Senior Vatican Advisor wants No Communion for Cuomo

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Not exactly…should science discover a genetic link then the church would have to adapt to a new understanding. Until that is known definitively it remains premature to claim it to be solely (or even souly) a moral defect.
If one’s sexual preference is based on genetics then I assume you’re okay with me having pre-marital sex and having multiple wives at once? Also, I’d assume you’d be okay with me divorcing my wives simply because they are not fufilling my sexual appitite?

Simply holding this position basically states that we are no different than the rest of the animal kingdom. Even though one may have a genetic disposition towards SSA, this still does not prove it is good for the human species or society in general.
 
I lived in New York City many years and recall the funeral masses and wedding masses for various crime bosses (e. g., Mafia). If the church starts refusing the Eucharist to politicians, where does one draw the line? Every politician who, for example, votes to permit gay marriage or civil unions? Every politician who supports no-fault divorce? Every politician who votes funds for the UN? What about a Mel Gibson and others like him? Refuse them communion, also? A slippery slope? Etc.
Why not leave such judgements in the hands of God? The Lord knows the deepest secrets of our hearts and minds and is a far better position to do that than we are.
 
I lived in New York City many years and recall the funeral masses and wedding masses for various crime bosses (e. g., Mafia). If the church starts refusing the Eucharist to politicians, where does one draw the line? Every politician who, for example, votes to permit gay marriage or civil unions? Every politician who supports no-fault divorce? Every politician who votes funds for the UN? What about a Mel Gibson and others like him? Refuse them communion, also? A slippery slope? Etc.
Code:
Why not leave such judgements in the hands of God? The Lord knows the deepest secrets of our hearts and minds and is a far better position to do that than we are.
I agree that it is a slippery slope.

However…

It is very scandalous to allow people to recieve who support such issues that are very much against church teaching. It sets a bad example.
 
Not exactly…should science discover a genetic link then the church would have to adapt to a new understanding. Until that is known definitively it remains premature to claim it to be solely (or even souly) a moral defect.
The Church would also then concede to the heresy of Determinism and deny the operation of Free Will in the process. The Catechism teaches that same-sex attraction is “objectively disordered” and that homosexual acts are “intrinsically evil”.

That is the Truth of Catholic teaching on the matter. Science will not independently arrive at a contradictory “truth”–no matter how many people persist in error and jump up and down and scream and holler and even legislate otherwise.

“Let God be true and every man a liar.”
 
I lived in New York City many years and recall the funeral masses and wedding masses for various crime bosses (e. g., Mafia). If the church starts refusing the Eucharist to politicians, where does one draw the line? Every politician who, for example, votes to permit gay marriage or civil unions? Every politician who supports no-fault divorce? Every politician who votes funds for the UN? What about a Mel Gibson and others like him? Refuse them communion, also? A slippery slope? Etc.
Code:
Why not leave such judgements in the hands of God? The Lord knows the deepest secrets of our hearts and minds and is a far better position to do that than we are.
Matthew 13:41
The Son of man shall send his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all scandals, and them that work iniquity.

Matthew 18:7
Woe to the world because of scandals. For it must needs be that scandals come: but nevertheless woe to that man by whom the scandal cometh.

Luke 17:1
And he said to his disciples: It is impossible that scandals should not come: but woe to him through whom they come.

If a man will be held accountable for every idle word that he speaks then a public figure who openly persists in public sin, without showing the least fruit of penance . . . well, you figure it out.

And as for the bishops who allow–or, like Bishop Hubbard, openly promote/sanction–such scandal and offence to the faithful: God have mercy on them.
 
Not exactly…should science discover a genetic link then the church would have to adapt to a new understanding. Until that is known definitively it remains premature to claim it to be solely (or even souly) a moral defect.
No, this belief is completely without foundation. As Patabird and ComputerGeek pointed out, morality is not based on our inclinations, but this apparently needs to be said yet again: the issue isn’t relevant in regard to how the Church should behave. She has identified a number of behaviors as serious sins, she has incorporated Canon 915 into her laws, and now she needs to demonstrate that she actually believes what she teaches.

