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childofmary1143
Guest
I hope this question isn’t changing the subject but does anybody know who Father Euteneur’s Bishop is and whether he has made any comment about this whole episode?
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Texas_Roofer
Guest
Below are some quotes pulled from the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops. Sean asked if NFP was not Church allowed method of birth control, to which Father said no. That is my memory of the clip.
When a couple decides to postpone pregnancy, NFP can be very effective… Married Love and the Gift of Life- Issued by USCCB, November 14, 2006.
*“[Natural Family Planning] has become more than a totally safe, healthy, and reliable method of birth regulation to us. *(Faithful to Each Other
Forever, 44)] Married Love and the Gift of Life- Issued by USCCB, November 14, 2006.
How effective are the natural family planning methods for avoiding pregnancy?
When couples understand the methods and are motivated to follow them, NFP is up to 99% successful in spacing or limiting births.- %between%http://www.usccb.org/prolife/issues/nfp/information.shtml
Can be used both to achieve and avoid pregnancy-http://www.usccb.org/prolife/issues/nfp/myths.shtml
If wishing to avoid pregnancy, a couple practicing NFP is usually advised to abstain from intercourse and genital contact during the wife’s fertile time. usccb.org/prolife/issues/nfp/myths.shtml
*NFP is an umbrella term for certain methods used to achieve and avoid pregnancies.- *usccb.org/prolife/issues/nfp/index.shtml
*Modern methods of natural family planning aide couples in following God’s will for the family, a community of life and love, by enabling couples to **space births *when it may be necessary. - usccb.org/laity/marriage/nfpeng.shtml
When a couple decides to postpone pregnancy, NFP can be very effective… Married Love and the Gift of Life- Issued by USCCB, November 14, 2006.
*“[Natural Family Planning] has become more than a totally safe, healthy, and reliable method of birth regulation to us. *(Faithful to Each Other
Forever, 44)] Married Love and the Gift of Life- Issued by USCCB, November 14, 2006.
How effective are the natural family planning methods for avoiding pregnancy?
When couples understand the methods and are motivated to follow them, NFP is up to 99% successful in spacing or limiting births.- %between%http://www.usccb.org/prolife/issues/nfp/information.shtml
Can be used both to achieve and avoid pregnancy-http://www.usccb.org/prolife/issues/nfp/myths.shtml
If wishing to avoid pregnancy, a couple practicing NFP is usually advised to abstain from intercourse and genital contact during the wife’s fertile time. usccb.org/prolife/issues/nfp/myths.shtml
*NFP is an umbrella term for certain methods used to achieve and avoid pregnancies.- *usccb.org/prolife/issues/nfp/index.shtml
*Modern methods of natural family planning aide couples in following God’s will for the family, a community of life and love, by enabling couples to **space births *when it may be necessary. - usccb.org/laity/marriage/nfpeng.shtml
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fix
Guest
I have no idea if Hannity said that but if he did he would be like other dissenting Catholics who mistakenly think spacing births is moral no matter the means used. That contradicts Church teaching and logic.
NFP can be misused and then that intention may be a serious sin, but the means are not sinful. Contraception is intrinsically wrong, no matter the intention. It is always wrong.
The ends never justify the means.
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fix
Guest
She always gets it right, and using only a few words. I seem to remember another quote that may apply to this situation that says we are more concerned with offending our fellow human than offending God.
I think that point is not all those who claim offense are justified in such a claim.
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Nordar
Guest
Lets do the nice politically correct thing and sit back and watch Hannity endanger his soul and all the other Catholics he reaches with his Cafeteria Catholicism.
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MrS
Guest
Well… it has been one week, tonight, and I wonder how many people have discussed this, and perhaps learned at least a little truth about Conception…
if only one mind was opened, if only one heart was softened… Fr E would be pleased.
I just want to pray that Hannity might someday express the Truth… and add that he agrees with the Truth.
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Al_Masetti
Guest
Why single out Sean Hannity?
