Top 10 reasons women should dress modestly

[Edward_H]

At least that judgment is based on something more solid than how much skin you show or what color your shirt is.

You’re judging. I can’t believe you’re passing judgement. Of all people.

 

[Edward_H]

. I have no questions.

or answers

 

[severus68]

Not so much. This is akin to protestants taking verses from the Bible out of context and accusing Catholics of disobeying Christ by calling priests “father”.

Please leave the Protestants out of it. You take one thing said by some Protestants and its every Protestant.

 

[Debora123]

Please pay attention to your own quote. “Opinions”! Why quote Wiki?

Exactly. and these opinions have changed based on what was appropriate at the time. An opinion from a pope from the 1800 would differ from that of a pope from the 1400 which would differ from the opinions of a pope from the 21st century.

this is exactly why the church teaches that the standards of modesty are relative.

 

[Debora123]

or answers

Answers to what? I’m quite certain i have refuted every point you have made in the discussions between you and I.

Although I have noticed that you have said nothing about a long post I wrote as a reply to you a few pages back.

 

[Debora123]

or answers

Way to straw man btw

do you not have anything to say about the points I actually made?

here they are in case you’ve missed them:

Originally Posted by Edward H View Post
And in our culture - unlike some - not all - tribes in Africa - women don’t bare breasts.
I know this. That’s my point.

That in THIS culture, yes, it would be wrong to bear breasts in public. But in theirs, it is not. Hence the cultural factor.
Quote:

Your “culture is all” argument is childish, and it’s relativist. By this I mean it’s not testable.

That’s exactly what modesty of dress is. It’s all relative. Why do you think the church purposely didn’t put set standards and restrictions to dress by? What would have been considered scandalous centuries ago, ankles, are not considered scandalous anymore. When it comes to modesty, it IS relevant. That’s why the catechism specifically says modesty varies from one culture to another:

Section 2524 - The forms taken by modesty vary from one culture to another.

 

[Edward_H]

Answers to what? I’m quite certain i have refuted every point you have made in the discussions between you and I.

Although I have noticed that you have said nothing about a long post I wrote as a reply to you a few pages back.

Boiled down, it said nothing. Lots of words and emotion and opining. Nothing substantial.

 

[Edward_H]

Way to straw man btw

do you not have anything to say about the points I actually made?

here they are in case you’ve missed them:

Exactly as I said. Nothing of any substance.

 

[severus68]

So your charity is limited to “an obviously insane person”

You don’t extend generosity to a person
who is sleepy, who shows laziness,
who has just had a bad day,
who can’t seem to control their eating,
whose father just died and now is not working hard at work,
who just had a miscarriage,
who had a hard upbringing
who is from an underprivileged environment.

You hold each to the same level of “no excuses” standards…despite their weaknesses and stumblings.

Or maybe not…maybe you accommodate each of these examples, but you’ve picked out men who haven’t yet controlled their eyeballing.

Is that the case…this is the one exception. If so, you need to examine your thinking more rigorously, because you’re not living in the full truth.

And apparently not struggling to figure out why.

Yes quote me out of context not as responding specifically to what you said. I have read your posts and see that you do not partake in a discussion, you do not give consideration to any other view and just repeat your views and quotes and you put down anyone who does not agree with you.

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

You really make a living writing?

“Your capacity…to make comparisons shows itself” ?

Is that really the best way to phrase your point?

Oh I have plenty more ways. I’m just tired of wasting my talent on people who can’t put two and two together.

Let’s see, you compare the chastising of perverts to abandoning people in an accident. Suffice it to say, you might as well equate a mushroom to a t-bone steak.

You’re judging. I can’t believe you’re passing judgement. Of all people.

Wow, all this time you still haven’t gotten it into your head?
I am not criticizing the act of judging.

I am criticizing the act of judging by appearances.

It’s quite clear that, by pulling the typical Defensive Judge tactic in reaction to all criticisms on any sort of judgment, you really are a lot less intellectual than what you’ve been impressing yourself to be.

 

[Edward_H]

Yes quote me out of context not as responding specifically to what you said. I have read your posts and see that you do not partake in a discussion, you do not give consideration to any other view and just repeat your views and quotes and you put down anyone who does not agree with you.

No I reject dismissive drive by postings that haven’t followed the whole thread here. Go way back and catchup.

 

[Debora123]

Boiled down, it said nothing. Lots of words and emotion and opining. Nothing substantial.

Nothing sbstantial about this? (see below)

The things is, Wanderer and Walking don’t think that following a strict standard of dress constitutes as “helping,” because it does nothing to get to the root of a man’s problem, and everything to just mask it.

Wanderer said so himself a few pages back that the charitable thing to do would be to teach these men about human dignity, and to respect everyone regardless of what they wear or look like.

Take the muslim religion for example. A lot of their women cover themselves from head to foot - literally. On some of them, not even the hair on their heads is exposed… not even the eyes!

…And all this in the name of “helping men not lust.” As Catholics, are we really that far off when we use this same mentality and tell women they cannot wear 2 piece bathing suits to the beach and they cannot wear shorts on a hot day? Because it really IS the exact same mentality.