She has said: “If someone does X, our response must be Y.” Well, someone did X and she has done … nothing. It doesn’t matter if you don’t think X is wrong, the Church does - or at least, despite her inactivity, we think she does.
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Roy5:
Why not leave such judgements in the hands of God?
Because the Church has claimed not just the right but the responsibility of making such judgments. We cannot just leave all the hard actions to God; we have our own obligations to perform - including the ones we’d just as soon forgo.

Ender
 
In this community two situations immediately pop into mind.

(1) A gay man living openly with his partner goes forward to receive communion regularly at a local Catholic church. Should he be turned away at the altar?

(2) One of the key leaders (parish council member, usher) in a local Catholic Church is divorced. He did not remarry but he has been cohabiting with a woman for many years now, and they have a teenage son. Should he be permitted to receive communion? Should he be forbidden to hold such positions? He and his woman companion attend mass and other parish events faithfully, give generously, etc.
Code:
By the way, what is the official teaching of the church re Protestants receiving communion? What I mean is, some churches announce that only Catholics may receive and some don't. I know an older couple who attend his Catholic church on Saturday and her Protestant church on Sunday - an agreement they made when they married after they both were widowed. She comes forward with him for communion. What should be done, if anything?   

Refusing the Eucharist is very touchy. I recall weddings where the bride was given communion, but not the groom, the bride's family but not the groom's, etc. It seems to me that this is a poor way to start out a marriage. 

 The best way, in my personal opinion, is to let God decide such issues. I know many Catholics who do not believe in transubstantiation. Now, is there communion valid? 

 Very complicated. God certainly can figure it out far better than we can.

 Oh, when a non-Catholic serviceman attends mass in Iraq and takes communion, what then? I know of such a circumstance. He explained later that this was the only communion available to him at that time, and he thought the normal rules were suspended.
 
In this community two situations immediately pop into mind.

(1) A gay man living openly with his partner goes forward to receive communion regularly at a local Catholic church. Should he be turned away at the altar?

(2) One of the key leaders (parish council member, usher) in a local Catholic Church is divorced. He did not remarry but he has been cohabiting with a woman for many years now, and they have a teenage son. Should he be permitted to receive communion? Should he be forbidden to hold such positions? He and his woman companion attend mass and other parish events faithfully, give generously, etc.
Code:
By the way, what is the official teaching of the church re Protestants receiving communion? What I mean is, some churches announce that only Catholics may receive and some don't. I know an older couple who attend his Catholic church on Saturday and her Protestant church on Sunday - an agreement they made when they married after they both were widowed. She comes forward with him for communion. What should be done, if anything?   

Refusing the Eucharist is very touchy. I recall weddings where the bride was given communion, but not the groom, the bride's family but not the groom's, etc. It seems to me that this is a poor way to start out a marriage. 

 The best way, in my personal opinion, is to let God decide such issues. I know many Catholics who do not believe in transubstantiation. Now, is there communion valid? 

 Very complicated. God certainly can figure it out far better than we can.

 Oh, when a non-Catholic serviceman attends mass in Iraq and takes communion, what then? I know of such a circumstance. He explained later that this was the only communion available to him at that time, and he thought the normal rules were suspended.
The church has a right (perhaps a mandate) to protect the sacraments as it sees fit.
 
ComputerGeek25
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Okay. Let's say the Church has the right. Fine.

But two questions come to mind still.

(1) What should local churches do in such situations as I have described? I'm sure there are many thousands of similar situations around the world.

 (2) Even if the Church has the right, aren't Catholics permitted to have diverse opinions on such matters? Those who feel that they don't have that right help drive people away who treasure the freedom to have opinions. It's obvious, if one reads history, that Catholics have differed over many issues. Thomas Aquinas, for example, argued in the Summa that all heretics should be executed. If he can advocate that position, can't Catholics express their views on even less volatile concerns?

   I was interested in this morning's* Times *that apparently the Church doesn't permit discussion of priestly marriage or the ordination on women. These issues are 'off the table' etc. Hm! Troubling. Positive change comes through dialogue. We'd all be attending masses in Latin today if the Church hadn't changed. Ditto for girl altar servers, interfaith weddings in the church, attending Protestant services, etc. The mass I attend today (I am a senior) is very different from the one I recall as a young child.

  God bless everybody, regardless of creed, color, culture or country. Let's make religion a bridge rather than a barrier. I once heard a nun say that Vatican II and John XXIII moved Catholicism from being a faith of rules to one of love. I hope this is true.
 