For example, I don’t see anyone going after Ted Kennedy for his stance on abortion.
The problem is the refusal of the American Catholic Church to educate.
There is a huge difference between educating and fighting.
For example, I don’t see anyone going after Ted Kennedy for his stance on abortion.
The problem is the refusal of the American Catholic Church to educate.
There is a huge difference between educating and fighting.
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childofmary1143
Guest
Well we bring up Sean Hannity as he had direct contact (via television) with Father Euteneuer.
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Al_Masetti
Guest
Hannity didn’t invent the notion of Catholics using contraception.
Go after the priests and bishops who have been acquiesing over the past nearly half a century.
It is my contention that the Church has failed to educate. Some members of the “clergy” (priests, deacons, and religious, as well as some lay people) are comfortable attacking people who don’t have the PhD backgrounds to attack back.
Some folks are happy to fight. But they won’t educate.
There are other threads on this forum about “dumbing down”, and I recommend folks from this thread to visit the “dumbing down” thread.
And the birth control issue is just ONE example.
Here is another:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=139020
This is about the Latin Mass. In my experience, some priests are actively hostile to the Latin Mass. I can remember hanging out in the kitchen of a retreat house some years ago, chitchatting with some of my priest-friends, and a “senior priest” came in and in a hostile manner bragged about sabotaging a Latin Mass (by making it a superLatin Mass).
How are Catholic lay people today supposed to uphold Catholic traditions when so many of them have been thrown overboard (Friday abstinence, short-cutting on Holy Days, group penance, the Baltimore Catechism, the Latin Mass, “individual conscience”. non-discussion of abortion and contraception, and others that I would prefer not to even mention).
So how are the laity supposed to know what is real and what is not real.
A former co-worker commented during a bull session that Catholics learn by osmosis. What the heck kind of learning is that?
Go after the priests and bishops who have been acquiesing over the past nearly half a century.
It is my contention that the Church has failed to educate. Some members of the “clergy” (priests, deacons, and religious, as well as some lay people) are comfortable attacking people who don’t have the PhD backgrounds to attack back.
Some folks are happy to fight. But they won’t educate.
There are other threads on this forum about “dumbing down”, and I recommend folks from this thread to visit the “dumbing down” thread.
And the birth control issue is just ONE example.
Here is another:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=139020
This is about the Latin Mass. In my experience, some priests are actively hostile to the Latin Mass. I can remember hanging out in the kitchen of a retreat house some years ago, chitchatting with some of my priest-friends, and a “senior priest” came in and in a hostile manner bragged about sabotaging a Latin Mass (by making it a superLatin Mass).
How are Catholic lay people today supposed to uphold Catholic traditions when so many of them have been thrown overboard (Friday abstinence, short-cutting on Holy Days, group penance, the Baltimore Catechism, the Latin Mass, “individual conscience”. non-discussion of abortion and contraception, and others that I would prefer not to even mention).
So how are the laity supposed to know what is real and what is not real.
A former co-worker commented during a bull session that Catholics learn by osmosis. What the heck kind of learning is that?
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childofmary1143
Guest
I can’t disagree with what you are saying but can you give a clearer understanding when you say Some folks are happy to fight. But they won’t educate. Do you think that Father Euteneuer fought or educated?
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a_cermak
Guest
If I remember what heresy is directly isn’t is claiming the Church teaches x when in fact the Church doesn’t teach x? In this case, Hannity has never said that the Church supports the use of contraception. He says he supports the use of contraception. That seems to be a big difference. Is Hannity 100% fully in accord with the teachings of his Church? Apparently not, but is he REQUIRED to give positive assent to every teaching of the Church? I’m not so sure, I believe that requirement stops with the clergy.
Also, the theology of the Catholic Church is an awful lot richer than just being anti-contraception. It includes the items in the Nicene Creed for instance, all of which seem to be more important than contraception. It includes the seven sacraments all of which are an awful lot more important than just contraception.
