Redemptorist says "ghetto" piety sidelining social justice

[Matt25]

cathnews.com/news/509/159.php

Fr Bruce Duncan, who coordinates social justice studies at Melbourne’s Yarra Theological Union, has said that a renewed stress on older forms of piety is reflecting “a deepening cleavage within the Catholic community over the place of social justice in the ministry of the Church”. Online Catholics reports today that despite the Church’s long and solid record of commitment to social justice, many Catholics are unaware of the Church’s social justice tradition.

Catholic bishops have been releasing statements on issues of social and economic concern since the 1940s, most recently for Social Justice Sunday last weekend… "In recent years, more conservative groups have wanted to down-play social justice in the mission of the Church, as if it were a distraction from authentic Christian living, or at least a very secondary aspect.

"Instead we see a very heavy stress on older forms of piety or devotionalism or mass displays of Catholic numbers. This seems to reflect a return to the old ghetto strategy, of circling the wagons in a hostile world, combined with a heavy stress on Church authority…“This cleavage is reflected at many levels of the Church, and even in Rome. Debate revolves around the interpretation of [the Second Vatican Council’s Pastoral Constitution on] The Church in the Modern World and the social encyclicals, which are generally ignored or down-played by the conservative wings, except for the morals of sexuality and family life,” Fr Duncan asserts.

SOURCE
Teaching social justice (Online Catholics 28/9/05)

 

[JOHNYJ]

I don’t get it,sorry.What is ghetto piety?
.Basic social justice of course !

 

[Arba_Sicula]

JOHNYJ:

I don’t get it,sorry.What is ghetto piety?
.Basic social justice of course !

No, no. Just as the post above said, it’s the old-style devotionalism - the old ladies saying the Rosary during Mass sort of stuff. That looking inward takes away from the Church’s traditional social justice that is part of looking outward.

 

[fix]

I think the author, in a back-handed way, has stated an important thing. There is a divide and I hope it grows. The emphasis on social work by the far left, not authentic charity like Mother Theresa would have us do, but secular social work with a down playing of the moral law is too common today.

I hope we see a reform of all this.

Authentic Catholic devotions and a return to personal holiness will usher in a new era of authentic Catholic works of mercy in place of left wing social work.

 

[CarolAnnSFO]

What fix said ^^^^^.

Now, in terms of the actual corporal works of mercy, there’s no reason they can’t co-exist with the spiritual works of mercy. So there is a place in our world for those elderly ladies praying the Rosary.

**Crazy Internet Junkies Society
**Carrier of the Angelic Sparkles Sprinkle Bag

 

[Jerome42]

fix:

I think the author, in a back-handed way, has stated an important thing. There is a divide and I hope it grows. The emphasis on social work by the far left, not authentic charity like Mother Theresa would have us do, but secular social work with a down playing of the moral law is too common today.

I hope we see a reform of all this.

Authentic Catholic devotions and a return to personal holiness will usher in a new era of authentic Catholic works of mercy in place of left wing social work.

I’m so glad you recognize the REAL PROBLEM. The far left has convinced many a Catholic that the liberals’ so-called concern for the poor and underpriveleged is a far greater good for humanity. At the same time we are asked to overlook their sinful support for abortion, euthanasia, homosexual unions and other numerous attacks on the sanctity of marriage.

 

[fix]

Jerome42:

I’m so glad you recognize the REAL PROBLEM. The far left has convinced many a Catholic that the liberals’ so-called concern for the poor and underpriveleged is a far greater good for humanity. At the same time we are asked to overlook their sinful support for abortion, euthanasia, homosexual unions and other numerous attacks on the sanctity of marriage.

I live it each week at my parish. Social Justice, as some define it, is almost the new god. No one is saying we have no need to help each other, but helping each other is necessary, but not sufficient.

These radicals want us to believe “helping” the poor is the only message from the Gospel. The social Gospel is well known by this generation, yet the rest of the Gospel is minimized or rejected.

 

[Matt25]

fix:

I live it each week at my parish. Social Justice, as some define it, is almost the new god. No one is saying we have no need to help each other, but helping each other is necessary, but not sufficient.

