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Try post 121.
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onenow1
Guest
Thanks
understood !
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Lisa44
Guest
Hi Onenow1Hi, Sig
Jesus redeemed us, loosened the bonds of sin, {temptation- satan} but we must work out our salvation.Philippians 2:12 Matt. 7: 21, Matt. 24:13, 1Cor 9:27, 1Cor.10: 11-12,
Peace
Welcome back Sig!
1 Cor 10:13 says God will provide an escape from temptation.
Phil 2:13 says God works in us to will and to act for His purpose.
1 Cor 9:27 is merely descriptive of how the speaker prepares himself to win people over.
Matt 7:21 is about false prophets who Jesus never knew.
Matt 24:13 is about signs of the end. And it assures that believers will endure to the end.
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onenow1
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Hi,Lisa So we thank God for the institution of confession, as we jump out of the Lords hand, whether from omission or commision, and need to right ourselves once more, it becomes, not just our duty to do so; it is a command. The log in my eye comes to mind.
To paraphrase St.Thomas Aquinas: God offers help to all; only they do not get it who shut
themselves off from it.
Peace
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Lisa44
Guest
Does that contradict Canon 22 ?(Trent on Justification)
If anyone says that the one justified either can without the special help of God persevere in the justice received,[123] or that with that help he cannot, let him be anathema.
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onenow1
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Not at all.
Canon 29.
If anyone says that he who has fallen after baptism cannot by the grace of God rise again,[130] or that he can indeed recover again the lost justice but by faith alone without the sacrament of penance, contrary to what the holy Roman and Universal Church, instructed by Christ the Lord and His Apostles, has hitherto professed, observed and taught, let him be anathema.
Peace
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Sig
Guest
Correct, the believer has metabeino, moved from the state of spiritual death to spiritual life, and thus there is no judgment.
I can think of no statement in scripture indicating that men move back and forth between the states of physical death, and physical life, but if you say there are such statements, please cite them.
Please cite any verse in which it is stated salvation can be lost.
You haven’t answered my questions.
Either go back and answer my questions, and provide proof that “disqualified = loss of salvation,” and that “falling = loss of salvation,” or tell me that you cannot answer those questions. This conversation is stopped until you either answer those questions, or until you tell me you cannot answer them.
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Sig
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This is the fourth time you’ve posted that list of verses.Hi, Sig
Jesus redeemed us, loosened the bonds of sin, {temptation- satan} but we must work out our salvation.Philippians 2:12 Matt. 7: 21, Matt. 24:13, 1Cor 9:27, 1Cor.10: 11-12,
Peace
I’ve responded to those verses, but you’re ignoring my responses.
Because you continue to ignore my reponses I must conclude that you are unable to answer my questions regarding the verses you cite above, and I must also conclude that you cannot prove that “disqualified = loss of salvation,” nor you can you prove that “falling = loss of salvation.”
Thank you.
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Sig
Guest
Two things.
First, God has determined not only the “ends,” but the means." The means of salvation is that faith comes by hearing the word about Christ (Rom 10:17).
Second, in the Great Commission, Jesus commanded evangelism, and that’s reason enough to do it.
God bless.
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hunter123
Guest
Which God exactly? You mean the God who committed genocide against Sodom and Gomorah ? The God that said he would punish a peoples transgressions for generations? Or the God that said, accept jesus as Lord and savior and no matter what you do you will be saved? I am starting to think your God has a major personality disorder.
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hunter123
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tms.edu/tmsj/tmsj11c.pdf You mean that great commission?
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Sig
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I see. You are then, a believer in a multiplicity of gods? Which branch of Catholicism teaches that?
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Sig
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I see. So you also believe in a multiplicity of Great Commissions.
The one to which I’m referring is in Mt 28.
God bless.
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Lisa44
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That doesn’t answer the question I asked you.
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Odell
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Ver. 4. &c. For it is impossible,[1] &c. This is an obscure place, differently expounded, which shows how rash it is for the ignorant to pretend to understand the holy Scriptures. Many understand these words, it is impossible, &c. of the sacrament of penance, or of returning to God by a profitable repentance, especially after such heinous sins as an apostacy from the true faith. But then we must take the word impossible, to imply no more than a thing that is very hard to be done, or that seldom happens, as when it is said, (Matthew xix. 26.) that it is impossible for rich men to be saved: and (Luke xvii. 1.) it is impossible that scandals should not come. For it is certain that it is never impossible for the greatest sinners to repent by the assistance which God offers them, who has also left the power to his ministers to forgive in his name the greatest sins. But others (whose interpretation seems preferable) expound this of baptism, which can only be given once. The words here in the text very much favour this exposition, when it is said, who were once enlightened. For baptism in the first ages was called the sacrament of illumination. See St. Denis de cælesti Hierar. chap. iv.; St. Gregory of Nazianzus; &c. The following words also agree with baptism, when they are said to have been made partakers of the Holy Ghost; to have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come; all which signify the interior graces, the miraculous gifts, and power of working miracles, which they who were baptized frequently received in those days. — They cannot be renewed again unto penance. That is, they cannot be renewed again by baptism, which is also called a renovation. (Titus iii. 5.) Their sins may indeed be forgiven them in the sacrament of penance, but this is not a renovation like that in baptism, in which both the guilt, and all pain due to past sins, is remitted; whereas in the sacrament of penance, though the guilt, and the eternal punishments due to sins be remitted, yet many times, temporal punishments, to be undergone either in this world or the next, still remain due to such as have been great sinners, to them who by relapsing into the same sins, have crucified again to themselves the Son of God, making a mockery of him; i.e. who, insensible of the favours received, have ungratefully renewed sin; to take away which Christ suffered, was mocked, crucified, &c. (Witham) — Macknight observes that Beza, without any authority from ancient manuscripts hath inserted in his version Si, If they shall fall away, that this text might not appear to contradict the Calvinistic doctrine of the assurance of salvation. The English translators have followed Beza. The biblical student will be glad to find Dr. Wells, in his elegant edition of the New Testament, frequently restoring and preferring those readings which agree with the Latin Vulgate. The same just tribute is paid to the Vulgate by Walton, Mills, Gerard, Griesbach, Harwood, and others. Indeed the Vulgate has been declared authentic in a general council, and probably expresses more of the true reading of the original or autograph, than any Greek edition that is now to be found, and certainly much more than modern versions, which are stained more or less by the preconceived sentiments of the translators. — For the earth that drinketh in the rain, &c. He bringeth this comparison, to give them a horror of abusing God’s graces and favours, and of making themselves guilty of hell fire. (Witham)
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Odell
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Luke 15:
***31 “‘My son,’ the father said, ‘you are always with me, and everything I have is yours. 32 But we had to celebrate and be glad, because this brother of yours was dead and is alive again; he was lost and is found.’”
Heb 10:
*26 If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, 27 but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God. 28 Anyone who rejected the law of Moses died without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 How much more severely do you think someone deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified them, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him who said, “It is mine to avenge; I will repay,”[d] and again, “The Lord will judge his people.”[e] 31 It is a dreadful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
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hunter123
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If you read the article you would get my point. I find your statement ironic, coming from a protestant. Which multiplicity of denominations do you belong to??
Lets see since the church was 1 up until the 15th century it seems like you are the one creating something out of nothing.
Are you a born again Christian? If so, read the epistle of James and then get back to me. Because faith without works is dead
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Sig
Guest
And if you’d read Mt 28, you’d know which Great Commission to which I was referring.
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Sig
Guest
Oh, you were trying to be funny?
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