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wabrams
Guest
Still true today. The Japanese have no where near the number of problems the American cars have.
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MooCowSteph
Guest
I haven’t seen any mention of German cars. I know they can be more expensive to fix, but Mercedes last forever, esp. the deisels. I also love WV, although I’ve never owned one. I think their wagons are adorable! and they have good safety ratings.
BTW, I was just checking out some ratings on safecar.gov, and they even have crash photos of the specific models. Pretty neat!
(P.S. Isn’t is funny how strongly people feel about their brand of vehicles?)
BTW, I was just checking out some ratings on safecar.gov, and they even have crash photos of the specific models. Pretty neat!
(P.S. Isn’t is funny how strongly people feel about their brand of vehicles?)
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Princess_Abby
Guest
What’s funny is that I sooooooooo don’t care what it looks like, etc. I would love it if God could send me an email saying, “Buy this car! It will keep you the safest for what might happen in the next few years, AND you can afford it AND it’s reliable!”
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2shelbys
Guest
That may be true of Ford and GM who have had issues of late but again, if you look at initial quality and frequency of repair the vehicles being turned out by Chrysler, Jeep, and Dodge match or exceed anything coming from Japan.
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2shelbys
Guest
Very true. German cars from Volkswagon up to Mercedes are excellent choices if you can afford them. I would love to have a BMW M3.
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wabrams
Guest
And it’s true for Chrysler as well. I know becuase I’m constantly getting recall notices on mine.
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LSK
Guest
I have to tell you, I bought a PT Cruiser in 2002. It’s a standard transmission and doesn’t have a lot of bells and whistles…it gets 26 miles to the gallon on regular gas, has tons of room and chugs along like a little work horse. plus it looks cool. and it was affordable.
Just a thought…
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Princess_Abby
Guest
The only American car we would probably consider would be Jeep or possibly Chrysler.
Dodge and I have a long, frustrating history together.
Ford is not something I even waste my breath on, given other “fantastic” personal experience.
Dodge and I have a long, frustrating history together.
Ford is not something I even waste my breath on, given other “fantastic” personal experience.
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2shelbys
Guest
Recalls are not necessarily genuine problems so much as minor issues required by the government. I can not remember what year it was but it was around 1998 or 1999 that Honda had more recalls than Daimlerchrysler and GM put together.
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2shelbys
Guest
Dodge definitely had some issues in the past but every vehicle that has been introduced since the merge with Daimler-Benz has been an awesome improvement. Even the older ones have benefitted. My wife has a Neon with about 50,000 miles on it and it has been perfect.
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Princess_Abby
Guest
Well, maybe the newer ones are worth having.
I had a '97 Dodge Neon through some of college and grad school. I bought it for 8500, despite the protests of my father to go with a Pontiac Grand Am. However, I was too concerned about “cuteness” and paid little attention. I ended up putting a total of 13k in it with one disaster after another and gave it away to a junk yard for $100 a few years later. Never again!
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2shelbys
Guest
The Grand AM is a pretty good car. The early Neons like that did have some issues. How on earth did it manage to eat up $13K? A neon did not even cost that much new.
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Benedictus
Guest
Every car should be just about perfect at 50k.
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paramedicgirl
Guest
Larger vehicles do seem to fare better in accidents than smaller vehicles.
In my experience attending at MVA’s (motor vehicle accidents), the most dangerous place in the vehicle is right in front of the steering wheel. The steering wheel is the most lethal object in the car in a front end collision, **but if you wear your seatbelt ** you can escape severe injury because you will be protected from impacting the dashboard, windshield and steering wheel. If a seatbelt is properly worn, there is a higher likelihood that the only injuries accident victims sustain may be the deceleration forces of the vehicle. Of course, there are exceptions, but for the most part, the air bag going off in your face will be your biggest complaint if you are properly restrained.
In a lateral impact collision (hit from the side) seatbelts are less useful, and can trap you in your seat in the path of an oncoming car. That is why the safest place for children to ride is in the middle of the back seat; never place a child behind the driver.
Children must always be restrained in vehicle, so please, parents, if you don’t routinely buckle up your children, start doing so! Children, because of their high centre of mass (head larger proportionately) are likely to exit by the up and over route on impact and almost always go head first.