These radicals want us to believe “helping” the poor is the only message from the Gospel. The social Gospel is well known by this generation, yet the rest of the Gospel is minimized or rejected.

Notice the original posting mentions- “the social encyclicals, which are generally ignored or down-played by the conservative wings, except for the morals of sexuality and family life,” a point you are reinforcing if you assume that the Social Encyclicals are ignoring the Gospel or a form of left wing social work.

What Social Encyclicals are being referred too? Well try Sollicitudo rei socialis vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/encyclicals/documents/hf_jp-ii_enc_30121987_sollicitudo-rei-socialis_en.html

which says inter alia

Unfortunately, from the economic point of view, the developing countries are much more numerous than the developed ones; the multitudes of human beings who lack the goods and services offered by development are much more numerous than those who possess them.

We are therefore faced with a serious problem of unequal distribution of the means of subsistence originally meant for everybody, and thus also an unequal distribution of the benefits deriving from them. And this happens not through the fault of the needy people, and even less through a sort of inevitability dependent on natural conditions or circumstances as a whole…

Therefore political leaders, and citizens of rich countries considered as individuals, especially if they are Christians, have the moral obligation, according to the degree of each one’s responsibility, to take into consideration, in personal decisions and decisions of government, this relationship of universality, this interdependence which exists between their conduct and the poverty and underdevelopment of so many millions of people. Pope Paul’s Encyclical translates more succinctly the moral obligation as the “duty of solidarity”; and this affirmation, even though many situations have changed in the world, has the same force and validity today as when it was written.

On the other hand, without departing from the lines of this moral vision, the originality of the Encyclical also consists in the basic insight that the very concept of development, if considered in the perspective of universal interdependence, changes notably. True development cannot consist in the simple accumulation of wealth and in the greater availability of goods and services, if this is gained at the expense of the development of the masses, and without due consideration for the social, cultural and spiritual dimensions of the human being.

 

[koda]

Matt25:

Notice the original posting mentions- “the social encyclicals, which are generally ignored or down-played by the conservative wings, except for the morals of sexuality and family life,” a point you are reinforcing if you assume that the Social Encyclicals are ignoring the Gospel or a form of left wing social work.

I find that too many Christians (including Catholics) spend a lot ot time and energy condemning the behaviour of others when this time and energy could be much better spent working to better the existence of those with the least. The arguments against homosexuality, whether or not your neighbor is worthy to receive Communion, sex before marriage, etc… all have their place. But that place should not usurp the cold hard fact that people (including women and children) are dyring while we bicker over smaller potatos. IMO you can’t be pro-life and ignore the poverty that exists in ours, the richest country in the world, let alone that in 3rd world countries. Jesus emphasized that we are to take care of the least of us, do works of mercy and compassion and love our enemies. It’s great to work against abortion, but we can’t forget those children, born and unborn, that die everyday from war, malnutrition and preventable disesase. Someone in an earlier post mentioned Mother Theresa. She was taking care of these people, not beratting them for getting sick in the first place.
When Jesus looks at us he doesn’t see a political party or a nationality (so it’s no use waving the flag at him), he sees people he loves. We’ve all got to do a better job of seeing each other that way too.

 

[Matt25]

Mother Teresa of Calcutta and Servant of God Oscar Romero represent different aspects of what JPII called the Churches Preferential Love for the Poor. This is not a misreading of the Gospel. It is the Gospel.

How can it be that even today there are still people dying of hunger? Condemned to illiteracy? Lacking the most basic medical care? Without a roof over their heads? . . . Christians must learn to make their act of faith in Christ by discerning His voice in the cry for help that rises from this world of poverty.

Pope John Paul II
Novo Millennio Ineunte, no. 5

The US Bishops Statement A Place at the Table usccb.org/bishops/table.shtml#2

puts it like this

With our Church under challenge, our nation confronted by terror, and our world haunted by conflict, why focus on issues of poverty and human dignity at this time?

