Raping The Catholic Church:colorado Jumps On The Bandwagon

[bellesjoy]

Shoshana:

Satan only attacks anything that is a threat to himself…he is totally narcissistic. Thus, in conclusion, Holy Mother Church is and always will be the biggest threat as we adore Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament and revere His Immaculate Mother. And he hates both. The Jews are God’s chosen people and He will take care of them Himself. Thus, of course, Satan hates them also.

Our priests are our greatest gift. As Father John Corapi has said…no priest, no Jesus. So, ultimately they are the target big time. We have been blessed with it all…and Satan knows that. Let us pray for our priests that they may persevere. Fr corapi has said that it is so lonely to be a priest. If a priest is seen with a woman, he is having an affair. If a priest is seen with another man, well, he must be homosexual. And if seen with a child…I need not continue!

It will get worse before it gets better…are we ready for the battle?

Thank you for very good advice from Fr. Corapi. We had better to ready, because I agree it will get worse before it gets better.

I oppose the idea that we are all guilty in this abuse scandal…all Catholics, all Bishops, all priests. But Satan surely had a hand in the lives of those who did the abuses or protected those who did. Pray for them and their victims.

We are called under penalty of sins to point out to our sisters or brothers when they are themselves or putting others in jepardy. You can’t do that if you don’t know it is occuring.

God will judge us each by the sins we have comitted, confessed and repenteded, or by our lack of repentence.

 

[Penny_Plain]

CathChemNerd:

But there seems to be a determined drive in this country by some (not all) to employ the scandal as a reaosn to punish and possibly even destroy the Church. It is the selected targeting of the Church (rather than other institutions which are as culpable or more) that is the original poster’s point.

The actions of the church were wrong … but the church should not be punished?

I see your point ChemNerd (great name, by the way). But what it reminds me of is a group of first-graders who did wrong, one got caught and punished, and he argues unfairness because the others who also did what he did didn’t get punished, too.

Yes, the Colorado legislation seems to single us out. But the reason that our church is in a position to plead the statute of limitations as a defense is because it covered up the crimes in the first place.

Shoshana, should we pray for the victims, too?

 

[Shoshana]

Penny Plain:

.

Shoshana, should we pray for the victims, too?

Absoluetely!!! and primarily. Fr Benedict Groeschel at his conference has said the same thing. He also said not to forget them. Most lose their faith over the abuse.

This may make you happy to hear that Satan has his hand on any sexual abuse situation! And usually the perpetrator was abused himself. Sad story all the way around. We have a situation here of a molestor (not a priest) and the grin on his face is certainly satanic! Send shivers up and down the spine…we also have a priest here in our diocese who was brought to justice and has been defrocked…

 

[Nohome]

Shoshana:

As Father John Corapi has said…no priest, no Jesus.

Sorry that this is off topic, but this quote really grabbed me, maybe because it is taken out of context. Anyhow, I’ve never see such a contradiction to scripture attributed to a priest in my entire life.

No home

 

[Nohome]

Siena:

I want one thing to be remembered, regardless of current handling of these situations, AT THE TIME much of the abuse happened, and priests were moved around, THE PSYCOLOGISTS AGREED that sexual abusers could be treated and CURED.

I want one other thing remembered. Child abuse was against the law AT THE TIME the abuse happened. Every applicable law against child abuse was already on the books way before the 1950’s. Frankly, I can forgive the abuse, it’s the response that is unforgivable.

Yes, protestant institutions have had abusers. Did they cover it up?

Nohome

 

[TPJCatholic]

Nohome,

Contradition?

Hmmm…

So Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood, you have no life in you; he who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day.For my flesh is food indeed, and my blood is drink indeed. He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him. As the living Father sent me, and I live because of the Father, so he who eats me will live because of me. [John 6:53-57]

 

[TPJCatholic]

Nohome,

*“The issue of child sexual molestation is deserving of serious scholarship. Too often, assumptions have been made that this problem is worse in the Catholic clergy than in other sectors of society. This report does not support this conclusion. Indeed, it shows that family members are the most likely to sexually molest a child. It also shows that the incidence of the sexual abuse of a minor is slightly higher among the Protestant clergy than among the Catholic clergy, and that it is significantly higher among public school teachers than among ministers and priests.” *

catholicleague.org/research/abuse_in_social_context.htm

 

[bones_IV]

Shoshana:

Hi TPj, long time no hear! Hi bones!