There are 3 separate impacts in a car crash; 1, when the car comes to an abrupt stop in the collision, 2, when the vehicle occupants, (who were also travelling at the same speed as the car) collide with part of the vehicle’s structure, such as the steering wheel, windshield or dashboard, and 3, when the person’s internal organs are hurled against the bodily structures as the body decelerates (the brain gets thrown back and forth in the skull; the heart & lungs collide violently with the chest wall)
Each of the above 3 impacts that a patient suffers in a car crash involve the transfer of kinetic energy and each can be life threatening. The good news is that cars are being made a lot safer these days, with the vehicle being engineered to absorp a lot of the energy in an impact.
So Princess_Abby, by all means research vehicle safety. There is nothing more precious than your family.
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MooCowSteph
Guest
Is that because you are more likely to have a side imfact accident from the left than from the right?
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paramedicgirl
Guest
Most impacts occur on the driver’s side of the vehicle (head on collisions, especially). By the way head- ons make up 70% of all collisions.
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BLB_Oregon
Guest
Unless you’re able to score on an end-of-the-model-year deal that lets the dealer eat the cost of depreciation, that’s the way to go. Still, we found that shopping during the last week of February did it for us. We got loads off the asking price on a new car because we found a dealer that happened to need to sell another one to make their quota and get their incentive kick-back from the manufacturer. (And 0% financing. What’s not to like about that?)
Consumer Reports is a great resource, and not just because of their customer-satisfaction survey that gives you a tip-off as to what problems a given vehicle might be expected to give you. (Toyotas eat mufflers, for instance… which last I checked, never stranded anyone on the freeway.) They also will point you towards references at your library that summarize the local selling prices for given models during the last quarter. Yes! The real selling prices, not just what you see in the want ads!
Be sure to run each vehicle you are considering past your insurance agent. Insurance costs never go away, even when the car is bought and paid for.
Oh, and don’t wait until you need a new car. Then they have you over a barrel. In fact, take some time to study books on how to buy a car. When we went shopping, my husband was the “good buyer” and I was the “bad buyer.” The sales rep and the “manager” they keep going off to talk to during the “dealing” phase will surely be playing the same little game. I have heard that sometimes they even eavesdrop on what the buyers are saying in those little one-table sales isolation rooms, so you have to keep the act up. There is an art to it. It is like being dropped into a Persian bazaar.
If we didn’t need 4WD, by the way, I’d get another Toyota Corolla in a heartbeat. (It used to be identical to the Chevy Nova, if you care… and both manufactured in the USA, for tax reasons.) My husband drove his first one for 10 years after buying it used, I drove one for 10 years until someone rear-ended me and totalled it, and we drove another one for 10-12 years until we needed something bigger. They’re good in terms of safety, and they just keep going.
PS on safety: The most important piece of safety equipment in an automobile is the driver. If you’re going to obsess about airbags and frame construction–which is fine–don’t forget to put your own driving habits under the microscope, too! There is no better way to save lives and keep your insurance costs down. Besides, careless driving can be very hard on the paint!
Oh, and if kids will be riding with you soon, it is never too early to start re-learning your in-car dialog aimed at other drivers, either. “Oooo! That man just cut us off! That is so upsetting. *That is not safe!”
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cargopilot
Guest
You might consider renting a car for the weekend rate of a car you are considering. That allows you to have more time than just a test drive with a salesman breathing down your neck. While it would cost you more for such an extended test drive, but considering the cost of a new car, it might just be worth the expense.
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adara
Guest
Just wanted to put in my vote for Saturns as well. Everyone I know who has one gives it high marks.
Regarding booster seats and other safety stuff for kids: ratings that talk about age of children are often referring to the strength of their bones (growth plates, etc.) and other body-related things that correlate much more to age than height and weight do. Please don’t assume that just because (for example) your 8-year-old is the SIZE of a 12-year-old that he/she can withstand the same FORCES.
A little OT but important to know. Good luck with the shopping and whatever vehicle you choose.
Regarding booster seats and other safety stuff for kids: ratings that talk about age of children are often referring to the strength of their bones (growth plates, etc.) and other body-related things that correlate much more to age than height and weight do. Please don’t assume that just because (for example) your 8-year-old is the SIZE of a 12-year-old that he/she can withstand the same FORCES.