ComputerGeek25
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Okay. Let's say the Church has the right. Fine.

But two questions come to mind still.

(1) What should local churches do in such situations as I have described? I'm sure there are many thousands of similar situations around the world.
This is where my argument falls apart, as to individual cases of public scandal. Obviously the church still has a duty to inform those of what’s it’s stance is on these things with charity and clarity. It cannot enforce every single infraction but it still has a duty where possible.

The issue in this thread is public figures and public scandal.
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 (2) Even if the Church has the right, aren't Catholics permitted to have diverse opinions on such matters? Those who feel that they don't have that right help drive people away who treasure the freedom to have opinions. It's obvious, if one reads history, that Catholics have differed over many issues. Thomas Aquinas, for example, argued in the Summa that all heretics should be executed. If he can advocate that position, can't Catholics express their views on even less volatile concerns?
A sin is still a sin. Taking communion with unconfessed mortal sin is still a sin. There is no debate here. What you’re confused about is application of “punishment” for such sins.
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   I was interested in this morning's* Times *that apparently the Church doesn't permit discussion of priestly marriage or the ordination on women. These issues are 'off the table' etc. Hm! Troubling. Positive change comes through dialogue. We'd all be attending masses in Latin today if the Church hadn't changed. Ditto for girl altar servers, interfaith weddings in the church, attending Protestant services, etc. The mass I attend today (I am a senior) is very different from the one I recall as a young child.

  God bless everybody, regardless of creed, color, culture or country. Let's make religion a bridge rather than a barrier. I once heard a nun say that Vatican II and John XXIII moved Catholicism from being a faith of rules to one of love. I hope this is true.
This is a slightly incorrect view of things. The purpose of Vatican II was to re-state and refine what the church has always taught.

People tend to get caught up in the spirit versus what was actually taught.
 
(1) A gay man living openly with his partner goes forward to receive communion regularly at a local Catholic church. Should he be turned away at the altar?
Let’s not go there. The question is not whether we can find the line between where communion should and should not be given but to determine whether the actions of Gov. Cuomo are clearly across that line. You cannot excuse his behavior by excusing less scandalous behavior.
The best way, in my personal opinion, is to let God decide such issues.
But this is not what the Church teaches. Are you suggesting the clergy should ignore Canon law?
Ender
 
My comments earlier were “more will be revealed”…The mystery of truth is part of the ongoing revelation of the Spirit - the truth too evolves as we become aware of bigger truths. This is not relativism… I for one am willing to remain open to a bigger truth that we, in our times, have not yet fully grasped.
Will evolve? That is relativism, and a retread of a bad philosophical approach and lack of understanding of the Church & the protection of the Holy Spirit.
I used to have a mindset like you, when everything was subjective, and the idea that we are continually learning, everything can be justified. It even leads to justifying sins and considering God’s laws and commandments more as ‘moral guidelines.’

This is a false notion, as if the Truth is not transcendent, it is also a lack of trust and faith. Bigger TRUTH? Truth is simple. And your HOPE certainly does NOT apply to something that is well known and we have from Jesus’ own words regarding Marriage. For instance, Jesus states clearly what he expects of marriage, and in fact if we ever discover some “bigger truth”** it’s going to be even HARDER for the world to hear, not easier to Hea**r…This was the case when he tells the disciples he EXPECTS more from the sanctity of marriage, not less.

You need to pray that you are not deceived because your attitude in regard to the “injustice” of the Church for preaching the Truth in matters concerning a manufactured BS civil rights “plight” that no common homosexual even cared about twenty years ago is an insult to the Church. It IS relativism, under the guise of some presumptive hope that the Church will follow the trends of Man?
If you ever find yourself married to the ‘mood’ of the day ; you will find yourself a widow in the next.

Your attitude can be used to similarly hope that some day the Church will renege on Birth Control or Artificial Insemination, because its unjust to people who wish to practice and they need to get with the times.
The only time the Church has to clarify things or gets a better understanding of things have to do with Purgatory, or reiterating something that was not clear, or presumed to be clear but because the Lay People turned away or started getting confused by heresies the Church in its infallibility has had to reiterate something that ALWAYS was; The Word always will be; it’s not going to suddenly enlarge itself. Just like it took a while for the Church to have to state plain and simple about the Eucharist, and the Immaculate Conception. That is not an enlargement.
WE CHANGE around our greater understanding of God; The God will not change around us because we’re becoming more and more disobedient and hardened in our hearts!
That is what is going on with this homosexual identity nonsense.