Satan only attacks anything that is a threat to himself…he is totally narcissistic. Thus, in conclusion, Holy Mother Church is and always will be the biggest threat as we adore Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament and revere His Immaculate Mother. And he hates both. The Jews are God’s chosen people and He will take care of them Himself. Thus, of course, Satan hates them also.

Our priests are our greatest gift. As Father John Corapi has said…no priest, no Jesus. So, ultimately they are the target big time. We have been blessed with it all…and Satan knows that. Let us pray for our priests that they may persevere. Fr corapi has said that it is so lonely to be a priest. If a priest is seen with a woman, he is having an affair. If a priest is seen with another man, well, he must be homosexual. And if seen with a child…I need not continue!

It will get worse before it gets better…are we ready for the battle?

“Are we already in the battle”? The answer is yes. What exactly does narcisstic mean? Not familiar with the term. I’ve seen it used so many times but don’t know what it means.

 

[Penny_Plain]

*“The issue of child sexual molestation is deserving of serious scholarship. Too often, assumptions have been made that this problem is worse in the Catholic clergy than in other sectors of society. This report does not support this conclusion. Indeed, it shows that family members are the most likely to sexually molest a child. It also shows that the incidence of the sexual abuse of a minor is slightly higher among the Protestant clergy than among the Catholic clergy, and that it is significantly higher among public school teachers than among ministers and priests.” *

Mooooommmmmmmmm!!!

He did it too!!!

 

[TPJCatholic]

Penny,

Did I ever say that what the Priests did was right? I was responding to “Nohome’s” post.

It is easy to see that you have great anger in you about this matter, and that is a well placed anger because our kids are precious. Yet, please do not let your anger get in the way of properly responding to posts. I join you in your frustration over the abuse cases…yet let none of us act as if sin is something only Catholic Priests commit.

 

[CathChemNerd]

Penny Plain:

The actions of the church were wrong … but the church should not be punished?

I see your point ChemNerd (great name, by the way). But what it reminds me of is a group of first-graders who did wrong, one got caught and punished, and he argues unfairness because the others who also did what he did didn’t get punished, too.

Yes, the Colorado legislation seems to single us out. But the reason that our church is in a position to plead the statute of limitations as a defense is because it covered up the crimes in the first place.

Shoshana, should we pray for the victims, too?

Hello again Penny;
I appreciate your analogy but it seems flawed. It is one thing to be punished as an institution, but is another thing to use the punishment to further a different agenda. My point is that, given the frequency of molestation by groups that are not targeted by the legislation (as compared to Catholic clergy), it seems that the object of the law may not be its purported purpose of defending and protecting children. Also, we of the Church have no desire to see other people punished simply b/c we are (like your 1st grade analogy).

If your argument about the statute of limitations is true, then we should look at expanding the statute of limitations for all who commit child molestation. But to have a law on the books that de facto says, “You must report child abuse within x years, unless the abuser is a Catholic priest, then it’s 10x or 20x years…” is patently unjust.

Finally, I must say that the bishops have absolutely no control as to whether a victim or his family reports abuse to the police. To say that the bishops employ total control this way is somewhat simplistic. Again, I say this not in any way to mitigate the circumstances.

Pax,
CathChemNerd

 

[Nohome]

bones_IV:

What exactly does narcisstic mean? Not familiar with the term. I’ve seen it used so many times but don’t know what it means.

It means being overly preoccupied with yourself.

It comes from the myth of Narcissus. A nymph loved Narcissus, but she could never get his attention. He was riveted to the water’s edge, staring at his reflection in the water.

 

[CathChemNerd]

Penny Plain:

Mooooommmmmmmmm!!!

He did it too!!!

Please, Penny, we’re trying to engage in meaningful dialogue. The tone’s a little disrespectful.

Pax,
CathChemNerd

 

[Penny_Plain]

TPJCatholic:

Yet, please do not let your anger get in the way of properly responding to posts. I join you in your frustration over the abuse cases…yet let none of us act as if sin is something only Catholic Priests commit.

Who? Me?

I have never said that. Never believed it. Never thought it.

But if we set our Church up as the instrument of Christ on earth, then shouldn’t we expect people to hold us to the highest possible standard?

 

[TPJCatholic]

penny,

Yes, I agree.