A little OT but important to know. Good luck with the shopping and whatever vehicle you choose.
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manualman
Guest
Funny, isn’t it? Cars raise more emotion in discussion than just about anything except God and politics! And there are probably just about as many myths, stereotypes and misconceptions too.
First, a disclaimer of my own. Philospohically, I am sympathetic to the domestic makers. I’m an American and I’d like to spend my money on products that support my local economy. Many ‘import’ manufacturers do assemble cars here. Some even build most of the parts here. But on average, it IS true that the traditional US makes use more American parts and create more American jobs than do the ‘import’ brands. ON AVERAGE. But it varies widely by individual car!
Consumer Reports has sabotaged their reputation by basing recommendations on a skewed sample. For YEARS they have proclaimed Toyota the absolute best. MANY subscribers own them as a result. But CR ONLY sends quality surveys to subscribers. Anybody here ever take a statistics class? That’s a recipe for a self-fulfilling prophecy!
While not perfect, I prefer JD Power evaluations because they have an adequate budget to use truly random survey samples. They too rate Toyota and Honda at/near the top in initial and 5 year reliability, but the difference between them and some domestics (particularly Buick and Chevy IIRC) is not very significant! JD also notes that domestic brands have shown SIGNIFICANTLY higher reliability than Euro brands in the 5 year category.
My own driveway contains a Honda Odyssey and a VW Jetta at the moment. Funny, in light of the above, eh?
The Odyssey is assembled in the USA of 70% US made parts, including the engine. Ironically, the transmission is the only major system fully made in Japan and it is the MOST troublesome component on these vans. I frequent an Odyssey forum often and these trannies are dying left and right. Same thing with the Acura TL and RL V6. For the minivan category, I recommend the Toyota Sienna or Grand Caravan 3.8 V6. Both are quite reliable (use the proper Dodge trans fluid!) and safe. I won’t recommend the Odyssey until Honda proves they have the trans design fixed.
For smaller cars, The Matrix/Vibe are reliable, but IMO have terrible blind spots from the drivers position. Again, IMO that is a WORSE safety problem than lacking some airbag somewhere. The new Chevy Cobalt with optional side airbags scored at the TOP of the small car crash tests. These cars use the extremely well built and fairly efficient Ecotec 4 cylinder engine. A very good budget buy. You can get a new one with an extended 100k warranty for much less than a similar Civic or Corrolla with base warranty! Avoid VW unless you have a large trust fund and an extra car in the driveway. My 02 Jetta is a wonderful drive - when it works. At 50k it has needed 2 window regulators, 4 ignition coils, an engine computer, cruise control repairs, an exhaust mount… that I can remember offhand. Probably more. (I got it because it was the only powerful sedan available at that time that offered stick shift and was within my budget)
Midsize sedans. Toyota Camry or Buick LaCrosse. Dont’ pre-judge the Buick before you try it. You might be surprised. This revamped and renamed Regal was rated very highly even by Consumer Reports! The brand new Chevy Impala is similar, but I’d be wary of new model teething pains.
SUV’s. SUV’s are MUCH more susceptible to roll-over than cars and minivans. They kill their occupants in crashes more often than cars. Don’t let their mass fool you. Instability due to high center of gravity is a safety defect inherent in these beasties. Car based unibody SUV’s like the CRV, RAV4, Vue, Equinox, Escape, Pilot and Highlander are more stable than real truck SUV’s, but still not as stable as cars and minivans.
A word about depreciation. Beware some common statistics. Many depreciation rate calculations are sloppily done. They take the average used price and divide by original MSRP to determine resale ratings. Cars that commonly sold at MSRP (like my Odyssey and 95 Saturn) did great on these types of calcs. Cars that had big rebates do awful. But that figure means nothing. Consider this: Joe buys a 2002 Odyssey new and pays $30,000 when the MSRP was $29,000 (this really happened a lot). He sells in 2005 and gets $23,000. According to some, it retained 79% of original value. fred bought a Malibu for $15,000 which had MSRP of $18,500. He sells his at the same time and only gets $11,000. A rotten 59%. But in reality, it is 77% versus 73%. Not really such a big deal, is it?