What does it accomplish? Does it make those men stronger? More pure? If so, HOW??

How does this help them learn to keep their hormones in check and become pure of heart?

We live in a society where porn is everywhere. If men are coddled and don’t learn to fight through temptations and respect women from all walks of life, do you really think they’ll have the strength to say no to free internet porn in the convenience of their own homes?

With that being said, yes, of course I think that men who have serious struggles should seek help and be received with open arms. But the RIGHT type of help. Help that is aimed at purifying the HEART by examining themselves… examining and fixing the root of the problem.

Not “help” by making the rest of the world conform by removing from the general public all triggers of someone else’s temptations.

I think I use pretty good logic there. Why is nothing substantial? Can you break down the points I made and tell me why they aren’t substantial, or why they are false?

thanks

 

[Edward_H]

Oh I have plenty more ways. I’m just tired of wasting my talent on people who can’t put two and two together.

Let’s see, you compare the chastising of perverts to abandoning people in an accident. Suffice it to say, you might as well equate a mushroom to a t-bone steak.

Wow, all this time you still haven’t gotten it into your head?
I am not criticizing the act of judging.

I am criticizing the act of judging by appearances.

It’s quite clear that, by pulling the typical Defensive Judge tactic in reaction to all criticisms on any sort of judgment, you really are a lot less intellectual than what you’ve been impressing yourself to be.

Lots of talent being wasted here. Agree.

You’re a perfect relativist. You reject judgement except your own. You’re absolutely certain that things are relative. !!

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

Yes quote me out of context not as responding specifically to what you said. I have read your posts and see that you do not partake in a discussion, you do not give consideration to any other view and just repeat your views and quotes and you put down anyone who does not agree with you.

Honestly, this guy is all bark and no bite. He claims to be an expert yet can’t even deal with our main point which is to never judge people by their looks. Instead, all he does is go on some obscure reference to solidarity and presents ludicrous comparisons that place perverts in the same helpless league as beggars and car accident victims.

 

[Edward_H]

Nothing sbstantial about this? (see below)

I think I use pretty good logic there. Why is nothing substantial? Can you break down the points I made and tell me why they aren’t substantial, or why they are false?

thanks

Run-on thinking.

 

[Walking_Home]

Quote=Walking_Home]
You need to quit passing the buck and work on yourself.

You’re judging.​

More likely - rubbing off --by reading all the posts from the “religious modesty fanatics”.

 

[Debora123]

Exactly as I said. Nothing of any substance.

Nothing of any substance here, Edward?

Originally Posted by Edward H

And in our culture - unlike some - not all - tribes in Africa - women don’t bare breasts.

I know this. That’s my point.
That in THIS culture, yes, it would be wrong to bear breasts in public. But in theirs, it is not. Hence the cultural factor.

Your “culture is all” argument is childish, and it’s relativist. By this I mean it’s not testable.

That’s exactly what modesty of dress is. It’s all relative. Why do you think the church purposely didn’t put set standards and restrictions to dress by? What would have been considered scandalous centuries ago, ankles, are not considered scandalous anymore. When it comes to modesty, it IS relevant. That’s why the catechism specifically says modesty varies from one culture to another:

Section 2524 - The forms taken by modesty vary from one culture to another.

And why not any substance here? Was it wrong when i said this?: “In THIS culture, yes, it would be wrong to bear breasts in public. But in theirs, it is not. Hence the cultural factor.”

What about when I used the catechism to back up my claim that modesty is culturally driven? “The forms taken by modesty vary from one culture to another.”

Why no substance there? do you believe the catechism to be in error here? or maybe you think it is a misinterpretation?

 

[Edward_H]

Honestly, this guy is all bark and no bite. He claims to be an expert yet can’t even deal with our main point which is to never judge people by their looks. Instead, all he does is go on some obscure reference to solidarity and presents ludicrous comparisons that place perverts in the same helpless league as beggars and car accident victims.

I AM guilty of putting all humans in the sinner category, some struggle with it, some don’t. Some help others struggle, some have favorite unforgivable offensives they hold dear to. I always wonder about such people.

If we don’t admit that we are all wretched sinners…we’re wretched liars.

If we don’t help others struggle, we’re not living a generous life in Christ.

 

[Debora123]

Lots of talent being wasted here. Agree.

You’re a perfect relativist. You reject judgement except your own. You’re absolutely certain that things are relative. !!

yes, modesty of dress is relative.

 

[Edward_H]

Nothing of any substance here, Edward?

And why not any substance here? Was it wrong when i said this?: “In THIS culture, yes, it would be wrong to bear breasts in public. But in theirs, it is not. Hence the cultural factor.”

What about when I used the catechism to back up my claim that modesty is culturally driven? “The forms taken by modesty vary from one culture to another.”

Why no substance there? do you believe the catechism to be in error here? or maybe you think it is a misinterpretation?

If you’re not going to go back to the beginning of this thread, and really get a gist for what I’ve laid out here…I am not going to walk back up the gutter and sort out your run on thoughts.