Prove to me that ND is a Catholic institution

[Lepanto]

Are you a Notre Dame booster? Prove to me and the rest of the readers here that the University of Our Lady is a Catholic university.

And I don’t want to read about football nonsense.

 

[Rach620]

Look, everything isn’t peachy with Catholicism at Notre Dame. This is obvious. But to abandon Our Lady’s University, to proclaim that there is NOTHING good there, nothing truly Catholic, is wrong. There is plenty worth fighting for and praying for at Notre Dame. Much good has been done there, by faculty and students alike.

Notre Dame is a wonderful university, and I had the privilege of studying there. It was a life-changing experience. I encountered Catholicism and a deeply Catholic culture at every turn, was encouraged in my theological studies to seek to more deeply understand my faith and to allow Christ, the Word Incarnate, to direct my life. I know many others who have had similar experiences, and whose deep and often scathing criticisms are directed towards her out of love for the University and for what it is called to be.

And I am a member of the Class of 2009.

I highly recommend that you read the full text of Fr. Miscamble’s speech from the ND Response rally held Sunday. He gives a good history of Notre Dame and what it stands for, and is quite clear on what we should all think about this situation and the possibilities for positive developments in the future.

A few excerpts:

But what matters for us here is less what President Obama says, but rather what the day will mean for Notre Dame and its place in American Catholic life.

The truth is this: This painful episode has damaged the ethos and spirit of Notre Dame. But there is another truth that we must also remember: IT IS NOT THE END OF THE STORY!
…
Now we are engaged in a more intellectual and spiritual struggle. Will we be true to the founding vision? Can we resist the subtle and not so subtle temptations to surrender our distinct religious identity – and conform to the reigning and rather barren secular paradigm of what a university should be?

The Obama visit suggests that the University’s leadership has succumbed to this temptation. Yet when we look back on these days, I have a sense that what will stand out is how a group of dedicated prolife students, wonderful alumni, and ordinary Catholics who cherish this place refused to acquiesce in the Administration’s willingness to wink at its most fundamental values in exchange for the public relations coup that attends a presidential visit.

The people who refuse to give up - and I speak especially of you students — have taken on the role of teachers here. While the administration and many of the faculty sold out easily for the photo-ops etc, you and some of your alumni sisters and brothers showed the benefits of your Notre Dame education. You held firm to the foundational principles of respect for life and for the dignity of every person. You are the ones who have understood what really matters. You refuse to just go along. You have made your voice heard and led the way to a better future.

You represent the very best of Notre Dame. You - along with your good professors and faithful alums - are the ones who can help Notre Dame recover from this painful and self-inflicted wound. You will not find it easy, and you will have moments where you will be discouraged. But you must remember there is so much that is good at Notre Dame that you can never relent in your efforts to call this place to be its best and true self – proud of its Catholic identity and its loyal membership in the Church.

 

[Havard]

Well if you want to get technical, it’s a not a Catholic institution… it’s a joint-venture between a Catholic organization (Congregation of Holy Cross) and a board of trustees, who are not a Catholic organization.

JReducation pointed out in another thread that the Church does not claim authority over such joint ventures, which are common among ‘Catholic’ universities and hospitals.

 

[Lepanto]

But to abandon Our Lady’s University, to proclaim that there is NOTHING good there, nothing truly Catholic, is wrong.

We mustn’t be driven by sentimentality (I’m not saying that you are), but I’d like to see some facts and figures. Here’s a good one: how many of the thousands within the ND student body enter the seminary or convent each year? I think that Tom Monaghan was right. Most American “Catholic” universities are beyond hope. Time to start from scratch, as at Ave Maria University.

I highly recommend that you read the full text of Fr. Miscamble’s speech from the ND Response rally held Sunday.

Nice talk, but Fr. Miscamble’s speech from a protest rally hardly is representative of ND. Unfortunately, he is not the official voice of ND.

 

[Rach620]

Well if you want to get technical, it’s a not a Catholic institution… it’s a joint-venture between a Catholic organization (Congregation of Holy Cross) and a board of trustees, who are not a Catholic organization.

JReducation pointed out in another thread that the Church does not claim authority over such joint ventures, which are common among ‘Catholic’ universities and hospitals.

This has to do with Notre Dame’s governance, but not what it itself proclaims to be…

Notre Dame’s Mission Statement

The University of Notre Dame is a Catholic academic community of higher learning, animated from its origins by the Congregation of Holy Cross. The University is dedicated to the pursuit and sharing of truth for its own sake. As a Catholic university, one of its distinctive goals is to provide a forum where, through free inquiry and open discussion, the various lines of Catholic thought may intersect with all the forms of knowledge found in the arts, sciences, professions, and every other area of human scholarship and creativity.