Yet, let us not ever forget that 96-97% of our Priests are out there performing the tasks of their vocation in the midst of a satanic feeding frenzy. People who hate the Church are completely geared-up to tear down the Church and they will try to “sue” it into oblivion. Of course that won’t happen, yet we must try to protect the kids and the innocent clergy who are being attacked at levels that have never been seen in history. While they have not been killed or physically attacked, their jobs are unspeakably lonely and hard and the attacks will not stop anytime soon.

Without Priests, we have no sacraments, we become lost in the sea.

This is the worse time in history for the Church, imo, and I really do think we have entered endtimes.

 

[Penny_Plain]

CathChemNerd:

Please, Penny, we’re trying to engage in meaningful dialogue. The tone’s a little disrespectful.

God forbid.

See if this is sufficiently respectful:

I find the Catholic League’s argument here to be ultimately unpersuasive. In essence, the League argues that the Church is not the only institution that has facilitated or allowed the sexual abuse of unconsenting minors. What the League does not say (but invites the reader to infer) is that this somehow diminishes the Church’s guilt if other institutions such as the public schools are not held equally accountable.

Leaving aside the League’s questionable statistics, the suggestion that “scholarship” is required to quantify the Church’s guilt in relation to the guilt of other entities is laughable. To suggest that church employees have molested fewer children than family members is, although arguably true, entirely irrelevant to the question of the church’s responsibilty for the actions of the religious who molested innocent children and the religious who systematically covered up their actions from church members and law enforcement officials, thereby freeing the molestors to continue harming the innocent.

The type of “context” the League is attempting to bring to this discussion is nothing more than attempt to dilute the guilt of the Church by suggesting that others are equally guilty of molesting other children.

 

[TPJCatholic]

Penny,

The League is not trying to ta away from the Church;rather, they are pointing a clear double standard. It is fine to bring attention to the known abuses in the Church, yet where is the outrage over the abuses that have gone unchecked in families, in schools and in other faiths for decades? It does not diminish the Church’s sins, it simply says “let’s be faith” and watch out for kids everywhere.

Again, it is easy for people to say “oh that Catholic Church sure is sick,” while they do not bother to look into their own homes, schools and Churches.

If “Catholic” kids are worthy of protection, aren’t ALL kids?

The League is simply pointing out the gross hypocrisy.

 

[CathChemNerd]

Penny Plain:

The type of “context” the League is attempting to bring to this discussion is nothing more than attempt to dilute the guilt of the Church by suggesting that others are equally guilty of molesting other children.

Much more pleasant, thanks. I think this may have to be a case where we agree to disagree. I don’t think that the League’s statements are an attempt to “spread the guilt” around as you do, but I understand your position. I’m heading home from work now, but maybe we’ll cross paths again on the boards.

Pax,
CathChemNerd

 

[bones_IV]

Penny Plain:

God forbid.

See if this is sufficiently respectful:

I find the Catholic League’s argument here to be ultimately unpersuasive. In essence, the League argues that the Church is not the only institution that has facilitated or allowed the sexual abuse of unconsenting minors. What the League does not say (but invites the reader to infer) is that this somehow diminishes the Church’s guilt if other institutions such as the public schools are not held equally accountable.

League “invites the reader to infer” is that this somethow diminishes the Church’s guilt if other institution such as the the public schools are not help equally accountable? In what way? Documentation.
Penny Plain:

Leaving aside the League’s questionable statistics, the suggestion that “scholarship” is required to quantify the Church’s guilt in relation to the guilt of other entities is laughable. To suggest that church employees have molested fewer children than family members is, although arguably true, entirely irrelevant to the question of the church’s responsibilty for the actions of the religious who molested innocent children and the religious who systematically covered up their actions from church members and law enforcement officials, thereby freeing the molestors to continue harming the innocent.

Don’t see the connection. Gonna have to do better than that Penny. To suggest that Church employees have molested fewer children than family member is, although arguably true, is entirely irrevelavant to the question of the Church’s responsibility is sophistry.
Penny Plain:

The type of “context” the League is attempting to bring to this discussion is nothing more than attempt to dilute the guilt of the Church by suggesting that others are equally guilty of molesting other children.

How are they diluting the guilt of the Church? You say the league tries to dilute it but you don’t say why.

 

[Nohome]

TPJCatholic:

Without Priests, we have no sacraments, we become lost in the sea.

I disagree. Jesus says I am with you always, to the end of the age.” Matt 28:20 He does not qualify that we need priests.

TPJCatholic:

This is the worse time in history for the Church, imo, and I really do think we have entered endtimes.

I don’t know if this is the end times, but there are MANY worse times in the history of the Church.

Nohome