Timothy Gordon Fired

[aroosi]

I don’t know much about him but I feel bad for him because he is still the main provider of a family with six kids and he definitely needs a job and healthcare for his family. On the other hand I hope what happened will remind everybody (including myself) to use prudence in social media.

 

[Minks]

Newhills:

More Catholic schools need more teachers like Tim Gordon.

Why? Seems like he was playing amateur shock jock. He doesn’t represent the school or the church well. He comes off as juvenile and needlessly abrasive. Defending conservative views does not require acting like a jerk.

But, 1) the people destroying millions of dollars of property in one city—billions across the nation—and beating up people, even killing them, and, 2) people who are not advocating stopping that criminal behavior are not jerks? Hmmmmmm. And those mindsets are role models for Catholics? Hmmmmm.

 

[RolandThompsonGunner]

But, 1) the people destroying millions of dollars of property in one city—billions across the nation—and beating up people, even killing them, and, 2) people who are not advocating stopping that criminal behavior are not jerks? Hmmmmmm. And those mindsets are role models for Catholics? Hmmmmm.

This is a non-sequitir. Two people/groups can be wrong simultaneously. It’s not either/or.

 

[puer.dei]

But, 1) the people destroying millions of dollars of property in one city—billions across the nation—and beating up people, even killing them, and, 2) people who are not advocating stopping that criminal behavior are not jerks? Hmmmmmm. And those mindsets are role models for Catholics? Hmmmmm.

Of course, nobody said that.

 

[HomeschoolDad]

Blueberry:

I want to like this guy, but isn’t Pulp Fiction a disgusting movie? Why quote from it?

It’s not a movie for kids, certainly, but it’s not “disgusting.” It’s classic.

I second that. I commented in another thread here a few days ago on a certain stripe of person — Catholic possibly, but not necessarily — who regards the modern world as evil, and “freezes” their entire lifestyle, including entertainment, at some point prior to when they see this apostasy as having begun. Usually it is sometime between the end of WWII and the cusp of the 1960s. Really, the only movies they can watch are frothy musicals, Westerns, screwball comedies, and classics such as Casablanca. I have known people like this. That is fine, if they want to live that way, but some of us prefer to engage the world as it is, not as it should be.

 

[PatienceAndHumility]

That’s very well put Brother but I would disagree. I think some movies are objectively bad for the soul and scarring.

Using pulp fiction as an example, I watched that years ago but there are still some vivid scenes I can’t unwatch! It’s not so much about disengaging with the world. Rather, having your filters turned up a notch. After all, to be “ok” with many of these such movies, would point to a dulling of conscience. Personally, I have watched many such movies and I do regret it. These days, I can’t bear the thought of watching “classics” like Godfather etc. They simply contain too much danger for the soul. Pax Christi!

 

[Mac]

I listened to the radio interview Tim Gordon gave that you linked in your post. Based on what he said , I find no fault with him at all.

And I find it hard to belive any faithful Catholic could find fault with what he said.

I support him 100% . Shocking that faithfull Catholics are being driven out of our own institutions. Scary actually.

If my kids were enrolled in that School I would pull them out immediately!!!

 

[gracepoole]

He completely ignored his call to vigilante violence in that interview — and then he blamed everyone but the boogeyman for his termination. I don’t know how anyone can take him seriously after that.

 

[Mac]

He never called for vigilante violence. Your falsely atributing that to him .

Also We must have listened to different interviews, in the one I listed to , he clarified he was NOT calling for vigilante violence, and he explicitly condemned vigilante violence.

people can listen and see for themselves.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

I have no idea who this guy is, but if he has 6 kids, one of whom is ill, and a teaching job involving young students, he should be concentrating on that and not on being some sort of violence-promoting social media activist. His tweets also do not show any sort of Christian, let alone Catholic, attitude. Furthermore, I would presume his employment contract requires him to abide by particular social media policies. If he finally gave them the ammo to fire him, good riddance! I’d pull my kid out of school before I’d let them associate with this “teacher”. I’d be afraid of what they’d learn.

And if Taylor Marshall endorses this guy, that’s just another nail in the coffin of Marshall’s credibility.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

So only lefties can talk like that? That sounds fair?

I would expect a “lefty” Catholic elementary school teacher who tweeted this type of “use of force” stuff also to be fired. Do you have an example of a “lefty” Catholic elementary school teacher who makes such posts and has not been fired, for comparison?

 

[Theban]

“He advocated deadly force against someone that basically is committing an act of vandalism. There can be no other interpretation.”

Umm, what? He didn’t say “deadly force”, and he didn’t say that this should be a response to just vandalism (I think he would be more concerned with the arson and murders). Sounds to me like they are picking the worst possible interpretation.

