Students rally around tux-wearing teen left out of yearbook

[DrTaffy]

Yes, if the dress code prohibits the wearing of jewelry, don’t wear jewelry, religious or secular. What’s so hard about following a dress code?

And yet christians have objected to such rules, even to the point of refusing to engage with an explicit mechanism put in place to allow people to ask for religious exceptions to be made, and many here and elsewhere have applauded their brave and heroic response to the totalitarian and utterly unnacceptable dress code.

Compare and contrast with what happens when it is a Catholic establishment forcing rules on a liberal.

That, in a nutshell, is my very simple point.

 

[DrTaffy]

Do you suggest that the school’s dress code for the yearbook photo was an unjust rule?

It is certainly far less justified than the laws against businesses discriminating against protected classes, so yes. The girl was perfectly decently and smartly dressed.

 

[Bruised_Reed]

Yes there are gray areas. Ralph Lauren has many feminine tuxedo styles.

I think this looks very cute:

pinterest.com/pin/550354016935429332/

But that advanced level of fashion is rare for a teen to be embracing, and schools adopt bright line rules so they don’t have to make judgment calls about this kind of thing.

If you mean designer tuxes, yes it might be an advanced level but only because it’s out of their price range. Some teens are more fashion forward and experimental and a girl wearing a tuxedo would be fun. Ever since Diane Keaton wore a tux to the Oscars the tux is up for grabs.

 

[estesbob]

I believe the school made two mistakes here.The first was allowing Her to bring a “girlfriend” to the Prom.The second was not letting her know in enough time to have her picture retaken that the picture was not acceptable.

 

[Bruised_Reed]

I believe the school made two mistakes here.The first was allowing Her to bring a “girlfriend” to the Prom.The second was not letting her know in enough time to have her picture retaken that the picture was not acceptable.

I don’t think Prom had anything to do with this situation. And even if it did, are only boy-girl couples allowed? Does that mean uncoupled students can’t go stag?

 

[Bruised_Reed]

Sacred Heart Cathedral Preparatory released a statement:

shcp.edu/news/2014/05/letter-our-community

The school and Jessica and her parents handled this in a very gracious manner.

 

[Havard]

CROSS DRESSING??!!

So…are the females in this school allowed to wear pants and “cross dress” on other days during the year, just not for the school yearbook photo?

Do you consider every woman who wears pants as “cross-dressing”?

Sister Helen Prejean, 75, a very famous and well-respected Roman Catholic nun who has been the Religious Education Director at St. Frances Cabrini Parish in New Orleans and has been given many awards for her work, including the Catholic “World Pacem in Terris Peace and Freedom Award” and the “Pax Christi USA Pope Paul VI Teacher of Peace Award”…has worn pantsuits the majority of her adult life.

Would you consider her a major cross-dresser?

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I can’t answer for Holly, but one can easily draw lines between wearing pantsuits and tuxedos. Tuxedos are worn in settings where dress codes and protocol are observed, and in such cases, they are prescribed for men only. Pantsuits, on the other hand, are worn in informal/business settings where custom rules, not dress codes or protocol.

 

[estesbob]

The school and Jessica and her parents handled this in a very gracious manner.

Yes they did.

 

[estesbob]

I don’t think Prom had anything to do with this situation. And even if it did, are only boy-girl couples allowed? Does that mean uncoupled students can’t go stag?

I think all of can recognize the difference between going stag and a woman going with her professed “girlfriend” ,

 

[Thorns]

What a ridiculous, archaic rule.
When was this policy made…during the Civil War?

Glorifying homosexuality is pretty archaic too. When did they do that, in ancient Greece?

 

[SMGS127]

Glorifying homosexuality is pretty archaic too. When did they do that, in ancient Greece?

This has nothing to do with homosexuality. A girl felt more comfortable in a tux than a dress, Some girls don’t like dressing uber-feminine. There’s no need to bring a debate over homosexuality into the thread, as it’s irrelevant. The girl’s sexuality is irrelevant as to whether she feels more comfortable in a tux or a dress.