The intellectual interchange essential to a university requires, and is enriched by, the presence and voices of diverse scholars and students. The Catholic identity of the University depends upon, and is nurtured by, the continuing presence of a predominant number of Catholic intellectuals. This ideal has been consistently maintained by the University leadership throughout its history. What the University asks of all its scholars and students, however, is not a particular creedal affiliation, but a respect for the objectives of Notre Dame and a willingness to enter into the conversation that gives it life and character. Therefore, the University insists upon academic freedom that makes open discussion and inquiry possible.

The University prides itself on being an environment of teaching and learning that fosters the development in its students of those disciplined habits of mind, body, and spirit that characterize educated, skilled, and free human beings. In addition, the University seeks to cultivate in its students not only an appreciation for the great achievements of human beings but also a disciplined sensibility to the poverty, injustice and oppression that burden the lives of so many. The aim is to create a sense of human solidarity and concern for the common good that will bear fruit as learning becomes service to justice.

Notre Dame also has a responsibility to advance knowledge in a search for truth through original inquiry and publication. This responsibility engages the faculty and students in all areas of the University, but particularly in graduate and professional education and research. The University is committed to constructive and critical engagement with the whole of human culture.

The University encourages a way of living consonant with a Christian community and manifest in prayer, liturgy and service. Residential life endeavors to develop that sense of community and of responsibility that prepares students for subsequent leadership in building a society that is at once more human and more divine.

Notre Dame’s character as a Catholic academic community presupposes that no genuine search for the truth in the human or the cosmic order is alien to the life of faith. The University welcomes all areas of scholarly activity as consonant with its mission, subject to appropriate critical refinement. There is, however, a special obligation and opportunity, specifically as a Catholic university, to pursue the religious dimensions of all human learning. Only thus can Catholic intellectual life in all disciplines be animated and fostered and a proper community of scholarly religious discourse be established.

In all dimensions of the University, Notre Dame pursues its objectives through the formation of an authentic human community graced by the Spirit of Christ.

As far as the Church ‘claiming authority’ over Notre Dame–I don’t think that it’s so much that the Church isn’t claiming authority as it is that elements of ND’s administration are not subjecting themselves to that authority and honoring it. As a member of the ND community I have not heard ND’s Catholicism explained in the way you are, Havard, so I just thought I’d throw this out there to help clarify.

 

[Lepanto]

Well if you want to get technical, it’s a not a Catholic institution… it’s a joint-venture between a Catholic organization (Congregation of Holy Cross) and a board of trustees, who are not a Catholic organization.

OK, then we agree that it is a FORMER Catholic institution? Some sort of hybrid entity with no clear identity? I’ll buy that.

JReducation pointed out in another thread that the Church does not claim authority over such joint ventures, which are common among ‘Catholic’ universities and hospitals.

I don’t buy this at all. This is sophistry. There may not be a direct reporting relationship to any bishop (and yet the Congregation of the Holy Cross is headquartered in Rome), but any institution that claims to be Catholic is not above the teachings of the Church.

 

[Havard]

Father Jenkins, like any Holy Cross priest, reports to his Provincial Superior. His Provincial Superior cannot fire him from his post at the university, but he can forbid him from continuing a second 5-year term, when it is up next year.

So yes, the university is indirectly influenced by the Church. And when Father Jenkins’ term is up, we’ll see how the Church exerts that influence.

Edit: To ND naysayers… if the Provincial Superior recommends a good replacement to Father Jenkins, and said replacement is duly voted into office, will Notre Dame be Catholic ‘again’ in your eyes?

 

[Lepanto]

Father Jenkins, like any Holy Cross priest, reports to his Provincial Superior. His Provincial Superior cannot fire him from his post at the university, but he can forbid him from continuing a second 5-year term, when it is up next year.

So yes, the university is indirectly influenced by the Church. And when Father Jenkins’ term is up, we’ll see how the Church exerts that influence.

Wait for his term to be up? Like they did for McBrien?

Is the Congregation of the Holy Cross a religious congregation, or is it a corporation in which its “employees” are protected by a union labor contract?

 

[bookgirl32]

Look, everything isn’t peachy with Catholicism at Notre Dame. This is obvious. But to abandon Our Lady’s University, to proclaim that there is NOTHING good there, nothing truly Catholic, is wrong. There is plenty worth fighting for and praying for at Notre Dame. Much good has been done there, by faculty and students alike.

Notre Dame is a wonderful university, and I had the privilege of studying there. It was a life-changing experience. I encountered Catholicism and a deeply Catholic culture at every turn, was encouraged in my theological studies to seek to more deeply understand my faith and to allow Christ, the Word Incarnate, to direct my life. I know many others who have had similar experiences, and whose deep and often scathing criticisms are directed towards her out of love for the University and for what it is called to be.

