I missed something here. Impotence is not the same as the inability to procreate because of a medical condition such as sterility and therefore two separate issues. Do you agree?
Yes - but since I have a vagina, and not male genitalia, I cannot consummate a marriage to another female. It’s the sex act that’s vital, not fertility.
Another point that perhaps needs further explanation. You say you can only marry man in Australia but only a women in the UK. That confuses me.
You too, eh? The logic escapes me as well.
Does that mean that the denial is by the Catholic Church and/or other religious denominations or might it also apply to state sanctioned marriage? And how does that differ between the two countries? Please expand.
In strictly secular terms, it’s absolutely clear that I can only marry a woman in Australia and a man in the UK, because same-sex marriage is anathema to the secular authorities, based on religious convictions expressed by members of Parliament.
I’m legally female in terms of the Australian Federal Law - which covers marriage - but male under state and territory law. The Federal Department of Health deems me female because of strictly biological considerations. Anatomy(partly artificial) and Endocrinology(natural).
Conversely, in the UK, I’m male for the purposes of the marriage act, but female when it comes to Immigration and Passport control. I have no idea what the NHS would say, I suspect it would depend on the individual Health Trust.
In terms of Religious law, individual Bishops and Archbishops within both the Catholic and Anglican churches would regard me as either a mutilated male (so able to marry if Anglican, but not if Catholic), or as a female, thus unable to marry at all due to their responsibilities under secular law. Both are quite clear what I am, they just disagree with one another. The Magisterium has yet to rule, and the only documents remotely relating to the subject were sent
sub secretum and so are not available for analysis.
What individual protestant, orthodox, copt, marionite etc sects would say I have no idea. Orthodox Jews would be split on whether I’m male or female, but to Reformed Jews I’m female. Sunni Muslims consider me male, Shia, female. Buddhists - I must ask.
I of course have no say in the issue.
From my memory it seems Chantor/Cantor was rather more a moralist than an adherent of scripture. I would have to research that though.
I’m thinking of
De vitio sodomitico from circa 1180, which you are doubtless familiar with. But for lurkers and other readers, here’s a partial translation:
The Lord formed man from the slime of the earth on the plan of Damascus, later fashioning woman from his rib in Eden. Thus in considering the formation of woman, lest any should believe they would be hermaphrodites, he stated, “Male and female created he them,” as if to say, “There will not be intercourse of men with men or women with women, but only of men with women and vice versa.” For this reason the church allows a hermaphrodite — that is, someone with the organs of both sexes, capable of either active or passive functions — to use the organ by which (s)he is most aroused or the one which (s)he is more susceptible.
If (s)he is more active [literally, “lustful], (s)he may wed as a man, but if (s)he is more passive, (s)he may marry as a woman. If; however, (s)he should fail with one organ, the use of the other can never be permitted, but (s)he must be perpetually celibate to avoid any similarity to the role inversion of sodomy, which is detested by God.
Even he didn’t consider 5 alpha reductase 2 deficiency syndrome, which can cause a natural sex change from female to male. Or 17β-hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase type 3 deficiency. Or any of the (6?) much rarer syndromes that are still not well understood that can cause the opposite, a change from male to female.
This policy as you say has been abrogated now anyway. The Church tells you what sex you “really” are. It might take a few decades, or even centuries, though to get an answer. Or you can go to a Bishop, Archbishop, or Cardinal and get an immediate, uninformed, but very strongly-held and unshakable opinion. Ask three, you’ll even get at least two the same.
I’m sorry if I sound bitter. Actually, I’m more wryly amused at the logic-chopping and arguments than anything else. Most theologians would just like to pretend that people like me don’t exist, we get put in the “too hard” basket. That leaves local clergy to make uninformed decisions as to whether I’m eternally damned if I have sex with a man, or a woman. Remember
I am as God made me.
The funniest situation was one I heard of in Mexico. Two Intersexed people wanted to get married. There was uproar as to whether this was a gay, lesbian, straight (male and female) or straight (female and male) relationship. Clerics came to blows over the issue. The same kind of thing I’ve witnessed at the Church of the Holy Sepulchre in Jerusalem.
Forgive me for not taking the ban on same-sex relationships seriously. This is Theological and Moral Farce. If I believed in God, I’d be sorely tempted to believe that those who are like me were put on this Earth just to tell the Theologs to wake up, and when in doubt, follow the “love thy neighbour” principle. To act with compassion when the situation is unclear.
