Scapegoat of recent scandal?

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Hence my explanation in the post and from my understanding it’s actually 86.6% rather than 81% only.
 
ConstantLearner said:
An abusive homosexual gets no sexual satisfaction from abusing a boy or a girl.
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Are you saying that those molesting/abusing/ raping children are not experiencing Any stimulation themselves and/or achieving orgasm? What would be the basis for this argument?
Power imbalances may facilitate abuse, but that is not to say that rapists do not experience any sexual pleasure when committing their crimes. Your source is discussing power as a tool. That’s a means to an end.
 
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nenabunena said:
don’t think that homosexuals generally are more likely to be abusive than heterosexuals
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If the number of homosexual priests is 30% and 80% of the priest sexual assaults are against boys by homosexual priests, then the homosexual priests are 15 times more likely to committ abuse than heterosexual priest. The facts have no pity on an argument to the contrary!!!
 
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ConstantLearner said:
I’m not saying none of the priests were homosexual because some were, but they don’t abuse to fulfill sexual desire. They abuse for the same reasons heterosexuals do: to gain power
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There are hundreds of ways to exercise power and control over someone yet almost all these cases are sexual assaults. It is most certainly about the disordered sexual satisfaction and little about power & control.
 
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What is the purpose of making excuses for this terrible problem? That will not fix the problem. Stopping it will fix the problem. Is there an agenda behind not identifying the real problem?
 
bullish1 said:
What is the purpose of making excuses for this terrible problem? That will not fix the problem. Stopping it will fix the problem.
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Understanding the exact nature of a problem can lead to better ways to address the problem. Ignoring any aspect of the issue is never helpful.
 
jeannetherese said:
Are you saying that those molesting/abusing/ raping children are not experiencing Any stimulation themselves and/or achieving orgasm? What would be the basis for this argument?
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No, I’m saying the feeling of power and mastery they feel over others gives them any sexual satisfaction they feel. I posted links to articles by recognized experts in the area who say that.
 
Idk why you’re ignoring my post, but in psychology/social sciences sex offenders are often categorized into various groups. Sadistic offenders enjoy inflicting harm/control and it gives them sexual gratification.

Disordered sexual satisfaction? Obviously. But that doesn’t mean it is because of homosexuality and that it has very little to do with power.
 
I guess I recently discovered that people will immediately blame the thing they already have a problem with, whenever they get the chance to.
 
We ALL look for meaningfulness, INTIMACY and virtuosity
for our lives to matter, lust kills these and the three former
things are LOST, to regain this, one must have contrition,
repent and confess to obtain absolution and finally offer
satisfaction for our sin(s) of lust!
 
pnewton said:
Understanding the exact nature of a problem can lead to better ways to address the problem. Ignoring any aspect of the issue is never helpful.
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Exactly right. So why the non stop attempt to ignore the facts supporting the conclusion that this is predominantly a same sex attraction by male priests against post pubescent boys or young men culminating in disordered sexual acts. Yes, there are other forms of abuse going on and they too need to be stopped as well.
 
Lea101 said:
Idk why you’re ignoring my post, but in psychology/social sciences sex offenders are often categorized into various groups. Sadistic offenders enjoy inflicting harm/control and it gives them sexual gratification.

Disordered sexual satisfaction? Obviously. But that doesn’t mean it is because of homosexuality and that it has very little to do with power.
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I did not ignore that. I actually agree that power & control is the predominant way that abuse is inflected and there are hundreds of ways to do that. But that is not what has been the main problem of the priest abuse. They are not using threats, non sexual physical control, torture, money control, etc, etc, on the boys & young men. They are using grooming, fear, intimidation, etc, to achieve their own disordered sexual satisfaction.
 
If you want to make an argument that refute the case that the priestly abuse scandal is not 15 times more likely to be homosexual in nature, go ahead. No logical falicies please. You must refute that the homosexual tendency is not that high, or that the post pubescent victims are not that high as reported. Even if this were a case of homosexual or heterosexual with homosexual tendency priest abusers numbering 50%, they are still 5 times as likely to abuse. Those are huge statistical facts that need to be ignored for you clerical and not sexual hypothesis.
 
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They’re still inflicting control. These victims were young and easy to exploit. Pedophilia cannot easily be explained by just saying ‘it’s because they’re gay’. It’s a cop out tbh.
Lea101 said:
I’m sure (or I hope) you don’t get desires to rape or abuse anyone even when you’re extremely aroused and attracted to a woman after being surrounded by women all day either.