Your kind of thinking, is trying to fix God around and center him around our individual selves and our feelings. These are False injustices, you speak of , not true injustices. A God that reflects man’s changes. If anything we’ll understand the theory of Limbo and baptism better. Or the salvation of souls, etc when we discovered the new continents and EENS which already has had St. Paul talk about these folks. So again NO Enlargement or EVOLUTION of truth. Your hopes that somehow the Church will amend “Gay Marriage” is heretical. If Jesus said “divorce” was too much to handle, you think the truth is going to contradict itself even MORE, against One Man & One Woman??

Even if they found a gay gene that would not all of a sudden force the Church to amend its teachings on faith and morals. We men have a fallen nature. Plus, the Homosexual activists have been clamoring to compromise the APA for decades. Yet in 2009, the APA had to make concessions that even after 25 years its inclusive about the causes for homosexuality too many factors.

ncregister.com/site/article/scientists_outing_gay_gene_myth

Its also a false belief that a ‘gay gene’ does anything to justify*** their free will ***to succumb to SSA.
The Church wouldn’t have to do anything but amend one line about the innate characteristic of SSA in the catechism.
And our kindness to the Mentally Ill, or those who have genetic abnormalities would still extend from Original sin.
it is simply a recognition that matters such as Gay marriage are not “already and ultimately decided” as there is evidence in the animal kingdom of similar behaviors.
This is the weakest of all arguments. The Animal Kingdom has cannibalism occur. What do animals have to do with us? Let alone marriage!
It’s precisely because of bad philosophies that became MAN-Centered with the elimination of God, many secularist philosophies have forgotten Man’s place in God’s creation. That we become no better than the beasts living on impulse and needs. We are not automatons, we have a will, but people don’t like to hear that we have a ‘will’ anymore. 🤷
Jesus, himself, did not speak directly on the matter although we can learn much from his Gospel of inclusion.
Jesus didn’t speak directly about Euthanasia but we know its wrong through his Church & scripture. FYI He talks specifically about marriage in the Gospels and Genesis.

Btw that’s the first time I heard the buzz word “Gospel of Inclusion” Is this a new term, like “tolerance” and “diversity”
Jesus taught about Hell more! He talked about a narrow gate and a wide path to destruction. I don’t know what medicine you’re peddling, but it certainly isn’t for “inclusion.”
 
ComputerGeek25
Code:
Okay. Let's say the Church has the right. Fine.

But two questions come to mind still.

(1) What should local churches do in such situations as I have described? I'm sure there are many thousands of similar situations around the world.

 (2) Even if the Church has the right, aren't Catholics permitted to have diverse opinions on such matters? Those who feel that they don't have that right help drive people away who treasure the freedom to have opinions. It's obvious, if one reads history, that Catholics have differed over many issues. Thomas Aquinas, for example, argued in the Summa that all heretics should be executed. If he can advocate that position, can't Catholics express their views on even less volatile concerns?

   I was interested in this morning's* Times *that apparently the Church doesn't permit discussion of priestly marriage or the ordination on women. These issues are 'off the table' etc. Hm! Troubling. Positive change comes through dialogue. We'd all be attending masses in Latin today if the Church hadn't changed. Ditto for girl altar servers, interfaith weddings in the church, attending Protestant services, etc. The mass I attend today (I am a senior) is very different from the one I recall as a young child.

  God bless everybody, regardless of creed, color, culture or country. Let's make religion a bridge rather than a barrier. I once heard a nun say that Vatican II and John XXIII moved Catholicism from being a faith of rules to one of love. I hope this is true.
The things that was wrong about trhe changes you list was that they obviously gave you the impression that everything is a matter of custom and convention. As someone from a Protestant background, however, I can assure you that this is not true. Proestants in general reject what is fundamental to Catholicism–and to the ancient churches of the East–which is the idea of apostolic conception. Hence, to the Catholic, the hierarchy are the successors of the Apostles, whose authority cqme from Christ Himself. Protestant ministers, however, receive their authority from the congregation, or whatever form of church government, the congregation(s) set up. Thus Protestants can decide
who they can ordain, or what stanards they can set up. For us, only the bishops can do this, by divine right. But even they are bound by the Tradition.