And I am a member of the Class of 2009.

I highly recommend that you read the full text of Fr. Miscamble’s speech from the ND Response rally held Sunday. He gives a good history of Notre Dame and what it stands for, and is quite clear on what we should all think about this situation and the possibilities for positive developments in the future.

A few excerpts:

I’m proud of the students from Notre Dame who stood up for their faith and their school. I hope that ND can pull things together, and that maybe the silver lining in all of this will be a renewed motivation and energy to do so. It definitely sounds like there are people there who can be great leaders.

. . . just not Jenkins and some of his cronies.

 

[Havard]

Wait for his term to be up? Like they did for McBrien?

Is the Congregation of the Holy Cross a religious congregation, or is it a corporation in which its “employees” are protected by a union labor contract?

I think you are barking up the wrong tree, Father McBrien isn’t a Holy Cross priest.

 

[Lepanto]

I think you are barking up the wrong tree, Father McBrien isn’t a Holy Cross priest.

Correct. I didn’t say that he is. But he’s been working at ND with other like-minded dissident priests for years, and ND apparently keeps renewing his contract.

Same tree. Different branch.

 

[Rach620]

Lepanto,

Honestly, the situation at ND is incredibly complex. If you are unaffiliated with and unfamiliar with the history and all of the issues in the many debates which have been going on and continue to go on there, then having this discussion is just going to get a little difficult. But I’ll try.

We mustn’t be driven by sentimentality (I’m not saying that you are), but I’d like to see some facts and figures. Here’s a good one: how many of the thousands within the ND student body enter the seminary or convent each year?

Many of the facts and figures have been played out on this very forum before.

• Notre Dame’s campus is home to the Basilica of the Sacred Heart, some 26 residence halls (each with their own chapel), and most other campus buildings (Law School, Coleman-Morse Center, Malloy Hall, to name a few) house a chapel. Mass is said at least once daily during the school year in each of these chapels.
• Confessions are heard twice daily in the Basilica of the Sacred Heart, before Mass. There is always a line for Confession in the Basilica! Additionally, CSC priests live in the residence halls and are available to hear confessions at any time. Most schedule availability for Confession at least an hour or so a week inside the dorm.
• Old College is the Congregation’s undergraduate seminary, and houses several undergraduate men in formation for priesthood in the CSC (not sure what the exact count is, but it is far from languishing!). I personally know several other men who committed to their home dioceses either before or after graduation. One recent alum I know is entering the Cistercians. Some women are considering the consecrated religious life, especially with the Nashville Dominicans (and their new ‘branch’ in Michigan). Many more (like my husband and myself!) have followed their vocation to the Sacrament of Matrimony!
• On the topic of vocations at ND: Each year, several men enter the transitional diaconate (Fall), and several others are ordained (Spring). I believe the CSC ordained three new priests at Notre Dame the week after Easter, and perhaps six deacons last fall. Those numbers could be higher, though!
• The Theology and Philosophy Departments are thriving, even though they are losing a number of solid teaching faculty due to retirement (Ralph McInerny, Alasdair MacIntyre, etc.). A theology major myself, I went to the seniors’ celebration yesterday, which Bishop D’Arcy annually attends and addresses. He told us yesterday that he firmly believes that Notre Dame’s theology department is one of the best in the country for its depth and breadth and commitment of students and faculty. I am not at all one to disagree.
• The Center for Ethics and Culture, led by Professor David Solomon, is a great intellectual resource for students and faculty, and puts on a great Fall conference every year. The topics have ranged from “The Culture of Life” to “The Family” to “Pope Benedict XVI & The Dialogue of Cultures”. It was through many of their sponsored events that I was introduced to the Catholic intellectual life.
• The groups which signed on to the ND Response coalition are a good place to start when searching out signs of hope among the students–I know a number of underclassmen involved in these organizations and trust their leadership moving forward.
• 10% of Notre Dame’s senior class committed to a full year of service following graduation; 80% participated in service work during their undergraduate years.

I think that Tom Monaghan was right. Most American “Catholic” universities are beyond hope. Time to start from scratch, as at Ave Maria University.

Respectfully, I just can’t agree with this perspective. Yes, Ave Maria and others (TAC, Steubenville, Christendom) are all great colleges, but as of yet, none of them approaches the academic level of Notre Dame. These are all mostly liberal arts colleges, and besides Steubenville I don’t believe any of them has a true College of Science (much less Engineering, Law, or strong graduate programs). If we want to train Catholic scholars to go out into the world and be able to compete at the same level as secular academics–so that they can then go teach alongside them and truly dialogue with the larger culture–there is currently no better Catholic University to start than at Notre Dame.

