I believe you do not understand what Genesis means in the context of the OP.What do you believe?
Is knowledge good or evil?You believe that God is good. He however created a tree which has the knowledge of good and evil which is contrary to the concept of God goodness.
A paradox that only exists in your mind. In another word, fiction.Hence you are in a paradoxical situation that you cannot resolve.
Does not mean what you think it means.So you define evil as lack of good which doesn’t resolve the paradox since evil is real. First because you experience it yet deny it. Moreover you are trapped since you cannot possibly comprehend what could the tree of knowledge mean when evil is interpreted as lack of good since if the tree is evil then it could not be good and vice versa.
It does. Geneses 2:17.
Does not mean what you think it means.What would like to call instead of container? The tree has the fruit which was forbidden since you would know the knowledge of good and evil when you eat it.
It does. Geneses 2:17…
Defend your OP.So you and your teacher are mislead since you cannot provide a consistence picture to me by providing a solid argument!
Hold it! Your statement which I am asking you to verify isIt is simple to understand this:
Which one do you pick up (from (4))?
- Evil is absence of good (what you believe)
- There exists a tree with the fruit which eating the fruit grants the knowledge of good and evil
- You cannot possibly have a fruit which could contain the knowledge of evil and good because of (1). In simple word, the fruit cannot be good if it is evil.
- This means that either (1) or (2) is wrong, the first one is your interpretation of good and evil whereas the second is the denial of what is clearly stated in Bible
You haven’t provided any scripture that states differently. If it is clearly claimed as you state than there must be scripture that states what is evil. Where is the scripture that you say is so claimed?that is contrary to what is clearly claimed in the scripture.
I think that I understand what Geneses means in the context my OP. There is a tree with a fruit that grant the knowledge of good and evil when the fruit is eaten. What do you think?I believe you do not understand what Genesis means in the context of the OP.
Knowledge is neither good nor evil. It the result of reflection what we experience whether what we experience is good or evil. What we experience could however be good or evil.Is knowledge good or evil?
This is paradox which exist in my mind and your mind. It is not a fiction unless what you believe is a fiction.A paradox that only exists in your mind. In another word, fiction.
What does it mean?Does not mean what you think it means.
Seriously!? What it means in your opinion?Does not mean what you think it means.
I am defending my OP. I am arguing that your position is wrong because there exist at least one internal inconsistency in your system of belief. What you receive as word of God must be 100% correct. Shouldn’t it be?Defend your OP.
That is Catholic interpretation of what evil is. Evil is the lack of good. There is no reference in Bible about what good and evil is hence. Do you have a definition of good and evil except what it is stated?Hold it! Your statement which I am asking you to verify is
What is evil? You are a Catholic hence you should know. It is man interpretation so it could be false!You haven’t provided any scripture that states differently. If it is clearly claimed as you state than there must be scripture that states what is evil. Where is the scripture that you say is so claimed?
Since you claim I have not provided an argument, how can you claim to know that it is wrong. This is baseless irrational opinion and a horrible display of discussion methods. Not to mention, very offensive.I think that I understand what Geneses means in the context my OP. There is a tree with a fruit that grant the knowledge of good and evil when the fruit is eaten. What do you think?
Knowledge is neither good nor evil. It the result of reflection what we experience whether what we experience is good or evil. What we experience could however be good or evil.
This is paradox which exist in my mind and your mind. It is not a fiction unless what you believe is a fiction.
What does it mean?
Seriously!? What it means in your opinion?
I am defending my OP. I am arguing that your position is wrong because there exist at least one internal inconsistency in your system of belief. What you receive as word of God must be 100% correct. Shouldn’t it be?
The OP is based on a false premise hence there is nothing to defend.That is Catholic interpretation of what evil is. Evil is the lack of good. There is no reference in Bible about what good and evil is hence. Do you have a definition of good and evil except what it is stated?
What is evil? You are a Catholic hence you should know. It is man interpretation so it could be false!
So you give up!? I need any of my comment to be addressed!Since you claim I have not provided an argument, how can you claim to know that it is wrong. This is baseless irrational opinion and a horrible display of discussion methods. Not to mention, very offensive.