• Our faith calls us to it. The Gospel and Catholic social teaching place our service of the poor and vulnerable and our work for justice at the center of Christian witness.
• Our nation needs it. A sixth of our children are growing up poor in the richest nation on earth. The blessings and burdens of American life are not being shared fairly.
• Our world requires it. More than 30,000 children die every day from hunger, deprivation, and their consequences. Disease and debt, corruption and conflict are threatening the lives and dignity of millions in our increasingly globalized world.
• Our salvation demands it. In Jesus’ description of the Last Judgment, the critical question is “What did you do for the least of these?” Jesus identified himself with the hungry, the thirsty, the naked, the imprisoned, and the stranger, insisting that when we serve them we serve him.
• Our actions can make a difference. In the face of these challenges, our community of faith must continue to preach the Gospel and pursue the Church’s evangelizing and social mission. We can help shape a world where the lives and dignity of all people are respected and protected.

In his hometown synagogue in Nazareth, Jesus outlined his mission and ours: “The Spirit of the Lord is upon me . . . he has anointed me to bring glad tidings to the poor. He has sent me to proclaim liberty to captives and recovery of sight to the blind, to let the oppressed go free.” In these challenging times, this mission of Jesus is our way forward and our urgent task.

 

[Della]

America is the most generous country in the world and Catholics give millions of dollars and thousands of hours of their time and talent for many good causes helping the poor. And these people haven’t seen any need to give up their interior spiritual life to do it, either.

As for rich countries giving to poor ones, billions are given every year and yet they remain poor because their governments rob their people of the money and things meant for their poor.

And finally, everyone thinks that Americans have lots of ready cash to spend on whatever they please all the time. That’s simply not the case. We certainly could and should live within our means, but most of us have our “wealth” tied up in our houses and our weekly paychecks and in pension funds and insurance.

The whole issue is much too complex for anyone to get on his high horse and condemn ordinary, hard-working, generous Americans. Frankly, I’m tired of hearing from the LWW, especially heterodox Catholics, that Americans are thoughtless scrooges who only think of themselves. It’s just not true.

 

[Matt25]

Della:

America is the most generous country in the world and Catholics give millions of dollars and thousands of hours of their time and talent for many good causes helping the poor. And these people haven’t seen any need to give up their interior spiritual life to do it, either.

Frankly, I’m tired of hearing from the LWW, especially heterodox Catholics, that Americans are thoughtless scrooges who only think of themselves. It’s just not true.

9 He also told this parable to some who trusted in themselves that they were righteous and regarded others with contempt:
10 "Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. ***
11*** The Pharisee, standing by himself, was praying thus, "God, I thank you that I am not like other people: thieves, rogues, adulterers, or even like this tax collector. ***
12*** I fast twice a week; I give a tenth of all my income.’ ***
13*** But the tax collector, standing far off, would not even look up to heaven, but was beating his breast and saying, “God, be merciful to me, a sinner!’ ***
14*** I tell you, this man went down to his home justified rather than the other; for all who exalt themselves will be humbled, but all who humble themselves will be exalted.”

Luke 18

Catechism of the Catholic Church-

2406 Political authority has the right and duty to regulate the legitimate exercise of the right to ownership for the sake of the common good.

     **II. Respect for Persons and Their Goods**

2407 In economic matters, respect for human dignity requires the practice of the virtue of temperance, so as to moderate attachment to this world’s goods; the practice of the virtue of justice, to preserve our neighbor’s rights and render him what is his due; and the practice of solidarity, in accordance with the golden rule and in keeping with the generosity of the Lord, who “though he was rich, yet for your sake . . . became poor so that by his poverty, you might become rich.”

     **Respect for the goods of others **

2408 The seventh commandment forbids theft, that is, usurping another’s property against the reasonable will of the owner. There is no theft if consent can be presumed or if refusal is contrary to reason and the universal destination of goods. This is the case in obvious and urgent necessity when the only way to provide for immediate, essential needs (food, shelter, clothing . . .) is to put at one’s disposal and use the property of others.

 

[Nohome]

Della:

America is the most generous country in the world and Catholics give millions of dollars and thousands of hours of their time and talent for many good causes helping the poor.

