Protestants on this forum: Do you consider Catholics to be Christians?

[JesusIsKing]

Hey Edwin. Thanks for your reply.
No you cant work for salvation. Definitely Not. What youre talking about is after you are saved and you live in sin. But there is no works (do gooding activities) that you or I can do in order to be saved. We ask Jesus to forgive us. Having recongnised that we are sinners in need of a saviour. You cant earn salvation. He bought us with a price. We cannot buy Him. Period. Sorry, you must have picked me up wrong.

1. What does ‘Share in his sacrafice mean’? Do you feel the pain? Do you help him carry the sins of the world that he bore on CALVARY’S CROSS? Is the drinking of blood from a sacrafice not Satanic?
2. Read 2 Timothy 3v16
3. The Bread is Symbolic of His Body Broken for US. And did he not break actual bread at the table? Maybe your Bible is different from mine
4. Were the Martyrs of the Reformation Heretics?
5. When you open the Bible, who breathes apon you? What do you see? Who touches your heart? Who speaks to you?
6. I will most definitely read some of your suggested readings at some stage.
   Note: My life is not about talking sides or Protestantism. And your life may be about Catholicism/church history your choice. Mines about Christ and sharing his saving truth. As long as your saved and walking daily with the saviour. Thats what its all about. Jesus Saves xo

 

[teachccd]

Hey Edwin. Thanks for your reply.
No you cant work for salvation. Definitely Not. What youre talking about is after you are saved and you live in sin. But there is no works (do gooding activities) that you or I can do in order to be saved. We ask Jesus to forgive us. Having recongnised that we are sinners in need of a saviour. You cant earn salvation. He bought us with a price. We cannot buy Him. Period. Sorry, you must have picked me up wrong.

1. What does ‘Share in his sacrafice mean’? Do you feel the pain? Do you help him carry the sins of the world that he bore on CALVARY’S CROSS? Is the drinking of blood from a sacrafice not Satanic?
2. Read 2 Timothy 3v16
3. The Bread is Symbolic of His Body Broken for US. And did he not break actual bread at the table? Maybe your Bible is different from mine
4. Were the Martyrs of the Reformation Heretics?
5. When you open the Bible, who breathes apon you? What do you see? Who touches your heart? Who speaks to you?
6. I will most definitely read some of your suggested readings at some stage.
   Note: My life is not about talking sides or Protestantism. And your life may be about Catholicism/church history your choice. Mines about Christ and sharing his saving truth. As long as your saved and walking daily with the saviour. Thats what its all about. Jesus Saves xo

All I can do is…:banghead: JesusIsKing, Please by the grace of God will you answer this one question?? How was the New Testament compiled?? If you resort to an inspired book you must have that answer. Please tell me…teachccd

 

[teachccd]

Note: My life is not about talking sides or Protestantism. And your life may be about Catholicism/church history your choice. Mines about Christ and sharing his saving truth. As long as your saved and walking daily with the saviour. Thats what its all about. Jesus Saves xo

And from whom did you receive this truth. Please don’t say the Bible unless you already answered my previous question…God Bless…teachccd

 

[Singinbeauty]

You are another Christian who is ignorant in the teachings of the Catholic Church. WE DON’T TEACH THAT WORKS GETS YOU TO HEAVEN!! We teach that faith (as a free gift from God through grace) must not just be a said faith. It must be a faith filled with love. Gal. 5:6 If faith must not be dead (see James 2) then it must contain something. If that something is love ( Of these three, faith, hope,and love the greatest of these is love cf.1 Cor 13) then faith filled with love is necessary for salvation. This we call faith and works. Works by themselves without faith do NOTHING.

Please!! If all Jesus wanted us to do is to BELIEVE in Him then why so much scripture. This theology fits in one paragraph. Yes we must believe AND follow Him. If you were on a sinking ship and I was the greatest captain in the world, you could believe that I will save you but unless you grab your life jacket and FOLLOW me you will drown.

Please for your own sake do not embarrass yourself by spreading error concerning the Catholic Church. I would also recommend buying a copy of the Catechism of the Catholic Church. I did that with Jehovahs Witness publications so that when I talk to them I am not misrepresenting what they teach. There is no greater way show your point than when you are well versed in theirs. Take heed. Who knows? You might see something you like.