Thank you for providing many examples of faulty logic.
On this topic, no. With you, maybe.So you give up!?
Your comments have been addressed. Why are you ignoring the objections. Repeating your claims does not explain them.I need any of my comment to be addressed!
There is nothing wrong with OP. You however must show what is wrong with my premises otherwise you are holding a defenseless position. It is very simple. The evil is interpreted as lack of good within Catholic community. It is however very clearly that the our current state of being is the result of man’s fall which was due to eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. The fruit must be good in one hand since it was creation of God. How could be evil then when evil means the lack of good? That is a contraction in front of your face but you cannot or don’t want to see it.The OP is based on a false premise hence there is nothing to defend.
Thanks.On this topic, no. With you, maybe.
You didn’t addressed anything so far. How something could be good and evil in the same time when evil means the lack of good? I couldn’t really make it simper than this. What is your answer?Your comments have been addressed. Why are you ignoring the objections. Repeating your claims does not explain them.
You stated that it was against scripture and then admitted there was no scriptureThere is nothing wrong with OP.
I already showed your premise was wrong. Your premise was that it was against scripture. You admitted that there was no scripture. The defenseless position is yours.You however must show what is wrong with my premises otherwise you are holding a defenseless position.
You have changed from the op. The problem you are having is that the fruit is symbolic of knowing good from evil. It isn’t saying that the fruit is both good and evil that is your misunderstanding.It is very simple. The evil is interpreted as lack of good within Catholic community. It is however very clearly that the our current state of being is the result of man’s fall which was due to eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. The fruit must be good in one hand since it was creation of God. How could be evil then when evil means the lack of good? That is a contraction in front of your face but you cannot or don’t want to see it.
Then the LORD God said: “See! The man has become like one of us, knowing what is good and what is bad! Therefore, he must not be allowed to put out his hand to take fruit from the tree of life also, and thus eat of it and live forever.”
No, its just that the Church has historically understood many teachings of the bible. You don’t seem to be so naive as to believe that much of the bible isn’t poetic, allegorical, metaphorical, symbolic, etc. Much of it has to be understood in the historical context in which it was written. So, for example, the Church understands that two literal first parents of all humanity, who we call Adam & Eve, existed and literally sinned against God by disobeying Him. Not *all *of the scene depicted in the story of creation and the Fall in Genesis is necessarily literal fact, however. Talking serpents, the various trees mentioned, etc, can all be symbolic for a particular meaning. The important thing is that man disobeyed God, with certain consequences naturally following that affect us greatly to this day. The story serves to explain the existence of moral evil (sin), for one thing.Oh yeah, I know what symbolic mean: it means that God lied to Adam to Eve. Moreover you have no Biblical reference to support your idea which means that what you state is man made to avoid the inconsistency which lies in Bible.
I mentioned that Catholic understanding of evil contradicts with what is written in scripture. Please read the title to know about my claim.You stated that it was against scripture and then admitted there was no scripture
What I was arguing is the conflict between Catholic understanding of evil and what is written in the scripture.I already showed your premise was wrong. Your premise was that it was against scripture. You admitted that there was no scripture. The defenseless position is yours.
Symbolic? What does that even mean? You mean that God lied to Adam and Eve about the properties of the fruit!?You have changed from the op. The problem you are having is that the fruit is symbolic of knowing good from evil. It isn’t saying that the fruit is both good and evil that is your misunderstanding.
Why shouldn’t Bible be completely literal? That puts people in danger of misunderstanding. Moreover I don’t think that the story of the fruit of knowledge is symbolic: Then the LORD God said: “See! The man has become like one of us, knowing what is good and what is bad! Therefore, he must not be allowed to put out his hand to take fruit from the tree of life also, and thus eat of it and live forever.”No, its just that the Church has historically understood many teachings of the bible. You don’t seem to be so naive as to believe that much of the bible isn’t poetic, allegorical, metaphorical, symbolic, etc. Much of it has to be understood in the historical context in which it was written. So, for example, the Church understands that two literal first parents of all humanity, who we call Adam & Eve, existed and literally sinned against God by disobeying Him. Not *all *of the scene depicted in the story of creation and the Fall in Genesis is necessarily literal fact, however. Talking serpents, the various trees mentioned, etc, can all be symbolic for a particular meaning. The important thing is that man disobeyed God, with certain consequences naturally following that affect us greatly to this day. The story serves to explain the existence of moral evil (sin), for one thing.