As for married clergy, you have become convinced to accept the norms of a Protestant society which by long custom, rejects celibacy and prefers the married state. Fact is that one thing that early distinguiished Christians from jews, was that Christians preferred virginity to marriage. That is abhorent to Proestants to to many pagans as well. In an ironic twist on the old notions about masturbation. they think that celibacy will drive a man mad.
 
A wise Priest once said it only takes one exception to the rule to prove the rule to be lacking or simply wrong. I, for one, have met many outwardly holy and God loving Gay people (including some who are Priests)**who are discriminated against by our current legal system. That too is not justice. **
Whatever that wise priest once said, it certainly is irrelevant in regard to the Church’s teachings and its protection by the Holy Spirit regarding Marriage.

And Anecdotal evidence not withstanding? Are you talking about Pope Benedict cracking down on allowing Homosexual priests into the seminaries which gave rise to tendency and contributions to the ephebophilic Molestation scandals? The same way much prevalence also contributed in other fields with children/youth.
The Pope nipping it in the bud by reinforcing existing safeguards, since homosexuals seeking the priesthood with SSA would be prone to temptations and unwisely put into an office that has obviously led to bad results; I don’t think that was unjust at all.

In fact, ironically, the exception that they made for leniency allowed homosexual priests proved the rule correct.

lifesitenews.com/news/archive/ldn/2005/nov/05113001

Ban On Homosexual Men Was Always In Place Decision from 810 AD cited

*The French priest-psychologist cited decisions by the Council of Paris in 819, and the 3rd and 4th Lateran Councils in 1169 and 1215.

When questioned as to whether the Church might be accused of “homophobia,” the French psychologist reacted quickly. The term “homophobia,” he said, is “a slogan of intimidation.” The Instruction insists on respectful treatment of homosexual persons, he pointed out; the Vatican is not encouraging or condoning hatred for those who suffer same-sex impulses.

Nevertheless, Msgr. Anatrella said, the Church has a duty to ensure that candidates for the priesthood are properly suited for pastoral ministry. Echoing an argument from the Instruction, he observed that “the priesthood is not a right.”*
I, for one, have met many outwardly holy and God loving Gay people (including some who are Priests)
Who cares if you’ve met priests who had SSA. If Holy, they wouldn’t even care about the current ‘legal system.’ They know God’s law. They know not to elevate the creature/creation above the Creator; what is the current ‘legal system’ to them?

There is no such thing as one’s sexual proclivity defining WHO you are. Nobody should elevate their status from the effects Original Sin, as if they deserve special treatment. It is not humble, and it is not respectful to the Truth. It is truer to deny one’s self. If the virtue of Self-forgetfulness returned, there would be no need for any of this special interest jargon, false injustices, and there would be no need for the Church to be tangled in this current socio-political agenda and new AIMS for evangelization.

Reminds me of encouraging Nuns and Priests to be hipper or something. The Church just needs to speak the Truth, not apologize for it, not sugar coat, and if people walk away because they value themselves better or their ego can’t take it, so be it.

All of this is just selfishness wrapped in victimology. If we are to deny oneself then this should not be an issue at all regarding the Church. It’s all just BS cloaked in trying to bring the Church down to a worldly level.

I think its more loving to tell the people the Truth, than deny them something that might be too hard to hear.

Perhaps Catholics need to meditate on the gospel more when God himself, did not try to amend his public ministry, 'wait I could have told you about the Eucharist better! ’ when people walked away from him, just because what HE said was TOO HARD TO HEAR. What of St. Paul in his ministry?

Are we to be any better because we have people saying* ‘you need to tell us something that is easier on our ears!’ *
 
As for married clergy, you have become convinced to accept the norms of a Protestant society which by long custom, rejects celibacy and prefers the married state. Fact is that one thing that early distinguiished Christians from jews, was that Christians preferred virginity to marriage. That is abhorent to Proestants to to many pagans as well. In an ironic twist on the old notions about masturbation. they think that celibacy will drive a man mad.
Of course they would come to believe that since they’ve turned their backs on certain sacraments. Where more grace /gratis is given freely.