While I don’t believe that I am ‘embarrassing’ myself I thank you for the warning. From your statement above it indicated that you were saying that it was works that got you where you needed to go. CHILL OUT. I believe that it is Faith that saves you. That Faith will show the necessary works because the Bible teaches that you will be known by your fruit. Without the True Faith the works will not be evident. But you have to believe FIRST which makes it most important. Geez.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

And from whom did you receive this truth. Please don’t say the Bible unless you already answered my previous question…God Bless…teachccd

Hi,
Im sorry Im not JIK but we know this because God inspired man to write it down in what we call the bible today.
The early church compiled the NT-but make no doubt about–it was God who truly put it together through men.

Man had nothing to do with it.It was all orchestrated by GOD. We should be thanking God for giving us His truth in writing so we even know what to do or how to act.

AMEN!!!

IMHO when people start exhalting the church for giving us the bible–well–it is boasting and arrogant. We know what God says about that.

 

[teachccd]

Hi,
Im sorry Im not JIK but we know this because God inspired man to write it down in what we call the bible today.
The early church compiled the NT-but make no doubt about–it was God who truly put it together through men.

Man had nothing to do with it.It was all orchestrated by GOD. We should be thanking God for giving us His truth in writing so we even know what to do or how to act.

AMEN!!!

IMHO when people start exhalting the church for giving us the bible–well–it is boasting and arrogant. We know what God says about that.

So if God worked through the Church to give us Scripture then isn’t that same Church inspired to interpret such writings?? Remember. I’m with you when you say it’s God’s word but you said that He utilized the Church as His instument. The Church, by definition, is the Body of Christ so saying that the inspired Body of Christ giving mankind Scripture is not arrogant unless one agrees that putting Matthew’s name on his gospel is arrogant. Matthew is part of that inspired Body of Christ.

 

[teachccd]

While I don’t believe that I am ‘embarrassing’ myself I thank you for the warning. From your statement above it indicated that you were saying that it was works that got you where you needed to go. CHILL OUT. I believe that it is Faith that saves you. That Faith will show the necessary works because the Bible teaches that you will be known by your fruit. Without the True Faith the works will not be evident. But you have to believe FIRST which makes it most important. Geez.

JesusIsKing got me all worked up and I apologize. I NEVER would have indicated that works by themselves gets you to heaven because we don’t teach that. I’m chilled out now.
God Bless you…teachccd

 

[ALLFORHIM]

So if God worked through the Church to give us Scripture then isn’t that same Church inspired to interpret such writings?? Remember. I’m with you when you say it’s God’s word but you said that He utilized the Church as His instument. The Church, by definition, is the Body of Christ so saying that the inspired Body of Christ giving mankind Scripture is not arrogant unless one agrees that putting Matthew’s name on his gospel is arrogant. Matthew is part of that inspired Body of Christ.

Well without derailing the thread I hope.

Our definition of the body of Christ is different-the CC says it is them and non-cathoics says it is the whole body of believers.(which is not limited to the CC) Then we have the whole priesthood of believers issue. You know what Im saying.
so there ya go.

Saying that the CC gave us the bible is arrogant because you are not giving God the credit but instead being full of pride saying it was the CC. I dont mean to be mean just what I observe. Well on the internet anyway.

 

[teachccd]

Saying that the CC gave us the bible is arrogant because you are not giving God the credit but instead being full of pride saying it was the CC. I dont mean to be mean just what I observe. Well on the internet anyway.

Yea and that’s the problem: internet info.

You have not read any Catholic doctrine, encylicals or Vatican II documents if you believe that the Catholic Church doesn’t believe that inspired text comes 100% completely from God. But just as God worked through a woman named Mary to bring us Jesus(Living word of God) He worked through the inspired Church to bring us Sacred Scripture. (Written word of God) Now is it arrogant to say that Jesus came from Mary?

 

[teachccd]

I believe that we are well on topic for this thread because of the nature of the question posed. This would have to lead to various understandings of Catholic Christians and Protestant Christians in order to justify an answer. If I am wrong, my apologies and I’m done…teachccd

 

[JesusIsKing]

A better believer above being a proud Catholic?? It’s all in view now and so I cannot hold you accountable. You speak with ignorance of the Catholic faith and so your fervency is fed with error and that is a shame.