 

[estesbob]

This has nothing to do with homosexuality. A girl felt more comfortable in a tux than a dress, Some girls don’t like dressing uber-feminine. There’s no need to bring a debate over homosexuality into the thread, as it’s irrelevant. The girl’s sexuality is irrelevant as to whether she feels more comfortable in a tux or a dress.

Did you read the Schools statement? The core of this is her homosexuality.

 

[estesbob]

Eggggg-xactly!

Students shouldn’t be forced to conform to outdated gender norms," spokeswoman Rebecca Farmer tweeted, with a photo of male and female ACLU staff members wearing ties.

Emanuel told reporters: “I support my girlfriend. I love my school, and I want to make it as good as it can be for people like us. I’d like my girlfriend to be proud of the four years that she’s been here, and I’d like it to be resolved in a way that future kids feel proud to be a Fightin’ Irish, feel proud to be who they are.”

Straight, gay, bi, transgender, all that, they’re all welcome at Sacred Heart Cathedral," he said. "At the same time we’re going to be clear in terms of being a Catholic institution, what the Catholic Church teaches and how do we live out that faith in a meaningful way and in a supportive way with all of our students."
*
I believe it’s right to show herself for who she really is," said junior Erik Wassmer*

 

[Havard]

Well, I don’t know about other cities…but here in NYC and also when I’ve been invited to major black tie events in other major cities including LA, Paris, and London where politicians and celebrities and royalty attend…“black tie” has included tuxedos for women and I’ve seen many wearing them.

As you describe, this school photo was indeed a situation of “dress codes and protocol” it seems…which is exactly why a tuxedo was a great idea.
I bet this student was more elegantly and fastidiously dressed for her photo than all her classmates.
In fact, I think she’s started a new trend and 5-Star standard for Year Book Photo Attire.

.

Dress protocol is going to be less observed at certain “creative black tie” (an expression I personally dislike) functions, especially among company who frown on formal etiquette. I am from San Francisco, where avant-garde has ever been all the rage, however dress protocol is still observed at traditional functions, like the Cotillion. The International Debutante Ball in NYC is the same. If you’re in the Town & Country audience, you’ll see more creative attire at semi formal benefits for the arts or Vanity Fair fêtes, but not at balls or diplomatic functions, where protocol is very observed. If one isn’t sure whether attire is black tie or “creative black tie”, one should inquire.

If Jessica didn’t know there was a dress code at all (which it sounds like is the case?), sure, the tuxedo might seem like a creative idea. But if she had known, dresses were required, then it would have just been disobedient. As for her classmates, why assume any comparisons about their dress?

 

[vz71]

It is certainly far less justified than the laws against businesses discriminating against protected classes, so yes. The girl was perfectly decently and smartly dressed.

So you believe that the rule specifying dress code for the yearbook photo would be immoral to follow.

What particular church teaching do you believe it violates?

 

[vz71]

What a ridiculous, archaic rule.
When was this policy made…during the Civil War?

Irrelevant.

This girl’s attire wasn’t necessarily an “attempt to stand out” or be a “rebel”. Oy vey.
Some girls don’t even own dresses. And what difference does it make in the photo, if you can’t even see below the breastbone?

Is it difficult to wear a dress?
YES, for some, it IS. I find it very, very uncomfortable and difficult to wear a dress for a multitude of reasons, so I rarely wear them. Wearing a dress brings on a variety of issues and problems to contend with for some girls of certain shapes.

Where is it documented that she does not own a dress? Where is it documented that she cannot dress appropriately?
I believe the arguments you posed here are called red herrings.
They sound good, but have little meaning to the actual case at hand.

It’s got nothing to do with sexuality or religion. I’m not gay. In fact, many people have told me I’m the most “female” and “feminine” woman they’ve ever met. Still, I cannot bear wearing dresses and rarely do.
Wearing a dress doesn’t show how female a woman is or how faithful she is to a religion.
How does “living out the faith” translate to a girl having to wear a dress for a school photo that doesn’t even show the dress? Where is the logic here?