The disobedience was literal-and is the absolutely most critical point of the story. I’m not sure what difference it makes to you anyway. If you believe the story in any case then why wouldn’t you *trust in God-*as Adam *failed *to do?Why shouldn’t Bible be completely literal? That puts people in danger of misunderstanding. Moreover I don’t think that the story of the fruit of knowledge is symbolic: Then the LORD God said: “See! The man has become like one of us, knowing what is good and what is bad! Therefore, he must not be allowed to put out his hand to take fruit from the tree of life also, and thus eat of it and live forever.”
So you claim without proof. I have read your title. What you haven’t done is substantiated it.I mentioned that Catholic understanding of evil contradicts with what is written in scripture. Please read the title to know about my claim.
You have not substantiated this claim.What I was arguing is the conflict between Catholic understanding of evil and what is written in the scripture.
Did you not read what was written. It is you that has a misunderstanding. The fruit was not good and evil that is your misunderstanding.Symbolic? What does that even mean? You mean that God lied to Adam and Eve about the properties of the fruit!?
It is you who makes the claim it is you who has to back it up. So far you have not done a good job of backing up your claim. There is zilch evidence on your side.Then the LORD God said: "See! The man has become like one of us, knowing what is good and what is bad! Therefore, he must not be allowed to put out his hand to take fruit from the tree of life also, and thus eat of it and live forever
Then the LORD God said: “See! The man has become like one of us, knowing what is good and what is bad! Therefore, he must not be allowed to put out his hand to take fruit from the tree of life also, and thus eat of it and live forever.”The disobedience was literal-and is the absolutely most critical point of the story. I’m not sure what difference it makes to you anyway. If you believe the story in any case then why wouldn’t you *trust in God-*as Adam *failed *to do?
Bible claim that there is a tree with a fruit which grand the knowledge of good and evil. Catholics claim that evil is the absence of good which make the existence of fruit impossible. The fruit cannot be good and evil (absence of good) at the same time.So you claim without proof. I have read your title. What you haven’t done is substantiated it.
There is contradiction which apparently no Catholic has ever noticed. Please read the above comment.
- Catholic understanding contradicts written scripture which you have already admitted there is none.
So please read the first comment.You have not substantiated this claim.
So Church authority judged what is written in the Bible about the fruit is symbolic? What is wrong with the plain truth?Did you not read what was written. It is you that has a misunderstanding. The fruit was not good and evil that is your misunderstanding.
Yeah, in another place it is clearly mention that the fruit gives the knowledge of good and evil.I will post again the scripture. Please take note that the fruit allowed them to know the difference between good and bad.
I just claim that what is written in the Bible about the fruit is literal. You claim that it is symbolic yet you do not provide any evidence that why God should talk in symbolic way in this very position when this could lead to a great misunderstanding. Oh yes, that was a test for Adam and Eve and the main issue was about disobedience! Is there any place in Bible which claims that God wanted to punish them because of disobedience? No. Instead it is clearly mentioned that they gained the knowledge of good and bad.It is you who makes the claim it is you who has to back it up. So far you have not done a good job of backing up your claim. There is zilch evidence on your side.
You actually *doubt *that they disobeyed when they were given a strict command, which they, er, disobeyed? When God told them not to eat of the fruit do you think that, by eating of it, they were obeying?Then the LORD God said: “See! The man has become like one of us, knowing what is good and what is bad! Therefore, he must not be allowed to put out his hand to take fruit from the tree of life also, and thus eat of it and live forever.”
According to the above verse, apparently the reason for Adam and Eve punishment was not disobedience. Adam and Eve just became like them. Why they should be punished when they become like others? By they way where is written in Bible that the reason for Adam and Eve punishment was literally God disobedience?