The Assumption

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Mary’s humanity was given to Jesus, His Body and Blood. He is True Man and True God.

I see Mary as the bridge between humanity and God. She was a creature like us but especially graced.

There is projection coming from past preachers who, particularly those who spoke so much against Mary, are doing the work of Satan.

Revelations speak of the locusts who have the power to poison men’s souls. You look at the world today, the self-degrading choices of women, the breakdown of the family, abortion and infanticide, violence…

True woman is gentle, loving, kind, thoughtful, and is drawn to the love and care of the young and old.

How much of this side of woman do you see in society today, in the media, in movies and television programs?

It is very clear to me that St. Louis de Montfort was correct in saying that Mary was reserved for the latter days, so that she could prepare us for Christ. I have witnessed dying people seeing themselves unpresentable to God, fearing He will not forgive them. The Blessed Mother’s presence was made known and gave them confidence in God so they could face Him with peace and trust before their dying moments.

Look at the beasts called men who are so violent, in a continual state of domination and hatred, and subjugate their women to chattel. We are seeing that today.

Blessed Mother can bring us so much closer to Christ and help us to heaven than any other person.

Mary was the human means through which Christ came into the world, and she will be the means through which Christ returns.

Pope Francis will consecrate the world to the Immaculate Heart of Mary come this fall.

Again, without understanding the Mass and Christ worship in the universal Christian church, facing the piercing barrage of anti-Catholic preacher men with little education that are piercing your souls, it is very difficult to come to understand her ongoing work in the Church and in the mission of salvation and redemption.
 
not true -we honor Mary the Virgin as the “Theotokos” the God Bearer -despite being a teen ager -unmarried and likely poor she said YES to God’s call-she is to be Praised
:o
 
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Alizarin:
Quote:

Originally Posted by concretecamper

OK…no heresy here. Nothing that even borders on heresy. What is so close to heresy?

I thought it was obvious, but I’ll bold the text most Protestants would be wary of:
  1. It was through the Blessed Virgin Mary that Jesus came into the world, and it is also through her that he must reign in the world. (as though He couldn’t reign on His own without her)
  2. … the Blessed Virgin is all the more necessary for men to attain their final end. (Jesus never says Mary is necessary for salvation). Consequently we must not place devotion to her on the same level as devotion to the other saints as if it were merely something optional. (Devotion is mandated?)
  3. If devotion to the Blessed Virgin is necessary for all men simply to work out their salvation (Same problem as above), it is even more necessary for those who are called to a special perfection.
  4. … To go to Jesus, we should go to Mary, our mediatrix of intercession. (Can’t we go to jesus directly?)
Those are things that seem heretical to many Protestants. You should familiarize yourself with common objections, so you can, as a Catholic, argue effectively against them.
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Again…these are not heresies. And if they make you uncomfortable then I submit you do not understand the gospel, Church Fathers, the Old Testament.

My ability to argue does nothing in converting souls. Only The Holy Spirit can change hearts and souls. My job is not to argue but present the catholic perspective…which I am more than able to do if the spirit moves me.

If these examples make Protestant uneasy, what if the 5th Marian dogma is proclaimed: Mary: Coredemptrix, Mediatrix, Advocate. It is sort of like raising the stakes…isn’t it?

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Alizarin:
Quote:

Originally Posted by concretecamper

Again…these are not heresies.

Not within the framework of the Catholic faith, no. Of course not. But you asked me to elaborate on the Protestant view, and so I did… I hope it helps.
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It does help…thank you. Protestant can only go so far with the Blessed Mother. We will be OK with her but remember, she was just like you and me, only more holy.

Through this exchange, it occurred to me. In John 6, Jesus raised the stakes. The people were so offended that He said they needed to eat His flesh. His response, you have to also drink my blood.

Now, Jesus through His Church is about to raise the stakes. You have a tough time with my Mother…well wait to I proclaim the 5th Marian dogma. Raising the stakes again!! Praise be Jesus!!