If you want it to last, maintain it. Keep the fluids and filters changed. Check out weird sounds sooner than later. Read the manual. This makes much more difference in longevity than the nameplate on the front!
First, a disclaimer of my own. Philospohically, I am sympathetic to the domestic makers. I’m an American and I’d like to spend my money on products that support my local economy. Many ‘import’ manufacturers do assemble cars here. Some even build most of the parts here. But on average, it IS true that the traditional US makes use more American parts and create more American jobs than do the ‘import’ brands. ON AVERAGE. But it varies widely by individual car!
Consumer Reports has sabotaged their reputation by basing recommendations on a skewed sample. For YEARS they have proclaimed Toyota the absolute best. MANY subscribers own them as a result. But CR ONLY sends quality surveys to subscribers. Anybody here ever take a statistics class? That’s a recipe for a self-fulfilling prophecy!
While not perfect, I prefer JD Power evaluations because they have an adequate budget to use truly random survey samples. They too rate Toyota and Honda at/near the top in initial and 5 year reliability, but the difference between them and some domestics (particularly Buick and Chevy IIRC) is not very significant! JD also notes that domestic brands have shown SIGNIFICANTLY higher reliability than Euro brands in the 5 year category.
My own driveway contains a Honda Odyssey and a VW Jetta at the moment. Funny, in light of the above, eh?
The Odyssey is assembled in the USA of 70% US made parts, including the engine. Ironically, the transmission is the only major system fully made in Japan and it is the MOST troublesome component on these vans. I frequent an Odyssey forum often and these trannies are dying left and right. Same thing with the Acura TL and RL V6. For the minivan category, I recommend the Toyota Sienna or Grand Caravan 3.8 V6. Both are quite reliable (use the proper Dodge trans fluid!) and safe. I won’t recommend the Odyssey until Honda proves they have the trans design fixed.
For smaller cars, The Matrix/Vibe are reliable, but IMO have terrible blind spots from the drivers position. Again, IMO that is a WORSE safety problem than lacking some airbag somewhere. The new Chevy Cobalt with optional side airbags scored at the TOP of the small car crash tests. These cars use the extremely well built and fairly efficient Ecotec 4 cylinder engine. A very good budget buy. You can get a new one with an extended 100k warranty for much less than a similar Civic or Corrolla with base warranty! Avoid VW unless you have a large trust fund and an extra car in the driveway. My 02 Jetta is a wonderful drive - when it works. At 50k it has needed 2 window regulators, 4 ignition coils, an engine computer, cruise control repairs, an exhaust mount… that I can remember offhand. Probably more. (I got it because it was the only powerful sedan available at that time that offered stick shift and was within my budget)
Midsize sedans. Toyota Camry or Buick LaCrosse. Dont’ pre-judge the Buick before you try it. You might be surprised. This revamped and renamed Regal was rated very highly even by Consumer Reports! The brand new Chevy Impala is similar, but I’d be wary of new model teething pains.
SUV’s. SUV’s are MUCH more susceptible to roll-over than cars and minivans. They kill their occupants in crashes more often than cars. Don’t let their mass fool you. Instability due to high center of gravity is a safety defect inherent in these beasties. Car based unibody SUV’s like the CRV, RAV4, Vue, Equinox, Escape, Pilot and Highlander are more stable than real truck SUV’s, but still not as stable as cars and minivans.
A word about depreciation. Beware some common statistics. Many depreciation rate calculations are sloppily done. They take the average used price and divide by original MSRP to determine resale ratings. Cars that commonly sold at MSRP (like my Odyssey and 95 Saturn) did great on these types of calcs. Cars that had big rebates do awful. But that figure means nothing. Consider this: Joe buys a 2002 Odyssey new and pays $30,000 when the MSRP was $29,000 (this really happened a lot). He sells in 2005 and gets $23,000. According to some, it retained 79% of original value. fred bought a Malibu for $15,000 which had MSRP of $18,500. He sells his at the same time and only gets $11,000. A rotten 59%. But in reality, it is 77% versus 73%. Not really such a big deal, is it?
If you want it to last, maintain it. Keep the fluids and filters changed. Check out weird sounds sooner than later. Read the manual. This makes much more difference in longevity than the nameplate on the front!
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