R
ralphinal
Guest
Paisan!
- Status
J
jakasaki
Guest
If what you say is true, this symbol of the Crucifix has been around for decades and centuries and it did not “offend”.
And here we are in the 21st century and it’s all of the sudden “offending”.
As time goes by instead of mankind getting better it’s getting worse. This “woman” was money hungry and she went after that.
Just like that one muslim woman who got a job as a cocktail waitress somewhere and she had to wear this red dress as part of the “cocktail uniform”.
Oh heck… she filled a law suit against the owners because the dress was too revealing on the bust line.
And that one muslim chef had to prepare a breakfast for some event and he had to cook bacon. Gee, lets see, he also filled a law suit because his religion forbids pork products.
BS - the koran states nothing about “handling/cooking” pork products for others, it clearly states for muslim NOT to EAT PORK.
J
jakasaki
Guest
Good one! I’ll have to remember that Ralph.You could argue that since it was Romans that put him up there, it is part of the history of Italy and has a place in history rooms
K
Kaninchen
Guest
It’s enough to start reaching for the “Lega Nord (per l’Indipendenza della Padania)” membership forms.
A
abucs
Guest
This is somewhat similar to the Christmas nativity scenes being removed from our local shopping centres.
It was led by the secular humanists who thought it might offend the Muslims. Trouble was though, you couldn’t find a muslim who was offended by it.
It seems if one person complains then the mechanism is there to change the culture of an entire country depending on the majority philosophical views expressed by a vote of only 7 judges, who are unelected anyway.
There’s something obviously very undemocratic about that process.
It was led by the secular humanists who thought it might offend the Muslims. Trouble was though, you couldn’t find a muslim who was offended by it.
It seems if one person complains then the mechanism is there to change the culture of an entire country depending on the majority philosophical views expressed by a vote of only 7 judges, who are unelected anyway.
There’s something obviously very undemocratic about that process.
J
josie_L
Guest
Go right ahead!
S
swariffin
Guest
The most important thing, I believe, is having the crucifix sign in our heart. Well, the Italians are human too, and they have their right to choose what to believe too. Just take a referendum among the ITALIANS, and see what the majority would say.
A
abucs
Guest
I agree Swariffin. A referendum would be much more democratic. the problem seems to be that it is the interpreting of an existing European law.
If an Italain referendum allows crucifixes in the Italian public schools, then new laws will have to be written, passed and implemented in the Italian parliament and then again in a European setting. This takes lots of time, politics, money and determination.
There is always the possibility of someone in one area of Europe (perhaps a hairdresser in Scotland) complaining that the new Italian Law (from the referendum) clashes with the European law which should take precedence.
I guess each country needs a mechanism so that a European Law that largely no one voted for, can’t dominate over the Parliamentay laws of individual countries. (Perhaps an individul naions referendum should always take precedence).
That would seem a sensible way to proceed.
K
Kaninchen
Guest
Perhaps the most sensible way for Europeans to proceed would be to await the result of an experiment in the United States where the Supreme Court is abolished and everything is handed over to the States themselves.
Then we’d see what the problems would be and could plan accordingly.
S
swariffin
Guest
Well, why would the European law have something to do with the Italians? Up to today, the country of Italy, the UK, France, Germany, Belgium, Luxemburg etc are still exist individually, politically. There is no large single country called the European Union, anyway.
J
jakasaki
Guest
**Italian minister responds to European court: ‘We will not remove crucifixes from the classroom’ **
THURSDAY, NOVEMBER 5, 2009
Italian minister responds to European court: ‘We will not remove crucifixes from the classroom’
southafricancatholic.blogspot…-european.html
Posting credit from CAF recent postings site:
THURSDAY, NOVEMBER 5, 2009
Italian minister responds to European court: ‘We will not remove crucifixes from the classroom’
southafricancatholic.blogspot…-european.html
Posting credit from CAF recent postings site:
K
Kaninchen
Guest
The EU has nothing to do whatsoever with this decision.
It’s not that difficult to look up the European Court of Human Rights and the European Convention on Human Rights, then you’d know why it has to do with Italy and other European Countries (many of which are not in the EU).
L
latin_rite
Guest
And what about the rights of those parents or students who do want to sit in a classroom with a cross in it? What makes your rights more important than theirs?
btw.I like the bit where you said that americans should stick to america and europeans should stick to europe. Since europeans like to stick their noses into everyones business.
I wonder if you will think that way when atheistism truly takes over europe again, and they start fighting each other once more?
G
GKC
Guest
The United States is a single national entity (we debated that question a few years back, dressed in blue and gray). In what sense is Europe analogous to a single national entity, and the European Court of Human Rights analogous to the US Supreme Court, which I take as your meaning?
In the final analysis, I assume that Italy could (theoretically, tell the Court to take a hike, at the risk of explusion from the Council of Europe).
GKC
W
wwolverine
Guest
Oh, only because Italy is a secular country its ok to demand? What if Italy was a dictatorship country than it was ok to have crosses in the school and no one would say a word?
I believe maybe thats the reason no one say anything in muslim countries because they are not secular,
J
josie_L
Guest
Most Muslim countries don’t even afford basic human rights to the “kafirs” let alone their own people.Oh, only because Italy is a secular country its ok to demand? What if Italy was a dictatorship country than it was ok to have crosses in the school and no one would say a word?
I believe maybe thats the reason no one say anything in muslim countries because they are not secular,
A
abucs
Guest
Hi Swarriffin,
Many European countries have signed an agreement to respect the decisions of this court. It is a way or harmonising European laws and adherring to a common set of principles. Countries can always pull out of these agreements but there will be international pressure to stay in. For example, as time goes on such decisions relating to European economic business rights come to be observed by all countries and if one country decides to not recognise this court then they may be punished by a withdrawal of investment from other European countries as they will feel their ‘rights’ may not be adherred to.
It’s a tricky thing.
Y
Yellow_Belle
Guest
“Oh, that God the gift would give us
To see ourselves as others see us”
Y
Yellow_Belle
Guest
Darn, missed that one 
Must have been in the Dail bar:shrug:
Must have been in the Dail bar:shrug:- Status