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concretecamper said:
You have a tough time with my Mother…well wait to I proclaim the 5th Marian dogma. Raising the stakes again!! Praise be Jesus!!
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Speaking personally, I don’t have a difficult time with Mary. When I was Catholic I wore the brown scapular, prayed the rosary every day and the Little Office. I even went through de Monfort’s “total consecration” to Mary.

Nowadays I’m still a fan of Mary, but de Monfort’s language can make me a little uneasy. But it works for a Catholic, hey, go with it…to each their own…
 
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Alizarin:
Quote:

Originally Posted by concretecamper

You have a tough time with my Mother…well wait to I proclaim the 5th Marian dogma. Raising the stakes again!! Praise be Jesus!!

Speaking personally, I don’t have a difficult time with Mary. When I was Catholic I wore the brown scapular, prayed the rosary every day and the Little Office. I even went through de Monfort’s “total consecration” to Mary.

Nowadays I’m still a fan of Mary, but de Monfort’s language can make me a little uneasy. But it works for a Catholic, hey, go with it…to each their own…
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Why don’t you give wearing the brown scapular another try?

Posted from Catholic.com App for Android
 
Alizarin said:
Because I felt trapped by it. I felt trapped a lot, actually. I hate that feeling.
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The devils revealed to Francis of Yepes, the brother of St. John of the Cross that three things especially tormented them. The first is the NAME OF JESUS; the second, the NAME OF MARY; and third, THE BROWN SCAPULAR OF OUR LADY OF MOUNT CARMEL. “Take off that habit,” they cried to him, “which snatches too many souls from us. All those clothed in it die piously and escape us.”

I would ask you pray about it more.
 
concretecamper said:
The devils revealed to Francis of Yepes, the brother of St. John of the Cross that three things especially tormented them. The first is the NAME OF JESUS; the second, the NAME OF MARY; and third, THE BROWN SCAPULAR OF OUR LADY OF MOUNT CARMEL. “Take off that habit,” they cried to him, “which snatches too many souls from us. All those clothed in it die piously and escape us.”

I would ask you pray about it more.
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I appreciate the sentiment. But I’m enjoying what feels to me like fresh air. 🙂
 
Remember_Me said:
pablope;11103165:
Thank you, and thanks for the link. 🙂 By no means do I want to offend anyone and I hope it didn’t come across that way. My Protestant mind doesn’t understand the Catholic concept of honoring Mary. No offense. Maybe in time, and with prayer, I’ll understand.
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Remember_Me,

Let me show you the minds of Catholics of the New Testament

Angel Gabriel: Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women.

Elizabeth: And Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Ghost: Filled with the Holy Ghost, this only means that the Holy Spirit, Himself has the mind of a Catholic, because it was the Holy Spirit telling Elizabeth what to say re: Virgin Mary. Amen

Elizabeth: 42And she cried out with a loud voice, and said: Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb

Elizabeth: 43And whence is this to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?

Elizabeth: 44For behold as soon as the voice of thy salutation sounded in my ears, the infant in my womb leaped for joy.

John the Baptist: When he heard Mary’s Voice He Leapt for Joy.

St. Joseph: Took Mary as his wife even though Joseph knows the true spouse of Virgin Mary is the Holy Spirit.

Prophesy of Simeon: 35And thy own soul a sword shall pierce, that, out of many hearts, thoughts may be revealed.

St. John: Heard the Words of Jesus Christ on the cross and took in Virgin Mary as Mother into his home.

A Woman in the crowd: 27And it came to pass, as he spoke these things, a certain woman from the crowd, lifting up her voice, said to him: Blessed is the womb that bore thee, and the paps that gave thee suck.