" It is finished" refers to the consummation of the Last Supper when Christ did not drink the fourth cup. The crucifixion was the fourth cup into which Christ renewed the Passover and became the Paschal lamb in fulfillment of the Old Covenant with His people.

The Eucharist is NOT a repeated sacrifice but a perpetuation of that one and only sacrifice on calvary made present to all generations until He comes again.Not only was calvary enough but Jesus left us this precious gift of the Eucharist so that all might be present to that moment. God is not in time and neither is His sacrifice. He is the eternal high priest. In order for His priesthood to be eternal so must His sacrifice. At the Last supper Jesus said, " This is my body". The Apostles recognized that this is the “how” we must eat His flesh that He spoke of a year ago when many left to their former way of living.

I am a fervently strong Catholic precisely because I’ve read a multitude of non- Catholic literature. There are so many holes in protestant theology that it became a sad shame with it’s massive divisions. Even Martin Luther alluded to the mess he started.

So you thank God for the Bible. So do I. BUT… Who specifically acknowledged the 27 books of the New Testament?? This bible fell from the sky??

Yes, I thank you again for bumping up my Catholic faith yet up another notch because when I see the misconceptions and lies taught about us I KNOW that Jesus started a Church and from that Church (the body of believers) came a bible and that Church is ths Catholic Church. Yes , Jesus is the living Word of God and He left a Church with inspired authors who presented the written word of God. These authors were Catholic in their beliefs.

You need the studying, my friend, so why don’t you quit embarrassing yourself and pick up a copy of the Catechism of the Catholic Church and at the very least educate yourself in what you now erroneously think that we believe. You don’t have to agree with Catholic teachings but at least KNOW what you’re talking about.

One last point. Would you pass out the New World Translation of Holy Scriptures or would you burn it. I’d burn it for the same reasons bibles were burned back then. Please don’t be so misled.

May the grace of our Lord, Jesus Christ, the love of God and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you always…teachccd/QUOTE

The Scriptures tell us that Christ is ALWAYS with us. His Sacrafice is eternal - it cant be undone. The Eucharist - all might be present at that moment?? At that moment?? Could you explain that for me please?
He cried "it is finished"on the cross not at a table? Maybe ive miss understood you. Sorry. You may also like to read Hebrews 10. One sacrafice, once and for all.
And who told you that the Apostles were Catholics?
I have yet to come across the name of any denomination is the scriptures.
If you’d choose to burn Scriptures, thats up to you. But Il take it that you were jokin/being sarcastic about the Word. Jesus Only

 

[sandmountainsli]

I consider Catholicism to be a “foreign” or Southern European–ethnic version of Christianity but they do practice baptism and believe in the Nicene Creed so, Yes this C-Methodists does consider them Christians
WP

 

[teachccd]

teachccd;2185037:

The Scriptures tell us that Christ is ALWAYS with us. His Sacrafice is eternal - it cant be undone. The Eucharist - all might be present at that moment?? At that moment?? Could you explain that for me please?
He cried "it is finished"on the cross not at a table? Maybe ive miss understood you. Sorry. You may also like to read Hebrews 10. One sacrafice, once and for all.
And who told you that the Apostles were Catholics?
I have yet to come across the name of any denomination is the scriptures.
If you’d choose to burn Scriptures, thats up to you. But Il take it that you were jokin/being sarcastic about the Word. Jesus Only

Your lack of knowledge precedes you. That moment I speak of was His death on the Cross. We teach one sacrifice for all. The Scripture I quoted was the bible that the Jehovah’s Witnesses use that is distorted and full of heresy, ( NOT the Word of God) But due to your ongoing lack of education in Church history, Scripture and the Eucharist you continue to “throw out” all kinds of one sided opinions that make no sense. You never answered my question on Scripture and I’ll bet my bottom dollar that you never read a writing from the Early Church Fathers. Please prove me wrong. Jesus never preached “Jesus Only” Quite the contrary, in fact… Boy oh boy…

 

[JesusIsKing]

JesusIsKing;2185963:

Your lack of knowledge precedes you. That moment I speak of was His death on the Cross. We teach one sacrifice for all. The Scripture I quoted was the bible that the Jehovah’s Witnesses use that is distorted and full of heresy, ( NOT the Word of God) But due to your ongoing lack of education in Church history, Scripture and the Eucharist you continue to “throw out” all kinds of one sided opinions that make no sense. You never answered my question on Scripture and I’ll bet my bottom dollar that you never read a writing from the Early Church Fathers. Please prove me wrong. Jesus never preached “Jesus Only” Quite the contrary, in fact… Boy oh boy…

And I believe one sacrafice for all. I just dont believe that it becomes his actual blood and flesh. Not sure were your going with the Jehovah Scripture stuff??? Sorry I never answered your scripture question. Ive been flitting in between forums and my emails. Jesus Only - It means life is Only about living for Him. (I am fully aware of the Servant King and about serving others -Its scriptural)

 

[teachccd]

teachccd;2186096:

And I believe one sacrafice for all. I just dont believe that it becomes his actual blood and flesh. Not sure were your going with the Jehovah Scripture stuff??? Sorry I never answered your scripture question. Ive been flitting in between forums and my emails. Jesus Only - It means life is Only about living for Him. (I am fully aware of the Servant King and about serving others -Its scriptural)

You are so busy running through the forest that you don’t see the trees. You are not willing to dialogue. You are on one track and one track only. The Catholic Church is the Whore of Babylon and you are “Jesus Only”. You refuse to hear what anyone here is saying to you. You refuse to answer pertinent questions. You refuse to even comment on the Eucharist other than it’s pagan. ( So are the days of the week but I’m sure you call today Sunday) I’m going to make this my last post with you only because I type to nowhere. You monologue and you just love to hear yourself talk. You are one who stirs the pot and runs. I will close now and pray for you. I believe that you truely love Jesus but you are stuck and theologically uninformed and refuse to progress. You are set back even as a Protestant. Your understanding of Trinitarian doctrine is weak at best and you refuse to hear anyone here. I’m done. Others will take over until they also realize that your outer shell is impermeable. Bye and God Bless…teachccd

 

[JesusIsKing]

JesusIsKing;2186169:

You are so busy running through the forest that you don’t see the trees. You are not willing to dialogue. You are on one track and one track only. The Catholic Church is the Whore of Babylon and you are “Jesus Only”. You refuse to hear what anyone here is saying to you. You refuse to answer pertinent questions. You refuse to even comment on the Eucharist other than it’s pagan. ( So are the days of the week but I’m sure you call today Sunday) I’m going to make this my last post with you only because I type to nowhere. You monologue and you just love to hear yourself talk. You are one who stirs the pot and runs. I will close now and pray for you. I believe that you truely love Jesus but you are stuck and theologically uninformed and refuse to progress. You are set back even as a Protestant. Your understanding of Trinitarian doctrine is weak at best and you refuse to hear anyone here. I’m done. Others will take over until they also realize that your outer shell is impermeable. Bye and God Bless…teachccd

My eyes are always on Jesus man. Not a church, but Christ. On how I can draw closer to him. If I have stirred you up, isnt that good? This is a forum? Right. And you dont always hear what you want. Its called being challenged. You see, Im far from ‘set back’. I have A LIVING TESTIMONY OF THE POWER OF GODS SAVING GRACE IN MY LIFE. Ive been set free from sin. Glory to His name. And I have seen the lives of others transformed. And thats more important. Thats what lifes about. Telling people about Jesus. Pretty amazing stuff. And its all because of Him, not Doctrine. May we all grow in grace and in the Saving Knowledge of Our Lord Jesus Christ. Amen

 

[Zooey]

teachccd;2186464:

My eyes are always on Jesus man. Not a church, but Christ. On how I can draw closer to him. If I have stirred you up, isnt that good? This is a forum? Right. And you dont always hear what you want. Its called being challenged. You see, Im far from ‘set back’. I have A LIVING TESTIMONY OF THE POWER OF GODS SAVING GRACE IN MY LIFE. Ive been set free from sin. Glory to His name. And I have seen the lives of others transformed. And thats more important. Thats what lifes about. Telling people about Jesus. Pretty amazing stuff. And its all because of Him, not Doctrine. May we all grow in grace and in the Saving Knowledge of Our Lord Jesus Christ. Amen