Irrelevant.

Wearing a tuxedo, as this girl did, is a wonderful alternative…it’s even more formal and more “respectful” than a dress would be.

Abiding by rules is one thing.
Abiding by a nonsensical rule that is out of date with the current fashion and era is ridiculous. Stupid rules were made to be broken and it takes a person with their eyes open to illustrate this, as this girl is.

Stupid rules are not so when they are made.
If you believe a rule nonsensical, then you should work to change the rule.
Not exonerate those that choose to break it.

To put it into a religious context…even Jesus came and said people didn’t have to follow the old rules that did not apply anymore.
I wonder what the boys have to wear per this school’s photo policy–breeches, stockings, and top hats?
Please.
.

So Jesus meant for the girl to break the rule.
Are we also to intuit that Jesus does not wish the consequences for the rule breaking to be?

 

[Sarcelle]

Irrelevant.

Where is it documented that she does not own a dress? Where is it documented that she cannot dress appropriately?
I believe the arguments you posed here are called red herrings.
They sound good, but have little meaning to the actual case at hand.

Actually the answers you are refuting in your statements above answers to the question:

How difficult it is to wear a dress?

She was not implying that the girl in question did not own a dress or found it difficult.to wear a dress. She was just answering the question stated above.

 

[Havard]

Not assuming, but observing.
It looks as tho no one else–no other males or females–dressed up in black tie for the photo.

.

Eh? What source is reporting that?

The school had said Urbina’s outfit was a violation of its dress code, which stated boys wear tuxedos in their yearbook photos, while girls wear dresses.

sfexaminer.com/sanfrancisco/sacred-heart-cathedral-prep-issues-apology-will-include-photo-of-girl-wearing-a-tux-in-yearbook/Content?oid=2803478

Senior Jessica Urbina wore a tuxedo for her senior graduation photo she took in September. That’s against the Sacred Heart Cathedral’s dress code. Girls traditionally wear what’s called a drape, boys wear the tux."

abc7news.com/education/sf-students-protest-ban-of-girls-tux-photo-/63411/

Jessica Urbina, a senior at the Catholic high school, had her portrait taken last fall and elected to wear the tuxedo jacket and black bow-tie made available to boys instead of the black off-the-shoulder drape offered to girls."

foxnews.com/us/2014/05/17/girl-left-out-high-school-yearbook-for-wearing-tux/

This is an example for drape (image from a photography blog):

http://blog.dennispkelly.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Session-Types-yearbook.jpg

If you do an image search for Sacred Heart Cathedral’s yearbook photos, you’ll see that this is exactly what they have worn in past years.

 

[SeannyM]

The prohibition on cross dressing is is a typical Catholic stance, based on our interpretation of Scripture.

So are you saying that the Catholic stance is generally just based on hatred, or are you saying something specifically about the administrators at Sacred Heart Cathedral that supports that they based this rule on hatred? If so, what is it you know about them that supports this?

I’m saying a few things,
1, a woman wearing a tux is not “cross dressing”
2, the rule isn’t based on scripture, there’s no prohibition on wearing tuxes in the bible
3, the intent of the rule is unimportant… The result is that it harms a young lady who chooses to express herself by wearing a tux.

 

[estesbob]

I’m saying a few things,
1, a woman wearing a tux is not “cross dressing”
2, the rule isn’t based on scripture, there’s no prohibition on wearing tuxes in the bible
3, the intent of the rule is unimportant… The result is that it harms a young lady who chooses to express herself by wearing a tux.

This woman was publicly affirming her homosexuality. She wore the same Tux to the prom where she took her **girlfriend. **If you the news article and the School statement you will see that her open homosexuality was the cause of this problem-nor merely wearing the Tux. the School was walking a fine line between showing love and compassion for a student and affirming her sin. I think in the the School, the Girl her parents came to an agreement that was good for all involved.