Jesus Christ: 28But he said: Yea rather, blessed are they who hear the word of God, and keep it. Remember_Me, Jesus Christ here is praising His Mother Mary and not puting Her down, how do we know this? Because who hears the Word of God and Keeps it better than His Own Mother Mary, I tell you no one! Amen

Holy Spirit: Inspired Gabriel, Elizabeth, John the Baptist, Simeon to say, what they said, to do what they did, re: Virgin Mary. It is the Holy Spirit in the Catholic Church that inspire us to this very day, to say what they said, to do what they did, re: Virgin Mary. Amen

Virgin Mary: filled with the Holy Spirit said of Herself, All Generations shall Call me Blessed.

Remember_Me, tell me the truth, would you consider Elizabeth, Baby John, Joseph, Simeon, the woman in the crowed, and the Holy Spirit himself above to be Protestant or Catholic?

Or I should say if you heard someone say: Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb. Remember_me would you consider them to be Protestant or Catholic?

If you say they sound more like Catholic, you are correct:thumbsup: Perhaps in time the Holy Spirit will inspire you with the same Grace to Honor Virgin Mary as the above and as Catholic worldwide do. Amen

Remember_Me, When was the Last time you called Virgin Mayr Blessed? One Time at Christmas is not enough. Virgin Mary should be called blessed and Remembered on a daily basis if not more. Amen

God Bless You,

Ufam Tobie
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Steveabrous said:
The whole point to being protestant is that it’s not Catholic. So anything that could be considered Catholic was tossed away by the future denominations (except Christmas because they think they invented it).
Mary is seen as a “Catholic” thing so they took it way to fart and see her as just another person.
Many churches are starting to realize that wasn’t far and starting to look more favorable towards her.
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I agree don’t you just hate when people take things to fart!:tiphat::rotfl: Sorry but you just gave me my giggle for the day!😃
 
concretecamper said:
We took a last minute trip to Cape May attended the 11 AM mass at none other than Our Lady Star of the Sea. It was standing room only and I was moved to tears of gladness that so many people came to honor Our Lady. The readings and gospel were filled with so many theological truths that it got me wondering. Where did the protestant movement lose sight of Our Lady. Luther in particular had a deep reverence for Mary. But today, it seems all protestants consider Mary as a foot note. Where in history did this change? Are all denominations similar in their view of Mary? I am not trying to pick an argument, I just wonder what happened?
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Luther’s writing is peppered with references to Mary, all of them positive.

I am a Lutheran and I tend towards agreeing with Luther that Mary was a perpetual virgin.

But I also agree that all the Mary doctrines are adiaphora and “pious belief”. And I would never say that believing in them or not believing in them is necessary for salvation.
 
House_Harkonnen said:
Luther’s writing is peppered with references to Mary, all of them positive.

I am a Lutheran and I tend towards agreeing with Luther that Mary was a perpetual virgin.

But I also agree that all the Mary doctrines are adiaphora and “pious belief”. And I would never say that believing in them or not believing in them is necessary for salvation.
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A true legalistic view of salavation.
 
totally agree, Protestants just see Mary as something negative.

We honor St. Mary the Virgin - she is the Theotokos -the God Bearer-she has free will and as a young teenage unmarried girl she said yes to God- she is a MAJOR saint-

we are not hung up on whether she had other children or not-on the Assumption I have never heard it spoken about at all -individual Anglicans can believe as they want

We certainly do not view Her as a negative
:cool:
 
House_Harkonnen said:
Luther’s writing is peppered with references to Mary, all of them positive.

**I am a Lutheran and I tend towards agreeing with Luther that Mary was a perpetual virgin. **

But I also agree that all the Mary doctrines are adiaphora and “pious belief”. And I would never say that believing in them or not believing in them is necessary for salvation.
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What is sad is the number of Lutherans in America who do not believe in the perpetual virginity, adiaphora or not. It is in the confessions, and I am not aware of one significant Lutheran theologian who did not.

Jon
 
Is there a near enough date for the Assumption of May the Virgin -she must have been 46 or so near the Crucifixion -that would be quite old for the time

Also where is the information of the Blessed Virgin being in Ephesus? -only because St. John was there?
:cool:
 
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