An interesting article that says just this:

philanthropy

A uniquely American respect for success lies at the heart of American philanthropy. It allows for wealth to be accumulated without excessive criticism and suspicion, while at the same time placing a moral obligation on the shoulders of the wealthy to reinvest in their society. This American approach to wealth is deeply ingrained in our culture. Even those who do not consider themselves “religious” have absorbed these values.

Nohome

 

[Matt25]

The Holy Father John Paul II said this in his lenten message 2003 vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/messages/lent/documents/hf_jp-ii_mes_20030206_lent-2003_en.html

Exploitation of others, indifference towards the suffering of our brothers and sisters, and the violation of basic rules of morality are just a few fruits of the thirst for gain. Faced with the tragic situation of persistent poverty which afflicts so many people in our world, how can we fail to see that the quest for profit at any cost and the lack of effective, responsible concern for the common good have concentrated immense resources in the hands of a few while the rest of humanity suffers in poverty and neglect?

    Appealing to believers and to all people of good will, I would like to reaffirm a principle which is self-evident yet often ignored: our goal should not be the benefit of a privileged few, but rather the improvement of the living conditions of all. Only on this foundation can we build that international order truly marked by justice and solidarity which is the hope of everyone.

Also he said-

“If the present situation can be attributed to difficulties of various kinds, it is not out of place to speak of “structures of sin,” which. . . are rooted in personal sin and thus always linked to the concrete acts of individuals who introduce these structures, consolidate them, and make them difficult to remove. And thus they grow stronger, spread, and become the source of other sins, and so influence people’s behavior. “Sin” and “structures of sin” are categories which are seldom applied to the situation of the contemporary world. However, one cannot easily gain a profound understanding of the reality that confronts us unless we give a name to the root of the evils which afflict us.” (Pope John Paul II, Sollicitudo Rei Socialis, 36).

 

[koda]

Della:

America is the most generous country in the world and Catholics give millions of dollars and thousands of hours of their time and talent for many good causes helping the poor. And these people haven’t seen any need to give up their interior spiritual life to do it, either.

As for rich countries giving to poor ones, billions are given every year and yet they remain poor because their governments rob their people of the money and things meant for their poor.

And finally, everyone thinks that Americans have lots of ready cash to spend on whatever they please all the time. That’s simply not the case. We certainly could and should live within our means, but most of us have our “wealth” tied up in our houses and our weekly paychecks and in pension funds and insurance.

The whole issue is much too complex for anyone to get on his high horse and condemn ordinary, hard-working, generous Americans. Frankly, I’m tired of hearing from the LWW, especially heterodox Catholics, that Americans are thoughtless scrooges who only think of themselves. It’s just not true.

It is indeed complex, but that is no reason to forget about it. Corrupt government does add a complication but it is not an impossible one to overcome. As for the poor in this country, there are plenty of opportunities to help. Nor does help have to be financial. Time is important. Volunteer. Donate old clothes, dishes, etc… The link below goes to a story on a new study on how many California families are below the poverty level. The problem I have with Republicans is that they are the ones who (generally speaking) consistently resist efforts to raise the minimum wage, cut medical and education programs that the poor depend on, protest labor reform, and give tax cuts and breaks to incredibly wealthy and multi-national corporations. It’s like the robber baron era all over again. IMO, none of these things in an example of Christian behaviour. If we all do a little, we can make a big difference.

NBC 4 Los Angeles

 

[MiddleBear]

cathnews.com/news/509/159.php

Fr Bruce Duncan, who coordinates social justice studies at Melbourne’s Yarra Theological Union, has said that a renewed stress on older forms of piety is reflecting “a deepening cleavage within the Catholic community over the place of social justice in the ministry of the Church”. Online Catholics reports today that despite the Church’s long and solid record of commitment to social justice, many Catholics are unaware of the Church’s social justice tradition.

Catholic bishops have been releasing statements on issues of social and economic concern since the 1940s, most recently for Social Justice Sunday last weekend… "In recent years, more conservative groups have wanted to down-play social justice in the mission of the Church, as if it were a distraction from authentic Christian living, or at least a very secondary aspect.