My friend, you don’t have the slightest idea what Catholics (& others) on this site believe, because, far from having your eyes on Jesus Christ, you have them on foolish anti-Catholic nonsense that bears no relation to what the Catholic faith is all about…
You say “because of Jesus, not doctrine”, but if you have no knowledge of doctrine, you have no way of judging whether what someone tells you about Him, as to whether it is true, or whether they made it up off the tops of their heads.
A perfect example of this, is repeated references to Alexander Hislop. Because, you see, his book is composed of sheer fiction! Yet you accept his collection of trashy stories that :tsktsk: denigrate those who all followers of the Only Master…What a tragedy!!

Please, instead of continuing to rant about things that you do not understand, consider reading some of the fine links that have been provided for you, about what Catholics really believe–not what someone who:crying: **hates **Catholics says that the Catholic Church teaches…

I truly believe that you have been lied to, & deceived, not that you are choosing to close your eyes, mind, & heart…
Read and learn the truth. Then, if you choose to discuss truth with the rest of us, you will be able to do so with knowledge & understanding. At present, your mind has been so filled with :crying: prejudices,:crying: outright lies, & half-truths, that you do not even recognize what the truth is–Who the Truth is–
I pray that you will allow yourself to become enlightened.

 

[Steadfast]

Even when I was at my most virulently Protestant I had a very hard time agreeing with my Calvinist brethren that Roman Catholicism and Catholics weren’t Christian.

I think it had something to do with the historical facts that until the time of the Reformation they were the only Church in the West and that the Great Reformers all uniformly understood themselves to be rooted in her. So for them to deny her or for anyone to say that she is not Christian would be for them to cut out their own feet from under them and to say that there was, in effect, no Church between whenever (the Edict of Milan usually) and the 16th century.

Which is, pardon me, asinine.

 

[JesusIsKing]

JesusIsKing;2186935:

My friend, you don’t have the slightest idea what Catholics (& others) on this site believe, because, far from having your eyes on Jesus Christ, you have them on foolish anti-Catholic nonsense that bears no relation to what the Catholic faith is all about…
You say “because of Jesus, not doctrine”, but if you have no knowledge of doctrine, you have no way of judging whether what someone tells you about Him, as to whether it is true, or whether they made it up off the tops of their heads.
A perfect example of this, is repeated references to Alexander Hislop. Because, you see, his book is composed of sheer fiction! Yet you accept his collection of trashy stories that :tsktsk: denigrate those who all followers of the Only Master…What a tragedy!!

Please, instead of continuing to rant about things that you do not understand, consider reading some of the fine links that have been provided for you, about what Catholics really believe–not what someone who:crying: **hates **

Catholics says that the Catholic Church teaches…

I truly believe that you have been lied to, & deceived, not that you are choosing to close your eyes, mind, & heart…
Read and learn the truth. Then, if you choose to discuss truth with the rest of us, you will be able to do so with knowledge & understanding. At present, your mind has been so filled with :crying: prejudices,:crying: outright lies, & half-truths, that you do not even recognize what the truth is–Who the Truth is–
I pray that you will allow yourself to become enlightened.

Maybe you can enlighten me on this.
" What must I do to be saved?"

 

[toaslan]

Oh, please, let me!

It is a mistake to equate the two questions, “Are Catholics Christians?” with the question “Are Catholics saved?”

To be Christian and to be Saved: for Catholics those are two different things while we are here on earth.

If Protestants insist in collapsing the two questions into one question, Catholics are unable to give an unambiguous answer. Catholics need both questions to be asked.

What makes a Catholic Christian is the same thing that makes anybody Christian: baptism. By baptism we are born again into divine life.

What makes a Catholic **a good Christian **is living his life in Christ and, finally one day, dying in Christ. It is responding to all the graces given day by day. It is following Christ before falling into sin, and it is following Him after falling into sin. Even in sin, unless it is deadly sin, we have His life in us, always calling us to repent and live more in Him.

So, that is a Catholic answer your question,

"What must I do to be saved?