Romney stands by message in secret video

  • Thread starter Thread starter oldcelt
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Ringil you are in this area so maybe have perspective. If you look at the causes for poverty in this country, most are self induced: unwed motherhood, not completing high school, substance abuse. How do we provide incentive to avoid these roads to nowhere rather than pay those who are already a long way down the path? I think so much of this has become part of the culture. By the time you get to the third or fourth generation, it’s so ingrained that people don’t see any other path.

Volunteering in various social services organizations I saw this all of the time. It’s as if people caught in this mentality simply don’t imagine any other way to live. You can talk to them all you want about getting a GED, getting off drugs, not having another baby and their eyes glaze over. We have to get to them a lot earlier I guess.

But getting back to the thread, I truly believe that the focus on government solutions for individual problems just makes these problems worse. The ‘War on Poverty’ isn’t working.
Lisa
I get the pleasure of seeing some of these same people from the legal side…through civil rights complaints or removal of children or criminal charges. All of them have the exact same attitude…“it’s someone elses fault” attitude. The only ones that I ever saw get anywhere took responsibility and realized that if they wanted things to change, they would have to take the actions to change them.
 
John your convenient clip turned around the meaning of his statement. In saying he “didnt worry about them” it was with respect to getting their votes. IOW why try to appeal to people who will not vote for you anyway? Focus on those who are currently undecided and ask them to choose between a big government approach or an opportunity approach.

Of course the Left is trying to twist the meaning to make Romney look like Thurston Howell III but we aren’t all that stupid.

Lisa
What about the I’ll never convince them line?..that’s the killer. I suppose he meant that in only the most positive light…
Some of us aren’t that stupid.

John
 
John your convenient clip turned around the meaning of his statement. In saying he “didnt worry about them” it was with respect to getting their votes. IOW why try to appeal to people who will not vote for you anyway? Focus on those who are currently undecided and ask them to choose between a big government approach or an opportunity approach.

Of course the Left is trying to twist the meaning to make Romney look like Thurston Howell III but we aren’t all that stupid.

Lisa
In this scenario, President Obama is obviously Gilligan. 🙂
 
What about the I’ll never convince them line?..that’s the killer. I suppose he meant that in only the most positive light…
Some of us aren’t that stupid.

John
And, the rest are Democrats who will never be convinced because they are. 🤷
 
What about the I’ll never convince them line?..that’s the killer. I suppose he meant that in only the most positive light…
Some of us aren’t that stupid.

John
I think he meant it as an honest statement. Guess what John, there is NOTHING Barack Obama could say that would convince me to vote for him. Me and millions of my fellow travelers. Just as Romney is correct in saying that he is not going to convince the person who believes in government control and solutions to vote for him. It’s not meant as a negative or positive, it is simply a statement of fact. He is a businessman and has a businessman’s attitude. Don’t waste time and money chasing leprechauns.

Why do you think the truth is so negative? This doesn’t need to be spun. Romney spoke the truth. I realize that is a shocking idea, that a politician occasionally tells the truth. You know when Obama said “spread the wealth around” or “clinging to guns and God…” or “I think redistribution is a concept that I can agree with.”

LIsa
 
I think he meant it as an honest statement. Guess what John, there is NOTHING Barack Obama could say that would convince me to vote for him. Me and millions of my fellow travelers. Just as Romney is correct in saying that he is not going to convince the person who believes in government control and solutions to vote for him. It’s not meant as a negative or positive, it is simply a statement of fact. He is a businessman and has a businessman’s attitude. Don’t waste time and money chasing leprechauns.

Why do you think the truth is so negative? This doesn’t need to be spun. Romney spoke the truth. I realize that is a shocking idea, that a politician occasionally tells the truth. You know when Obama said “spread the wealth around” or “clinging to guns and God…” or “I think redistribution is a concept that I can agree with.”

LIsa
Exactly. 👍
 
I’ve asked my boss (the one who gave me 10-1 odds on an election bet), if he was looking to double down, since his confidence has been built back up. No response yet. 😃
 
No, he said, "My job is not to worry about those people …]’ll never convince them they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives.”

He wrote off nearly 1/2 of the American people, including legitimate SS recipients who have paid into the system all their lives. He stepped in it in a major way.

John
Wishful thinking on your part.😉
 
Unlike federal income taxes where you pay in all your life and get nothing back,
How about protection from direct aggression by a foreign country? 🙂

Republicans want to spend another $2 trillion on that. Do we get maximum bang for the buck is the question.
 
I got the context just right. A government does have the responsibility to ensure that the basic human needs of its citizens are being met. Basic civics, not to mention, morality.
The real difference is that the conservative would argue that the responsibility belongs to state, county and local governments as they are closer and more accountable to the people. This is the Catholic social justice principle of subsidiarity.