Thanks for that perspective, Robby
 
ComputerGeek25
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Okay. Let's say the Church has the right. Fine.

But two questions come to mind still.

(1) What should local churches do in such situations as I have described? I'm sure there are many thousands of similar situations around the world.
ComputerGeek25 & Robby answered your post fine. But I found a few weird things here. Probably due to your outside perspective.
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 (2) Even if the Church has the right, aren't Catholics permitted to have diverse opinions on such matters? Those who feel that they don't have that right help drive people away who treasure the freedom to have opinions. It's obvious, if one reads history, that Catholics have differed over many issues. Thomas Aquinas, for example, argued in the Summa that all heretics should be executed. If he can advocate that position, **can't Catholics express their views on even less volatile concerns?**
Isn’t that is what is going on in this thread? Catholics seem to be abusing the Church’s diversity, which has turned into heterodoxy. Cuomo isn’t merely expressing a difference of opinion for instance, and neither are the one’s okay with him receiving.
Those who feel that they don’t have that right help drive people away who treasure the freedom to have opinions.
If people are driven away by Christ’s body daring to speak of Truth, Power, & Love, so be it. Jesus himself didn’t chase after those who rejected what he said. They have a freedom to be wrong. Incredulity is the neglect of revealed truth or the willful refusal to assent to it.
Padre Pio once said he’d rather have an empty Church that a Church full of devils.

Treasuring the freedom to have opinions, is all well and good. But you need help, from something without. People need to stop being so selfish, about their right and their egos. There is something greater than themselves, beyond self.
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I was interested in this morning's* Times *that apparently the Church doesn't permit discussion of priestly marriage or the ordination on women. These issues are 'off the table' etc. Hm! Troubling. Positive change comes through dialogue. We'd all be attending masses in Latin today if the Church hadn't changed. Ditto for girl altar servers, interfaith weddings in the church, attending Protestant services, etc. The mass I attend today (I am a senior) is very different from the one I recall as a young child.
Yes, it’s kind of a mess!! I grew up on the masses that you see as very different.

Women will never be ordinated! Impossible, as Christ came as a man. Troubling that these are things to be sad about from prideful people. As for priestly marriage, THAT is a discipline. It’s ultimately impractical. You can’t serve two masters.
Catholics shouldn’t attend Protestant Services; consequences ensue, it can be seen. Interfaith Weddings are warned about. Much suffering comes from it, see St. Monica’s example. Girl Altar Servers, confuse boy altar servers as well as it stifles the opportunity for the encouragement for young men, to come to the priesthood. This just has to do with the fact that girls and boys are different; especially in their formative years.
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  God bless everybody, regardless of creed, color, culture or country.I once heard a nun say that Vatican II and John XXIII moved Catholicism from being a faith of rules to one of love. I hope this is true.
Truth & Love go hand in hand, “rules” is an insult to the Truth & Tradition. My parish I grew up in thankfully didn’t teach error , but it certainly left me and my generation out in the cold; we knew very little about what Catholics are for! I knew nothing about the faith, knew nothing about the “rules” knew nothing about the “saints” and the importance of the Eucharist; Instead my CCD courses were one, where we drew pictures of Jesus and colored things and had social games. Watered down analogies. No talk of true Marian Devotion, no real insight into the History of the Church and its ethereal beauty.
What good is “love” when the Church is too afraid to describe Christ himself & the mystical body. Feel Good attempts of the Catholic Church to become friends with the rest of the world by looking more like the world, is not love, it was a waste of time in many respects. And those who do not gather, scatter.
Positive change comes through dialogue.
Negative change comes as well. You don’t dialogue with Satan for instance. You have Christ rebuke him!
I’m all for Jesus example with the Woman at the Well, that’s where you find out how to dialogue with others in finding a commonality! If our Blessed Lord unblemished could find a common need, a drink of water, to eventually unfold before her, an offering of the Truth & mercy, so too can we do that. But that nun quote is definitely troubling.
That nun misrepresents whatever attempts VII tried under the 'false ecumenical ’ spirit by saying the Church was just a bunch of rules. It allowed much abuse and much confusion.
I don’t even know why its troubling to see Cuomo disciplined. Interdict, is letting him off easy.
It’s not a spirit of love for the Church to be more cowardly in upholding the truth, especially with its own wayward flock. This isn’t an issue of the Church confronting an adversary, it’s about disciplining one of its own.
Let’s make religion a bridge rather than a barrier.
Yes, it’s been 2000 years all the barriers are due to stubbornness on behalf of every other creed, reluctant to acknowledge that Jesus is risen! It would be easier if everyone became Catholic. I’d rather be debating about how best to imitate him, than still trying to point out *** why ***Jesus is Lord & Savior & how the Divine does not make mistakes in establishing his CHURCH; talk about slow learners!
 