If Mr. Hannity has actually used contraception then yes, he should confess that before receiving the Eucharist, if not, he seems to have a minor disagreement with the Church over a minor issue.
And, speaking as a Protestant, I feel that I do have the moral right to use contraception anytime I feel like it (which I don’t, FAM suits me admirably) because I am not bound by the rules and precepts of the Church. So Hannity supporting non-Catholics in the right to use birth control may just be recognizing the religious pluralism present in the States.
As for the jibe about him referring to Gov. Romney as a good Christian, he didn’t refer to him as a Trinitarian Christian, but a Christian. Christian is usually used to describe those who follow Christ. The LDS church is a church that follows Christ. Perhaps not in a way that you or I would find appropriate, but they do recognize Him.
I can’t believe I’m defending Hannity. I feel I should go soak my fingers in bleach or something.
Also, the theology of the Catholic Church is an awful lot richer than just being anti-contraception. It includes the items in the Nicene Creed for instance, all of which seem to be more important than contraception. It includes the seven sacraments all of which are an awful lot more important than just contraception.
If Mr. Hannity has actually used contraception then yes, he should confess that before receiving the Eucharist, if not, he seems to have a minor disagreement with the Church over a minor issue.
And, speaking as a Protestant, I feel that I do have the moral right to use contraception anytime I feel like it (which I don’t, FAM suits me admirably) because I am not bound by the rules and precepts of the Church. So Hannity supporting non-Catholics in the right to use birth control may just be recognizing the religious pluralism present in the States.
As for the jibe about him referring to Gov. Romney as a good Christian, he didn’t refer to him as a Trinitarian Christian, but a Christian. Christian is usually used to describe those who follow Christ. The LDS church is a church that follows Christ. Perhaps not in a way that you or I would find appropriate, but they do recognize Him.
I can’t believe I’m defending Hannity. I feel I should go soak my fingers in bleach or something.
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Tom317
Guest
Using birth control is a mortal sin and Hannity knows that. He is without excuse because he even publicly proclaims that he attended seminary, he studied Catholic theology (including Latin) and he has stated he knows that BC use is against Church teachings.
Catholics do not believe that the use of BC is a mortal sin only if done by Catholics, that would be like saying only Catholics think murder is wrong. Contracpetion is immoral for every person, Catholic and non-Catholic, even if the non-Catholics disagree.
A private Catholic can hold such beliefs and not ever even be known to others, yet Hannity cannot because he is such a well know and respected public person.
Sean knows all of that and still stands against Church teachings in a very upfront public way. He needs much prayer.
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a_cermak
Guest
Catholics may have the OPINION that contraception is immoral, just as all of Christendom had prior to the 1930’s. That doesn’t make that opinion correct or proveable.
As a non-Catholic, I guess I can say that I don’t believe contraception is immoral, unless your beliefs tell you it is. At least my opinion leaves the door open for Catholics to follow a stricter belief system.
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Tom317
Guest
Morality is not provable.
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aimee
Guest
sure it is
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Tom317
Guest
do itsure it is
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bquinnan
Guest
The Catholic Church claims her moral teachings are not merely opinions but that they are authoritative and, under certain circumstances, infallible. If the Church is who she claims to be, the Bride of Christ who holds the keys to the gates of heaven and teaches authoritively on matters of faith and morals, contraception is wrong regardless of one’s opinion on the subject.
Even if the Church were not she claimed to be, it wouldn’t change the fact that things are either morally right, wrong or neutral; it would just mean we could never be certain what was what.
In other words, our opinions don’t define the natural laws of morality.
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bquinnan
Guest
That’s an interesting comment. Does that mean it is not knowable? Not applicable? (I’m not trying to put words in your mouth; I’m trying to understand what you believe the ramifications of this statement to be; i.e., how we should act if morality is not provable.)
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Tom317
Guest
Morality is knowable and is applicable. It is not provable as in the sense of a scientific proof.
Everyone applies some sort of morality, so the main thing is decide’s what moral framework we will assume.
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