"Instead we see a very heavy stress on older forms of piety or devotionalism or mass displays of Catholic numbers. This seems to reflect a return to the old ghetto strategy, of circling the wagons in a hostile world, combined with a heavy stress on Church authority…“This cleavage is reflected at many levels of the Church, and even in Rome. Debate revolves around the interpretation of [the Second Vatican Council’s Pastoral Constitution on] The Church in the Modern World and the social encyclicals, which are generally ignored or down-played by the conservative wings, except for the morals of sexuality and family life,” Fr Duncan asserts.

SOURCE
Teaching social justice (Online Catholics 28/9/05)

This article is a good example of the use of leftist rhetoric and line of argument.

Basically the Catholic left (self-styled progressive Catholics) and who are actually influenced by materialists philosophies (defacto Marxists) typically write in a similar manner as this author does. The tactical style is to deride the supernatural realm, (as the modernist heretics do). Set up false dichotomies (as this writer does). Result is to generally mislead many souls in the process.

Another tactic used by the left in debate is to attack their enemies (attack against the person, rather than against the argument) by employing name calling or other mocking terms (such as in this case, use of the term “ghetto piety”… whatever “ghetto piety” it certainly is unpleasant sounding).

Realize that these are symptoms of the mindset and tactics used by their idol, the leftist John Dewey, American “educator” and “philosopher”, known for American pragmatism and positivism, and also known as a saboteur of the US educational system in the 20th century. But a hero of the NEA.

Remedy,

Don’t be fooled by these false prophets.

Pray the rosary each day.

Pray before the Blessed Sacrament.

Make the First Friday Devotions to The Sacred Heart in reparation for all the sacrileges and blasphemies against Jesus.

 

[Matt25]

MiddleBear:

T. The tactical style is to deride the supernatural realm, (as the modernist heretics do).

In what way does the posted article deride the supernatural realm?

How does loving our neighbour as ourself detract from loving the Lord our God with all our heart, all our mind and all our strength?

Was Paul VI remiss in his spiritual duties when he wrote-
“If someone who has the riches of this world sees his brother in need and closes his heart to him, how does the love of God abide in him?” (1 Jn 3:17). It is well known how strong were the words used by the Fathers of the Church to describe the proper attitude of persons who possess anything towards persons in need. To quote Saint Ambrose: “You are not making a gift of your possessions to the poor person. You are handing over to him what is his. For what has been given in common for the use of all, you have arrogated to yourself. The world is given to all, and not only to the rich.”
On the Development of Peoples, #23

And Vatican II when they said-

Therefore everyone has the right to possess a sufficient amount of the earth’s goods for themselves and their family. This has been the opinion of the Fathers and Doctors of the church, who taught that people are bound to come to the aid of the poor and to do so not merely out of their superfluous goods. Persons in extreme necessity are entitled to take what they need from the riches of others.

Faced with a world today where so many people are suffering from want, the council asks individuals and governments to remember the saying of the Fathers: “Feed the people dying of hunger, because if you do not feed them you are killing them,” and it urges them according to their ability to share and dispose of their goods to help others, above all by giving them aid which will enable them to help and develop themselves.

The Church in the Modern World, #69
[/indent]​

 

[fix]

Matt25:

Notice the original posting mentions- “the social encyclicals, which are generally ignored or down-played by the conservative wings, except for the morals of sexuality and family life,” a point you are reinforcing if you assume that the Social Encyclicals are ignoring the Gospel or a form of left wing social work.

What Social Encyclicals are being referred too? Well try Sollicitudo rei socialis vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/encyclicals/documents/hf_jp-ii_enc_30121987_sollicitudo-rei-socialis_en.html

which says inter alia

No one is ignoring any encyclical, unless we start talking about HV which is routinely rejected.

 

[fix]

MiddleBear:

This article is a good example of the use of leftist rhetoric and line of argument.

Yes, that is very accurate. The idea is to claim personal holiness is not needed and secular social work is the new savior.

Again, no one is denying we must help the poor, but while that is necessary it is not sufficient.

 

[marvin]

Matt,

I think you need to read this,:newadvent.org/library/docs_df84lt.htm