Whatever that wise priest once said, it certainly is irrelevant in regard to the Church’s teachings and its protection by the Holy Spirit regarding Marriage.
For which priests does the protection of the Holy Spirit not apply? Is there a list of priests certified as in line with Church teachings? Seems absurd to me that you dismiss a priest’s teaching in favor of your own, personal interpretation. Either you are also a priest or that is clearly the ego at work.

I’ll stick with the Church teachings through the lens of educated, scripture scholars and theologians.
 
For which priests does the protection of the Holy Spirit not apply?
All of them? Even the comments of bishops and popes are not guaranteed to be correct. The Holy Spirit guides the Church, not individual clergy.
Seems absurd to me that you dismiss a priest’s teaching in favor of your own, personal interpretation.
Well, that’s the argument: which position is supported by Church teaching? The mere fact that a statement was made by a priest is no guarantee whatever that the comment was correct.
I’ll stick with the Church teachings through the lens of educated, scripture scholars and theologians.
Ah, but educated, scripture scholars and theologians do not speak for the Church; they speak for themselves. If you want to follow Church teaching you have to accede to what the Church says, regardless of what position is taken by scholars and theologians.

Having said all that, I guess it is necessary to point out that it’s all irrelevant to the issue raised by the OP. The Church has taken position X; Gov. Cuomo is obstinately persevering in manifest grave sin by rejecting position X. The question is not whether the Church is right or wrong about X but, having proclaimed a position that Cuomo has publicly rejected, whether she should follow her own laws and refuse him communion.

Ender
 
In this community two situations immediately pop into mind.

(1) A gay man living openly with his partner goes forward to receive communion regularly at a local Catholic church. Should he be turned away at the altar?
If the priest saying the Mass knows that the man is living in sin (i.e. the man habitually engages in homosexual acts), the priest has addressed the man about Church teaching on the matter–such that the man understands the Church’s teaching and the gravity of his sinful actions, then (assuming he has not been absolved from his sin in the Sacrament od Penance) the man should be refused communion–for the good of his own soul, preventing him from making a sacrilegious Communion and incurring more punishment.
(2) One of the key leaders (parish council member, usher) in a local Catholic Church is divorced. He did not remarry but he has been cohabiting with a woman for many years now, and they have a teenage son. Should he be permitted to receive communion? Should he be forbidden to hold such positions? He and his woman companion attend mass and other parish events faithfully, give generously, etc.
The same conditions would apply as given above. Receiving Holy Communion in a state of mortal sin is much worse for the couple than their facing embarrassment or having their “feelings hurt”–God help us!

These types of problems, really unnecessary “dilemmas”, stem from wishy-washy, cowardly priests and bishops who fail to address the problems.
By the way, what is the official teaching of the church re Protestants receiving communion? What I mean is, some churches announce that only Catholics may receive and some don’t. I know an older couple who attend his Catholic church on Saturday and her Protestant church on Sunday - an agreement they made when they married after they both were widowed. She comes forward with him for communion. What should be done, if anything?
The CCC provides specific guidelines for when a Protestant may receive Communion:
(1) Attendant conditions must be “grave”, e.g. in wartime, when a company of soldiers is facing immanent danger of death,
(2) The Protestant does not have access to his own minister.
(3) The Protestant believes what the Church teaches about the Eucharist.
(4) Typically, the local Ordinary must grant permission to the priest.

It doesn’t sound like the situations you describe meet any of the conditions. What you witness is confusion and people acting out of ignorance because they have either not been taught or, worse, the responsible priests and bishops are themselves actually promoting such scandal.