Nice talk, but Fr. Miscamble’s speech from a protest rally hardly is representative of ND. Unfortunately, he is not the official voice of ND.

No, he is not. But he’s not quite yet a voice crying out in the wilderness. There is quite a bit of tension over these issues at Notre Dame, and Fr. Miscamble’s is a respected voice in the community here. I don’t think very cautious optimism is uncalled-for in the ND situation…

 

[Rach620]

Correct. I didn’t say that he is. But he’s been working at ND with other like-minded dissident priests for years, and ND apparently keeps renewing his contract.

Same tree. Different branch.

I believe Fr. McBrien is tenured. None too easy to get rid of…

And honestly, the man rarely-if-ever teaches. I was heading to the Theology majors’ graduation brunch when I flipped on Fox News Sunday to see that he wasn’t himself preparing to celebrate with the students…but was soaking up the limelight.

Prof. Cavadini, CURRENT Theology Department Chair, is solid and has done so much for the Department.

 

[Lepanto]

JReducation pointed out in another thread that the Church does not claim authority over such joint ventures, which are common among ‘Catholic’ universities and hospitals.

Oh, but the Church does claim such authority.

Read this excerpt from John Paul II’s Ex Corde Ecclesia (paragraph 27):

“Every Catholic University, without ceasing to be a University, has a relationship to the Church that is essential to its institutional identity. As such, it participates most directly in the life of the local Church in which it is situated; at the same time, because it is an academic institution and therefore a part of the international community of scholarship and inquiry, each institution participates in and contributes to the life and the mission of the universal Church, assuming consequently a special bond with the Holy See by reason of the service to unity which it is called to render to the whole Church. One consequence of its essential relationship to the Church is that the institutional fidelity of the University to the Christian message includes a recognition of and adherence to the teaching authority of the Church in matters of faith and morals. Catholic members of the university community are also called to a personal fidelity to the Church with all that this implies.”

 

[Havard]

Correct. I didn’t say that he is. But he’s been working at ND with other like-minded dissident priests for years, and ND apparently keeps renewing his contract.

Same tree. Different branch.

Let’s be clear. ND isn’t a Catholic authority, and has no say regarding disciplinary actions against priests. The C.S.C. does, and the Archbishop of Hartford does. In the case of Father McBrien, the relevant authority is the Archbishop of Hartford, not the C.S.C.

 

[Lepanto]

I believe Fr. McBrien is tenured. None too easy to get rid of…

Professors get tenured after so many contract renewals.

 

[Rach620]

Professors get tenured after so many contract renewals.

Having known a professor who went through the tenure process recently, I must say that it’s a little more complicated than that.

But at any rate–Fr. McBrien IS NOT the face of the ND Theology Department. He’s not even close to being the face of ND. He is neither a presence on camps nor a force on the faculty; all that he did (or didn’t do) as Chair of the Theology Department has been undone–in a very positive way–by his successor.

Next topic?

 

[pismopal]

Prove to me that I am a Catholic…54% of people who call themselves Catholic voted for an enthusiastic and instrumental abortion supporter for POTUS. Many were so proud of it that they put on bumper stickers so everyone showing up at mass would know about it.
Maybe I am just a dinosaur but one of the biggest reasons for my conversion was the strong anti abortion stance that I THOUGHT the Church had taken. I know I am not alone in my disappointment and that keeps me going.

 

[Havard]

Oh, but the Church does claim such authority.

Read this excerpt from John Paul II’s Ex Corde Ecclesia (paragraph 27):

“Every Catholic University, without ceasing to be a University, has a relationship to the Church that is essential to its institutional identity. As such, it participates most directly in the life of the local Church in which it is situated; at the same time, because it is an academic institution and therefore a part of the international community of scholarship and inquiry, each institution participates in and contributes to the life and the mission of the universal Church, assuming consequently a special bond with the Holy See by reason of the service to unity which it is called to render to the whole Church. One consequence of its essential relationship to the Church is that the institutional fidelity of the University to the Christian message includes a recognition of and adherence to the teaching authority of the Church in matters of faith and morals. Catholic members of the university community are also called to a personal fidelity to the Church with all that this implies.”

Ex Corde provides bishops the power to define ‘Catholic’ universities as Catholic (or not). But it does not provide bishops with the authority to intervene in the running of said universities.

 

[Havard]

Having known a professor who went through the tenure process recently, I must say that it’s a little more complicated than that.

But at any rate–Fr. McBrien IS NOT the face of the ND Theology Department. He’s not even close to being the face of ND. He is neither a presence on camps nor a force on the faculty; all that he did (or didn’t do) as Chair of the Theology Department has been undone–in a very positive way–by his successor.

Next topic?

I am very glad to hear that, Rach620. Are you an ND student or grad yourself?