Report: "Massachusetts Town Legalizes Polygamy Using Same Arguments For Gay Marriage,"

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Guest1 said:
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Freddy:
So now it’s evil as well?
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Why would a person who believes in catholicism not believe so?
The only reasons you mentioned earlier were stds and unwanted pregnancy. So my partner is past child bearing age and we don’t have stds. If we’re not married then how does having sex in tbe privacy of our own bedroom affect society?
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Do you want an answer from the Christian perspective or from a nihilist point of view/opinion?
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I’m an atheist. I want a practical answer. How does having sex with my partner in our bedroom when there is no std risk and no pregnancy risk affect society?
 
Freddy said:
I’m an atheist. I want a practical answer. How does having sex with my partner in our bedroom when there is no std risk and no pregnancy risk affect society?
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I’m a former Atheist. If I went back to Atheism I’d be a nihilist. Morals such as ones concerning sex would just be as something like the opinion of what the best flavor of ice cream is. Just down to human opinion and also evolution. Which wouldn’t hold much value to me. We’d be just stardust and have no Intrinsic value.

Not probably a popular opinion amongst the Atheist community but I’m not one to follow the crowd.

And I’m not saying I’d become what society views as a moral monster. I’d just have to be honest with myself of how I see the world.
 
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mdgspencer said:
“Polygamy was the obvious evolution of redefining marriage. After all, every argument supporting gay marriage—“Love is love,” "we deserve equal protection under the law” and “we’re not harming anybody—also supports group marriage.
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How is polygamy a redefinition of marriage? Some of the oldest marriages in the Bible are polygamous marriages such as Jacob’s marriage to Rachel or Solomon’s hundreds of marriages. And polygamy is practiced in many countries around the world, especially countries with a majority Muslim population. Mormons also practiced polygamy here in the US.
 
Guest1 said:
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Freddy:
I’m an atheist. I want a practical answer. How does having sex with my partner in our bedroom when there is no std risk and no pregnancy risk affect society?
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I’m a former Atheist. If I went back to Atheism I’d be a nihilist. Morals such as ones concerning sex would just be as something like the opinion of what the best flavor of ice cream is. Just down to human opinion and also evolution. Which wouldn’t hold much value to me. We’d be just stardust and have no Intrinsic value.

Not probably a popular opinion amongst the Atheist community but I’m not one to follow the crowd.

And I’m not saying I’d become what society views as a moral monster. I’d just have to be honest with myself of how I see the world.
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OK. So you have no answer. I wish you’d have said so at the outset so I needn’t have wasted my time. It beats me why people make claims without the slightest intention of backing them up.
 
Freddy said:
OK. So you have no answer.
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Not really. It’s just that for me from a Nihilist point of view/moral relativism regarding something being wrong or not I would not condemn an act as being wrong or not. It would just be my opinion. Doesn’t make it true.

From a spiritual sense as in the Catholic point of view yes. Then we’re talking about how God made sex and rules regarding the act.
 
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Dan123 said:
If you can’t understand the difference between consenting adult relationships and pedophilia you may not be ready to discuss adult topics in a meaningful manner.
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There will be scope to debate the meaning of “adult” for various purposes.
 
Freddy said:
So what harm would breaking the rules be in the situation I gave you?
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From the catholic perspective?

Your question is good and deserves a long answer from someone such as Jimmy Akin 🙂. It’s not so easy to simply answer how sin has harmed and currently harms the world in text. Including that one in particular you mentioned. (Consider the issue of sin and accountability for example. Purgatory ect)

Jesus died for the sins of mankind for their salvation. So that harm has already taken place. It shows the severity of any sin.
 
Guest1 said:
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Freddy:
So what harm would breaking the rules be in the situation I gave you?
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From the catholic perspective?
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If harm is done to society then it doesn’t matter if it’s from a Catholic perspective or a Jewish perspective or an atheist perspective.

Here’s some cards. Let me put them on the table. If you want to say that sleeping around on a regular basis might well end up in you getting an std, then I’d agree with you. If you want to say it might end up in an unwanted pregnancy, then I’d agree with you. And there may well be a couple of other negatives with which we might get a conditional agreement.