Also, why is it a thing these days to fire people based on what they do on their own time? If the school is worried about how he influences the children, why not make an inquiry to see if he has acted out of line around them? If he has, then that would be grounds to fire him, but if he takes care to act according to the schools guidelines then it doesn’t seem fair to fire him for something he has done outside of the workplace.

 

[gracepoole]

He never called for vigilante violence. Your falsely atributing that to him .

Also We must have listened to different interviews, in the one I listed to , he clarified he was NOT calling for vigilante violence, and he explicitly condemned vigilante violence.

people can listen and see for themselves.

It’s nice that he distanced himself from the remark in his interview – but he did tweet this:

Let’s dispatch some mobs with force!

There is no reason for the school to disbelief the genuineness of this kind of remark. That, along with the disparaging comments he’s made about homosexuals + his comments during podcasts about Muslims would be more than enough for me to fire him were I in charge of a Catholic school. He understands the basics of Catholic teaching – except charity, which he’s completely lacking.

 

[gracepoole]

gracepoole:

“He advocated deadly force against someone that basically is committing an act of vandalism. There can be no other interpretation.”

Umm, what? He didn’t say “deadly force”

I doubt it matters whether he was championing deadly force, specifically. He championed mob rule.

Also, why is it a thing these days to fire people based on what they do on their own time? If the school is worried about how he influences the children, why not make an inquiry to see if he has acted out of line around them? If he has, then that would be grounds to fire him, but if he takes care to act according to the schools guidelines then it doesn’t seem fair to fire him for something he has done outside of the workplace.

Respectfully, this is an incredibly naive reading of reality. Teachers are normally bound by clauses impacting what they do outside of school because their actions reflect on the school. His mistake was thinking that parents and administrators at a private Catholic school wouldn’t care about his many inflammatory remarks.

 

[Theban]

Teachers are normally bound by clauses impacting what they do outside of school because their actions reflect on the school.

I must disagree. If the worst thing they could dig up on Tim Gordon is a couple of tweets, regardless of how bad they may seem, I don’t think it’s right to fire him. Either find something real, or let him be.

 

[gracepoole]

gracepoole:

Teachers are normally bound by clauses impacting what they do outside of school because their actions reflect on the school.

I must disagree. If the worst thing they could dig up on Tim Gordon is a couple of tweets, regardless of how bad they may seem, I don’t think it’s right to fire him. Either find something real, or let him be.

I’m trying to explain to you that your view of what should be isn’t aligned with what is. I know elementary teachers who aren’t allowed to drink in public bars. And I know of virtually no job where one’s comments on social media have no impact on one’s job.

And frankly, he should have been fired from a Catholic institution because he does not reflect Catholic teaching on charity – in fact, he openly opposes it. His tweets are “something real” – they’re public comments he made mocking homosexuals and clergy, and calling for mob violence.

 

[Theban]

I know I’m not going to change your mind, but let me just ask you this; where do you draw the line? If a rude tweet or comment is grounds for firing someone, what unfortunate actions isn’t? Are we to require everyone to be a living saint just to make a livelihood?

 

[gracepoole]

I know I’m not going to change your mind, but let me just ask you this; where do you draw the line? If a rude tweet or comment is grounds for firing someone, what unfortunate actions isn’t? Are we to require everyone to be a living saint just to make a livelihood?

Should a Catholic school have the right to fire an employee who is not publicly displaying Catholic – or even Christian – charity? Should it have the right to fire an employee who calls for mob violence? You’re dismissing these problems as minor, trivial. I submit that they aren’t minor or trivial at all. They’re quite serious.

 

[PatienceAndHumility]

In the age of the internet, a Tweet is akin to screaming in the public square your personal views. When you hold certain posts, you represent an institution. Particularly if your post/career is in the public sphere. As such, for a Catholic High School teacher to use his Twitter account prudently, is a very rational and reasonable requirement.

Justice and Courage are indeed two Cardinal virtues but without the theological virtue of Charity, the foundations are compromised. Pax Christi!

 

[Theban]

You’re dismissing these problems as minor, trivial. I submit that they aren’t minor or trivial at all. They’re quite serious.

Perhaps this is the disagreement, then. I think that what he does on his own time should not be the standard for how he is judged by his employer. If he is a good teacher and he doesn’t stir up his students to do violence or be uncharitable, then yes, I do think it is irrelevant if he does those things (or seems to do them) elsewhere.

When you hold certain posts, you represent an institution.

Only if this is specified. Gordon says that his termination was a violation of his contract, so it seems he has not agreed to censor his views in public in order to work at that school. Nor do I think, from what I have heard of him, that he would have agreed to such a post.