Aaaand that’s the difference between a rapist and a normal person. The rapist would desire raping whilst the normal person won’t. Both can be gay or straight. Nobody is saying that all of these priests are straight yet they rape
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Hence why I said this. Many men feel attracted to a lot of things but that does not mean they would inflict abuse on an innocent child to satisfy themselves.

Your statement earlier implies that if you are gay, you would desire these things because you are surrounded by men all the time. Again, I sure hope you don’t feel this way about women, but a lot of people I know thankfully don’t desire rape when they see a girl when they are aroused. It implies that gay people would abuse children if they are under specific situational circumstances.

So far, threads like this are only saying it’s a gay problem simply because of a simple correlation (that most of these abuses are male on male) and nothing more. If there’s anything additional, it would simply be their own opinions. I’m not a fan of treating a whole group of people as potential pedophiles based on something out of their conscious control. I honestly believe it’s ridiculous to say gay people are welcome and yet create threads about how their attractions make them more likely to commit an insanely evil act on an innocent.

If we focus on factors that can be applied to the male-on-female abuse, we would be talking about 100% of these abuse cases rather than the 80%.
 
Lea101 said:
So far, threads like this are only saying it’s a gay problem simply because of a simple correlation (that most of these abuses are male on male) and nothing more. If there’s anything additional, it would simply be their own opinions. I’m not a fan of treating a whole group of people as potential pedophiles based on something out of their conscious control. I honestly believe it’s ridiculous to say gay people are welcome and yet create threads about how their attractions make them more likely to commit an insanely evil act on an innocent.
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Most child abusers, however, by far, are married heterosexuals, parents. When we read about “insanely evil acts” committed against children, it’s usually their parents who have committed them.
 
bullish1 said:
If you want to make an argument that refute the case that the priestly abuse scandal is not 15 times more likely to be homosexual in nature, go ahead. No logical falicies please. You must refute that the homosexual tendency is not that high, or that the post pubescent victims are not that high as reported. Even if this were a case of homosexual or heterosexual with homosexual tendency priest abusers numbering 50%, they are still 5 times as likely to abuse. Those are huge statistical facts that need to be ignored for you clerical and not sexual hypothesis.
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First, what fallacy is logical? I think you mean a fallacy of logic, which is something different.

According to the John Jay Report 80.9% of the alleged abuse victims in the United States were male. This fact led Catholic League’s to opine: “The conventional wisdom maintains there is a pedophilia crisis in the Catholic Church; I maintain it has been a homosexual crisis all along.”

Margaret Smith, a John Jay College criminologist who worked on the report, pointed out that it is “an unwarranted conclusion” to assert that the majority of priests who abused male victims are gay. Though “the majority of the abusive acts were homosexual in nature […] participation in homosexual acts is not the same as sexual identity as a gay man.” She further stated that "the idea of sexual identity [should] be separated from the problem of sexual abuse…[A]t this point, we do not find a connection between homosexual identity and the increased likelihood of subsequent abuse from the data that we have right now.” Debate_on_the_causes_of_clerical_child_abuse#cite_note-politicsdaily.com-22)

Another researcher, Louis Schlesinger, argued that the main problem was pedophilia or ephebophilia, not sexual orientation and claimed that some men who are married to adult women are attracted to adolescent males.

“It’s important to separate the sexual identity and the behavior,” said Karen Terry, a second researcher. “Someone can commit sexual acts that might be of a homosexual nature but not have a homosexual identity.” Terry said factors such as greater access to boys is one reason for the skewed ratio.

Analyzing a number of studies, Gregory M. Herek concluded: “The empirical research does not show that gay or bisexual men are any more likely than heterosexual men to molest children. This is not to argue that homosexual and bisexual men never molest children. But there is no scientific basis for asserting that they are more likely than heterosexual men to do so… Many child molesters cannot be characterized as having an adult sexual orientation at all; they are fixated on children.”

Homosexuals, and heterosexuals, do not commit acts of child abuse for sexual satisfaction; they commit them because they feel powerless in a way that indicates psychological illness.

These priests were in a large city. Gay clubs exist. If any gay priests had wanted sexual satisfaction, they could have gone to a gay club with complete anonymity. Married men go to these clubs; the wives never find out.

This is an abuse problem according to the experts.
 
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I’m not saying no homosexual could ever abuse. I’m not saying that no homosexual priest ever used a teenage boy to satisfy sexual desires. I am saying that, overall, this is an abuse problem, one in which power and control was sought, not sexual satisfaction. To label it a “homosexual problem” scapegoats a segment of society no more prone to abuse than heterosexuals, and it ignores the changes needed in the Church to ensure this never happens again.

This was about power and abuse. The experts agree.
 
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