But me having sex with the woman with whom I’m sharing a life has no bearing on anyone at all except us. Whether we are married or not. So to make a blanket statement that 'sex outside marriage is wrong because it harms society is nonsensical. But it seems that in conversations such as these, it’s all or nothing. And people will talk around it until the cows come home. There is never an acceptance that there are obviously exceptions to the rule.

At which point, when there is no point at which both sides can agree, the conversation ends. So unless you’d like to accept that exceptions occur…we’re done.
 
Freddy said:
If harm is done to society then it doesn’t matter if it’s from a Catholic perspective or a Jewish perspective or an atheist perspective.
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Those perspectives don’t intrinsically matter when it comes to morality unless there really is a mind above the human mind (God) that tells us certain actions are wrong and affect us/society.

If Catholicism is true then there are ramifications when it comes certain actions (Sins). including spiritual.

If you’re talking to a muslim or orthodox jew and the person is talking to you about how eating pork is wrong they’re speaking from their belief that their faith is correct.

As such when I speak and say fornication is a sin/is evil I’m speaking from my religious belief.
But me having sex with the woman with whom I’m sharing a life has no bearing on anyone at all except us. Whether we are married or not.
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You’re speaking from what you believe is true I assume. Like how I speak about fornication. If there is a God it of course it matters if it’s fornication or not.
 
Guest1 said:
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Freddy:
If harm is done to society then it doesn’t matter if it’s from a Catholic perspective or a Jewish perspective or an atheist perspective.
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Those perspectives don’t intrinsically matter when it comes to morality unless there really is a mind above the human mind (God) that tells us certain actions are wrong and affect us/society.

If Catholicism is true then there are ramifications when it comes certain actions (Sins). including spiritual.

If you’re talking to a muslim or orthodox jew and the person is talking to you about how eating pork is wrong they’re speaking from their belief that their faith is correct.

As such when I speak and say fornication is a sin/is evil I’m speaking from my religious belief.
But me having sex with the woman with whom I’m sharing a life has no bearing on anyone at all except us. Whether we are married or not.
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You’re speaking from what you believe is true I assume. Like how I speak about fornication. If there is a God it of course it matters if it’s fornication or not.
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We’re done. You have no answer.
 
Freddy said:
We’re done. You have no answer.
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I gave answers but it probably isn’t good enough for you: If there is no God morals and the value of human beings are down to opinions. Why is fornication wrong or any action if there is no God? Why does caring about human beings matter?
Hence I’d be a nihilist if I was an Atheist again. Thank you for the conversation. 👋 🌻

 
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Freddy And Guest1: you were discussing the social consequences of extramarital sex. Guest1 raised it. Freddy asked for them to be enumerated in his case, that of someone in a relationship between two people who are not ‘sleeping around’. For some reason, Guest, you keep just saying ‘it’s wrong, that’s what I believe’. But you said there were social consequences. Are there?

Oh and by the way, if you don’t believe in God you can get together with others in your society and decide what right and wrong is. And you can go along with the consensus.
 
I’ve decided that a certain poster here is doing a very good job wasting my time. Since time is given to me from God, and I don’t know how much I’ve got, I won’t be replying to his arguments. I think he is not coming from the faith perspective and I wonder why he spends so much time here.
 
27lw said:
I’ve decided that a certain poster here is doing a very good job wasting my time. Since time is given to me from God, and I don’t know how much I’ve got, I won’t be replying to his arguments. I think he is not coming from the faith perspective and I wonder why he spends so much time here.
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You should ask him. Or perhaps her.
 
Freddy said:
How does having sex with my partner in our bedroom when there is no std risk and no pregnancy risk affect society?
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Poor Freddy. He just won’t give up his quest that everyone be allowed to do whatever they want with any member of their body to any available orifice of another body (or their own, I guess). Perhaps he draws a line limiting that other body to a human body. We don’t know and can’t know because Fred’s only principle apparently is if it feels good then we have a moral right to do it.

If your partner is not your lawful married mate of the opposite sex then please get back into the closet. And even if your partner is your lawful married mate of the opposite sex, please close the bedroom door.
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