at some point in order to be a heretic. Only be baptized and reject part of the Church’s teachings. DV’s distinction between material and formal heresy is right on the mark, which is why the CCC says that those who are born into heresy are not held accountable for the sin of separation.
 
Sean O’L,

Thanks for that link to Msgr. Kennedy from 1899. It’s a true today as it was then. Brethren? You bet!

John
 
Lest we forget (from the CCC):
818 “However, one cannot charge with the sin of the separation those who at present are born into these communities [that resulted from such separation] and in them are brought up in the faith of Christ, and the Catholic Church accepts them with respect and affection as brothers . . . . All who have been justified by faith in Baptism are incorporated into Christ; they therefore have a right to be called Christians, and with good reason are accepted as brothers in the Lord by the children of the Catholic Church.”
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819 “Furthermore, many elements of sanctification and of truth” are found outside the visible confines of the Catholic Church: “the written Word of God; the life of grace; faith, hope, and charity, with the other interior gifts of the Holy Spirit, as well as visible elements.” Christ’s Spirit uses these Churches and ecclesial communities as means of salvation, whose power derives from the fullness of grace and truth that Christ has entrusted to the Catholic Church. All these blessings come from Christ and lead to him, and are in themselves calls to “Catholic unity.”
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John
 
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sparkle:
If they are really Christians, then I think of course they are brethern, but “separated brethern” as mentioned. WOW did this topic cause an upheavel with me and a Protestant friend though, when I mentioned that this is how the Pope refers to Protestants.

Protestants almost flip their wig to be referred to as “seperated brethern”. They hate this connotation.

I wonder you knowledgeable Catholics----do you think our Protestant brethern are heretics? If this word means to “pick and choose”–isn’t this what Protestants do really? Seems certainly so to me. I know they are lovers of Christ, as my whole family is, however, they’ve shut out so much of the Truth.

Wonder if saints long ago, would consider Protestants heretics today?

Any views on this?
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John Paul II called Billy Graham a Brother in Christ…not a Separated Brother in Christ.
 
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