I have seen it myself, and have even had to talk to my brother and my sister-in-law about it because the priest was asleep at the wheel, as is so often the case. They, Protestants, were frequently making illicit Communions. After being presented with the Church’s teaching, they saw the truth in the argument and withdrew themselves from the practice.

If you haven’t already, please take the time to read Blessed John Paul II’s wonderful encyclical, “Ecclesia de Eucharistia”, in which he solidly re-affirms the Church’s perennial teaching on the Eucharist in view of mounting liturgical abuse.
Refusing the Eucharist is very touchy. I recall weddings where the bride was given communion, but not the groom, the bride’s family but not the groom’s, etc. It seems to me that this is a poor way to start out a marriage.
Yes, it is touchy. But failing to teach the Truth of our Faith and promoting scandal and sometimes even sacrilege in the process is NOT the solution. Unfortunately, the U.S. clergy, by-and-large, seems to acting in precisely such a manner.

Jesus, in the Eucharist, is indeed a “sign of contradiction”. Read the “Bread of Life” discourse in John’s Gospel, chapter 6. After this teaching we are told that many of Jesus’ disciples no longer walked with Him. Nowhere do we read that Jesus, upset that He had hurt their feelings, watered down or retracted His “hard teaching” in an effort to smooth things over and regain their adulation.

At my wedding, most of the groom’s side did not receive Holy Communion (because they were Protestants). The priest unabashedly made it clear that Communion was reserved for Catholics who were in the state of grace.
The best way, in my personal opinion, is to let God decide such issues. I know many Catholics who do not believe in transubstantiation. Now, is there communion valid?
Sadly, according to recent polls, upwards of 90% of Catholics do not believe in the dogma–yes, it is a dogma of the Church–of Transubstantiation. Catholics are bound in conscience, under pain of mortal sin, to believe in the dogmas of the Church. (Not because the Church is full of big meanies who want to flex their hierarchical muscles, but because our denial of the truths of our faith puts us in danger of losing our salvation.)

Ignorance is one thing (and I think that most Catholics who deny Transubstantiation have simply not adequately been taught the doctrine), but formal heresy/apostasy is quite another. Deliberately receiving Communion in the latter state would constitute grave sin.
Very complicated. God certainly can figure it out far better than we can.
Code:
 Oh, when a non-Catholic serviceman attends mass in Iraq and takes communion, what then? I know of such a circumstance. He explained later that this was the only communion available to him at that time, and he thought the normal rules were suspended.
True. Sometimes very touchy; sometimes very complicated. But that does not give us license to remain ignorant (and ashamed) of our Faith, nor to turn tail and run every time we encounter difficulty due to our attempts to genuinely follow the Gospel and to live holy lives.
 
The Holy Spirit guides the Church, not individual clergy.
Well, that’s the argument: which position is supported by Church teaching? The mere fact that a statement was made by a priest is no guarantee whatever that the comment was correct.
Ender
Granted, priests also make errors.

On December 15, 2009, Pope Benedict XVI issued the motu proprio Omnium in Mentem, which amended five canons (1008, 1009, 1086, 1117, 1124) of the 1983 Code of Canon Law clarifying that, among those in Holy Orders, only bishops and priests received the power and mission to act in the person of Christ the Head.

Further "The Church teaches that the one true God, our Creator and Lord, can be known with certainty from his works, by the natural light of human REASON [cf. Vatican Council I, can. 2 # 1: DS 3026.].

CCC 156…Thus the miracles of Christ and the saints, prophecies, the Church’s growth and holiness, and her fruitfulness and stability ‘are the most certain signs of divine Revelation, adapted to the intelligence of all’; they are ‘motives of credibility’ (motiva credibilitatis), which show that the assent of faith is ‘by no means a blind impulse of the mind’.[Dei Filius: 3: DS 3008-3010; Cf. Mk 16 20 ; Heb 2:4 .]"

Words are always disjunctive - we are all subject to understanding scripture, canon law, etc through scripture, tradition and reason under the authority of the bishops and priests who have the authority to act in the person of Christ.

To the extent that there clearly remains division among bishops and priests on this matter (and inaction as you so noted) a rational person can observe that the full understanding and perhaps larger truth remains to be grasped.
 
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