The liberals and establishment types would see that “government” means an all-powerful federal government who issues edicts from on high regardless of whether or not those policies would be beneficial to its citizens.

That people should have some level of safety net and basic necessities is something with which I can agree, and I’m about as conservative as it comes. It used to be that neighbors, churches, and towns pulled together to assist the members of their community. For the past 60-70 years, every time the Federal Government comes in to “help” people they wind up displacing many of those smaller organizations and private initiatives which did good work for their fellow man.

I know that American ingenuity and resourcefulness would unleash creative strategies to provide for the less fortunate and assuage many social ills if the Federal government would keep it’s hands out of everyone’s pockets and out of their lives.
 
How about protection from direct aggression by a foreign country? 🙂

Republicans want to spend another $2 trillion on that. Do we get maximum bang for the buck is the question.
Oh come on ProVobis, even you can see the holes in that argument. When you pay federal income taxes you get nothing back as in a check written to you. Nor do you get more by paying in more. I remember telling my boss who was writing a check for $750,000 that he got exactly the same benefits as the person paying nothing in FIT. He was not amused.

In contrast when paying in Social Security and Medicare Tax (it is not a PAYROLL tax that is paid by the employer) you are paying into a system in expectation of getting a future benefit. In addition although it limits out, those who pay more into the SS system are presumed to get more benefits when they retire.

But of course the Left would like to obfuscate because it doesn’t play into their usual baloney about the upper income folks not paying their ‘fair share.’

Lisa
 
One of the biggest societal problems we have, even though no one wants to talk about it, is what happens when the baby boomers retire and no one is willing to get off their duffs and take their place in the workforce, particularly in the less glamorous jobs. I have no idea what will happen then.
Did you forget all the 401k’s and the IRA’s out there, ready to get taxed?

Romney himself is holding over $100 million in an IRA account. How he got it that high with the existing rules of maximum contribution per year is anyone’s guess but he (or his heirs) is/are on the hook for the taxes owed on that. And they will be all treated as ordinary income when he collects it. I believe inheritance tax also applies. So it behooves him (or someone else) to lower the tax rates on the highest end before he reaches 70 if not before. Just saying.
 
I disagree. I think the problem is **we **have **created **a welfare society where any and all behavior is acceptable. Look at the statistics of children born out of wedlock to poor black women since Lyndon Johnson’s Great Society. What was meant to be a good idea didn’t work and has morphed into an out of control bloated mess.

I get it that welfare is no fun. But I see some people lowering their standard of living so the “subsidy” becomes the sole source of income.

I see people complaining that food stamps don’t cover the cost of groceries. Food stamps are a subsidy, meant to help out.

These people do no service to the truly needy
Which people do you see “lowering their standard of living so the ‘subsidy’ becomes the sole source of income”? This sounds like one of the stereotypes about poor people, particularly Blacks, that were prevalent in the late 1960’s and 1970’s. I’m not sure to what extent it took place then, but is it really happening nowadays? I think people who qualify for food stamps ARE the truly needy in the vast majority of cases.
 
Did you forget all the 401k’s and the IRA’s out there, ready to get taxed?

Romney himself is holding over $100 million in an IRA account. How he got it that high with the existing rules of maximum contribution per year is anyone’s guess but he (or his heirs) is/are on the hook for the taxes owed on that. And they will be all treated as ordinary income when he collects it. I believe inheritance tax also applies. So it behooves him (or someone else) to lower the tax rates on the highest end before he reaches 70 if not before. Just saying.
Yes it makes perfect sense to me…give up a $30,000,000 a year job, spend millions of your own money, spend years living in hotels and buses, have your family insulted and abused…all in the quest to be President for the sole reason of changing the tax laws to reduce rates and save a few mil. Now why didn’t I think of that?

Come on ProVobis…do you really think Romney is going through all of this so he can influence tax rates? He could do that as a private citizen for a lot less time and effort.
Lisa
 
I agree with Rush on this. I am certain that this was the “October surprise”. It was released early because internals looking bad for the President.
I said the same thing. Middle East problems and whatnot, and this is the best they have on Romney? Even if it was damaging, it seems way to early. We still have 3 debates, plus the Ryden debate.
 
Which people do you see “lowering their standard of living so the ‘subsidy’ becomes the sole source of income”? This sounds like one of the stereotypes about poor people, particularly Blacks, that were prevalent in the late 1960’s and 1970’s. I’m not sure to what extent it took place then, but is it really happening nowadays?** I think people who qualify for food stamps ARE the truly needy in the vast majority of cases.**
And you think this because? The standards have been relaxed. We’re seeing ads trying to convince people to sign up for food stamps…as if there aren’t enough already. I heard 16% of Americans are on food stamps… 48 million people. If that many people ARE truly needy it’s because Obama has helped to destroy economic growth and opportunities.

The way to get people off of these programs is to offer them an opportunity to succeed not just print and borrow more.

Lisa
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top